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Crowdfunding: Kickstarter» Forums » General

Subject: Sugar & Spice - A new cooking game on Kickstarter rss

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Trace
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a link?
 
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Matt Wolfe
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So you roll a die to move around a square board, randomly receive goods depending on what space you land on, resolve a random event depending on what event space you land on, and trade ingredient cards with other players.

How is this game significantly different from Monopoly?
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A. B. West
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The art is much better and there's no auction.
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Matt Wolfe
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decobot wrote:
mattwolfe wrote:
So you roll a die to move around a square board, randomly receive goods depending on what space you land on, resolve a random event depending on what event space you land on, and trade ingredient cards with other players.

How is this game significantly different from Monopoly?


If random elements is such a dealbreaker, then what about Magic the gathering where you randomly randomize the cards so that they're in a random order, or Catan where you roll a random number with a random chance to land on any random number.

I post my projects on this website at the request of the community. It meant for healthy discussion and exposure to those who may be interested. However, if this is gonna be another troll cave like the thousands of lesser forums out there, then we don't need to be here.

If anyone would like to ask any real questions or discuss the game. Hit us up on http://facebook.com/decobot or http://twitter.com/decobotco instead. Thanks.


I never said random elements are a dealbreaker. But a random game where there's very little strategy is not something that I'm interested in and probably the majority of people who frequent this website are not interested in.

You never answered the question: How is this game significantly different than Monopoly? In other words, why would someone back this game if they already have Monopoly?

If you think I'm trolling you, you need to develop some thicker skin, especially if you want to be a game publisher. I'm asking a legitimate question that I'd like an answer to. If I were trolling I could be way more mean.
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Rocco Privetera
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decobot wrote:


I post my projects on this website at the request of the community. It meant for healthy discussion and exposure to those who may be interested. However, if this is gonna be another troll cave like the thousands of lesser forums out there, then we don't need to be here.

If anyone would like to ask any real questions or discuss the game. Hit us up on http://facebook.com/decobot or http://twitter.com/decobotco instead. Thanks.


This is pretty healthy and non-trollish discussion. We're just asking questions without hurtful rhetoric, snarking, name-calling, etc. If instead of healthy discussion what you meant was "starry-eyed softball questions" then yeah, elsewhere.

I'm a designer with a published game who answers questions, and when someone says "your game looks like every other push-your-luck dice game, like Zombie dice" instead of getting surly I just point out the differences. It works pretty well.
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Matt Wolfe
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decobot wrote:
mattwolfe wrote:
I never said random elements are a dealbreaker. But a random game where there's very little strategy is not something that I'm interested in and probably the majority of people who frequent this website are not interested in.

You never answered the question: How is this game significantly different than Monopoly? In other words, why would someone back this game if they already have Monopoly?

If you think I'm trolling you, you need to develop some thicker skin, especially if you want to be a game publisher. I'm asking a legitimate question that I'd like an answer to. If I were trolling I could be way more mean.


It has nothing to with being hurt or needing thick skin. We're running a campaign that will define the next few years of our company. There is a lot of pressure, and we simply want to make sure that we are reaching out to the places that will help us out the most.

I'm sorry, but your "question" did not seem legitimate. Spend 10 seconds on our website or KS page and you will instantly see how its different than monopoly. It just didn't seem like a real question and, you have to admit, came off a bit facetious.


No, I don't have to admit that. And I'm a bit taken aback by your attitude. Putting "question" in quotes as a way of belittling my genuine question? Because you are a publisher, I think you need to be a little more careful with your communication so you don't alienate people.

For the record, I did spend 10 seconds on your project page. Much more than 10 seconds. I evaluated it and, to my eyes, I just don't see much strategy to this game, which is why I asked my question. You're absolutely correct that it's not a game for me.

Good luck with your campaign.
 
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mike
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I won't go into questions about comparisons to monopoly, but here is some constructive feedback on the kickstarter project page, your profile page, website, etc

Just my 5 cents, but I have been following the industry for years, been on kickstarter since 2011, backed over 140 projects covering all the major categories, and seen my share of awesome projects that succeeded and many that have gone down in flames.

Video, I won't comment on because I have never based a decision to back or not on a video and rarely watch them, so I am not your target audience for videos

"In Sugar & Spice you explore the game board looking for ingredients to prepare 3 recipes; an appetizer, entrée, and dessert." I'd move this under the about the game section, because there really isn't anything attention grabbing about it to have as an intro statement


About the game

2-6 players but what is the recommended?
Family is too general, what's the target age range?

It's fine that if it's a family game, but some more detail such as ideal for 2-4 players or we have rules for 2 players, 2-4 players, 2-6 players or a solo rules variety or any advanced rules

So based on the link on How to Play, the primary mechanic is roll and move and color matching correct?

Is the one graphic the extent of the rules?

This would be a good spot to go into the details of the components, I know you have the list, but If you have 200 ingredient cards, what are some of the ingredients? What are some of the recipes?

Are any more complex that others to complete?

What are some of the event cards?

This is a good place to highlight the card graphics and variety

Right now it looks like stock components for the most part, nothing is really standing out

Pledge Levels
$25 and $25 is certainly reasonable for this type of game

$1000 to be in the game, seems a bit high

If there are not characters in the game currently and they are not a key component to the game play, then this simply seems pasted on
And contributors to the rule book is pretty much standard at any pledge level. That doesn't really need a special pledge level.

Reviews??

Where are the reviews?
Podcast discussions about the game, campaign, company?


Website
http://decobot.co/about/

Needs updated
"Legends is currently in its final stages of production and is slated to be released in Summer 2013. The game will be available on sale on this site, as well as a few other sites around the interwebs. We will also be touring the U.S. west coast in a series of annual events and conventions"

It's 2014 so this has passed, if it was delivered this needs updated

If you are touring link to an event calendar


Twitter
Pretty low activity for an active campaign, you hardly have any followers on this page and you should be following everyone related to the tabletop game industry

Tweet Reach
Not good

http://tweetreach.com/reports/11043721


Kicktraq
You're trending well below your goal
http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/decobot/sugar-and-spice-a-c...


Facebook
147 likes on the page, fairly low, and I know likes don't always = pledges

But are you active on any of the game and kickstarter groups promoting the game?

How about Google+?

Linkedin?
Company page or in the game industry groups?

Tumblr, youtube, instagram?

Where is the share this widget on your website?

Links to all your social media accounts should not be buried on your pages, then need to be front and center and one of the first things people see when they go to your site

If I have to do a google search to find your other social media accounts then you've already lost the battle.

You have to make it as easy as possible for people to share info on your games and active kickstarter projects

Last but not least here on BGG
You're not active on the site ever and when you are looking for support from the community this is a problem

Have you put either of your games in the database?

This would do two things, 1 people would be able to search for your game, but you could then get the game designer moniker for your profile





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The Chaz
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Ali,
Many of us are so used to solicitations for advice on failing/underfunded KS campaigns that we instinctively offer advice when none is asked for!

Not that I'm the best one to ask about knocking a KS out of the park, but I did have a few thoughts...

1) if the "sugar/nuts" comment on the page is anything close to what my sleep-deprived mind thinks it is, that should be removed immediately.

2) the part under "Rewards" about managing demand... That just seems off. Maybe it's just a poor verb choice, but it has me raising an eyebrow for sure.

3) What decisions does a player typically make in the course of a game?

 
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The Chaz
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Yeah, sometimes you can't avoid drama. whistle

Regardless of their delivery, I would recommend addressing some of the gameplay questions in a little more depth (specifically any/all that relate to Monopoly - perceived similarities are huge red flags to many of us).

Here is where I think the decisions lie in the game.
1) You have some objects that don't match the set(s) you are going for, so you trade with other players. When/if/with whom to trade is your choice.
2) You get an action card that can screw with someone else. Your choice is when/if/who to screw with.

If that is correct, then I am concerned for the game. And since I obviously believe that I am correct, I am concerned for the game. My concern has prompted some questions, and here we are.

So again - would you be willing to discuss some of the decisions in the game play? I could probably take a look at the rule book and deduce some of it myself, if you'd prefer!
 
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Gary Cooper
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decobot wrote:

I post my projects on this website at the request of the community.
Who the f*** sent you got a gollram invite?

decobot wrote:
However, if this is gonna be another troll cave like the thousands of lesser forums out there, then we don't need to be here.
You are doing a KS boardgame and you don't need to be here? Yet here you are. Whaaaaat?

decobot wrote:
If anyone would like to ask any real questions or discuss the game. Hit us up on http://ragetoons.com/tag/troll/ or http://ragetoons.com/tag/troll/ instead.
Lessee, registered 2 years. 0 games listed as owned. 2 forum threads started both for you own games. 0 posts in other than those for your own games. 0 Geekbuddies. 0 Geekgold either purchased or given or received. 0 reviews. 0 videos. 0 images. 0 guilds. 0 thumbs given.

0 ....everything pretty much.

Yup it seems like you have no desire for participation in this "community". Hows that for trolling? arrrh

ps. Am I the only one who noticed the similarity between

and
 
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Jacq L
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Eh, it's a little tv-faced chibi. I'm not bothered by that.

When this thread was first posted, I checked out the Sugar & Spice project page and gave it a pass. It didn't seem like a game for me because I don't have children and it's not my own bag (based on the complexity of gameplay/decision making, or perceived lack thereof).

Your reaction to criticism left me with a much more negative impression than your game did.

I get it. You weren't actually asking for feedback. You were using the site to drop a link and were soliciting "questions", not criticism. Unfortunately, the way BGG is set up ALL Kickstarter discussion goes into this guild forum. So every thread is treated as a catch-all for comments/opinions/advice/etc, solicited or not.
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mike
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Welcome to the reality of the tabletop game industry. I think you’ll find not only new designers are in the same boat ,but established ones as well. Everyone is working another full time job(s), maybe even a part time job like teaching or military service, going to school, many have families, etc. That’s the norm. Very few people are doing this full time, so you just have to figure out your schedule when it comes time to promotions on social media, local promotions, going to conventions, etc. There really is no such thing as free time from this point forward.

That’s just how the industry operates. It can takes years for a designer turned publisher to make any profit, let alone make enough where they could just do that full time.

There was a great post by the owner of Smirk and Dagger games, that was posted in the design forum a year or so ago and he said it took them nearly a decade even after publishing several titles where they could just focus on publishing and selling games full time.

So if finding time now during the Kickstarter campaign is a challenge it’s not going to get any easier, even once you are doing this full time, it’s not a normal schedule.

I’d take some time to talk to some of the publishers who are doing this full time. James Mathe is a good example he owns Minion Games, but he also owns several retail stores and travels around to the conventions. He’s been around the industry awhile and regularly blogs on the industry, Crowdfunding, publishing and the amount of work it really takes

Phillip Kilcrease, would be another good person to talk to, he operates 5th Street games and they have been a regular publisher using Kickstarter, and I believe they got their start that way.

Steve Woods, who is the designer/publisher of Gunship First strike can certainly tell you all about the challenges of balancing work and then trying to pursue publishing full time

My point is everyone has their challenges and sure right now this may indeed be a side project, but if it’s something your group is interested in pursuing publishing full time, then expect to spend many an evening, late night and weekend working to promote the projects, the games and the company
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Mindy Basi
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I was initially attracted to this thread because of the game name. I am a big foodie person, and like food-based games.

"Sugar and Spice" sounds like a dessert to me, not a three course meal. So that was the first thing I had to wrap my head around.

Also a salad isn't an appetizer, it's the salad course, although I am being nit-picky about that, and it can be an appetizer. To me appetizers are like chicken wings, or tiny dishes of savory foods ... but I digress. Maybe a salad is just one of your appetizers, so ok.

Then there was the "baconize" game element, which you emphasize a lot with tshirts and bracelets. To me, sugar and spice has nothing at all to do with bacon. Shouldn't you have called the game Baconize? Chef's Challenge? Because that would attract more adults than "sugar and spice." The art is very nice and well done for a cute game, I will give you that, but it definitely has a young person vibe to it. Hopefully that's what you were going for.

Also, what is the deal with the robot? What does he have to do with food? Why is a robot a character?

I think there are a lot of elements here which are great, but don't come together as a cohesive story. That's my impression.

As to gameplay, looks very luck based/low strategy. Not really something I want to buy at the present time, but for children maybe it's appealing.
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Sturv Tafvherd
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I agree with some of what has been said thus far, but most of what I might have said is covered by this:

Kwill2 wrote:

I think there are a lot of elements here which are great, but don't come together as a cohesive story. That's my impression.


I think the intro video was pretty well done. But if you started trying to make sense of the theme, the art, and the gameplay shown there, you realize you've still got more questions than answers.

Which led me to looking at the rulesheet that was tucked away in the updates page. And looking at the comments to look for further answers.

The fact that you promised a playthrough video on 6/20 and haven't posted it yet (at least, not where I could find it) actually disappointed me for some strange reason.


So I started looking at the main KS page again... somehow got annoyed that the first thing I see after the intro video is the limited 7-day offer for the plush toy and t-shirt. It's probably a personal pet peeve ... I get turned off when I see non-game items like that ... as if you're making me pay to do your advertising for you.

And at that point I realized how petty my reactions were, so I started trying to be more objective. Which pretty much meant I ignore all the cutesy art and fluff on the page and just look at :

-- the funding goal... is it reasonable? 10k sounds good.

-- the backer levels ... what do I pay to get the game? $25 sounds fair ... but that's early bird. The regular price is $35. That's about 40% more... it's not a bad price, mind you, but when compared to the early bird, it got me thinking why that would be so much higher.

-- and the kick traq, since that gives me an indication of whether this will be a reality or not. it's at 44% funded right now, and halfway through the campaign ... which doesn't sound bad.... but then ...
..... I've gotten used to seeing KS campaigns get to 75-80% funded before or at the halfway mark
..... you hit 35% at the 4 day mark (which is good), but pretty much leveled off since then (which is bad)

..... and then I realized that the 4 day mark is pretty much when the early bird price ended. And that validated the feeling I had that $35 is not as popular a price point for this game as $25 is.


Strange, isn't it? But that's the train of thought that led me to decide not to pledge.
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Sturv Tafvherd
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Quote:
Update #6 Jul 4 2014
Shifting the Tides
3 comments Like 4 likes
Hey everyone!

We have 11 days left in our campaign and have raised 44% of our goal. The end of the campaign is fast approaching, and at our current rate, there is a chance that we may not reach out goal. With Kickstarter, if we don’t hit our goal, no one is charged, which sadly means we can make the game or send you your awesome rewards.

At this point, we need to make sure that we get funded. In an effort to shift the tides, we have permanently re-opened the $25 reward tier. We hope that this will make the project more appealing to more people.....


Good move. hopefully that helps. You're going to want to get the word out, cuz people might think it is still at the $35 level.
 
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