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Dungeon Lords: Happy Anniversary» Forums » General

Subject: Steep Price! rss

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Thomas Lang
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This is very tempting but extremely expensive. The big box is nice and all but is it really worth it? And furthermore what about the VAT for European backers? You can't tell me that's not hidden shipping costs, I've backed a couple of games and other distributors seem to be able to ship inside of Europe without such a huge amount of extra costs.
At the moment Dungeon Lords + Expansion would set me back 50 €. That's 20 bucks cheaper than the Anniversary Edition.

Quite unhappy because of this because I'd really like to give this a go.
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Paul Grogan
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I can certainly try and help you understand the VAT costs, as it's been detailed already.

And I can indeed tell you that it isn't hidden shipping costs. All companies in the EU who are VAT registered who ship from EU to another country in EU have to charge VAT. But most of them don't say it on their KS page. They will say "€32 + €8 shipping" or something like that. Some even give one complete price which includes shipping. It also includes VAT, but they don't say this (which is ok)

However, they are still having to charge VAT on that, they are just not showing it. If they did it would be something like "€29 + €4.50 shipping + €6.50 VAT" which looks awfully complicated.

I've spent a week trying to understand this myself, since I was confused, but after speaking to other companies who are using KS and my personal tax advisor and fully qualified accountant partner (quality time together apparently) and it all seems correct.

I also understand that if shipping from the UK, it is even worse, because UK companies have to charge 20% VAT even if it is going outside of the EU.
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Thomas Lang
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PaulGrogan wrote:
I can certainly try and help you understand the VAT costs, as it's been detailed already.

And I can indeed tell you that it isn't hidden shipping costs. All companies in the EU who are VAT registered who ship from EU to another country in EU have to charge VAT. But most of them don't say it on their KS page. They will say "€32 + €8 shipping" or something like that. Some even give one complete price which includes shipping. It also includes VAT, but they don't say this (which is ok)

However, they are still having to charge VAT on that, they are just not showing it. If they did it would be something like "€29 + €4.50 shipping + €6.50 VAT" which looks awfully complicated.

I've spent a week trying to understand this myself, since I was confused, but after speaking to other companies who are using KS and my personal tax advisor and fully qualified accountant partner (quality time together apparently) and it all seems correct.

I also understand that if shipping from the UK, it is even worse, because UK companies have to charge 20% VAT even if it is going outside of the EU.


Thanks for your input, I already expected an answer like that and of course it's possible that others are just hiding the VAT, but that doesn't change the fact of the matter, it's awefully expensive. Just take e.g. the Fresco Big Box which has lots of content but still it's 68$ everything included. Oh well, I can't really criticize their pricing policy it just doesn't really seem justified to me, which is a shame because I really am quite interested in that kickstarter.
 
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Jonathan Harrison
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PaulGrogan wrote:
[I]f shipping from the UK, it is even worse, because UK companies have to charge 20% VAT even if it is going outside of the EU.

What? That’s ... just ...

Geez. They sure know how to get their pound of flesh.

shake

HaHA!
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Thomas Lang
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HuginnGreiling wrote:
PaulGrogan wrote:
[I]f shipping from the UK, it is even worse, because UK companies have to charge 20% VAT even if it is going outside of the EU.

What? That’s ... just ...

Geez. They sure know how to get their pound of flesh.

shake

HaHA!


That's what I'm saying. It really seems to be a lot.
 
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Manuel Ingeland
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Add me to the list of disappointed DL + expansion owners.
 
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Thomas Lang
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magneheeli wrote:
Add me to the list of disappointed DL + expansion owners.


Why would you be disappointed? You've already got the game
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Junkfoot wrote:
HuginnGreiling wrote:
PaulGrogan wrote:
[I]f shipping from the UK, it is even worse, because UK companies have to charge 20% VAT even if it is going outside of the EU.

What? That’s ... just ...

Geez. They sure know how to get their pound of flesh.

shake

HaHA!

That's what I'm saying. It really seems to be a lot.

No, I’m saying the UK, not CGE.
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Manuel Ingeland
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Junkfoot wrote:
magneheeli wrote:
Add me to the list of disappointed DL + expansion owners.


Why would you be disappointed? You've already got the game


Disappointed about the steep addons...what else?

Well, yes, the stretchies are...ehm...lame.
 
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Michael Shuck
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Just can't do it at this price.
I do wish them the best on their Kickstarter.
 
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Ryan Thompson

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Junkfoot wrote:
This is very tempting but extremely expensive. The big box is nice and all but is it really worth it? And furthermore what about the VAT for European backers? You can't tell me that's not hidden shipping costs, I've backed a couple of games and other distributors seem to be able to ship inside of Europe without such a huge amount of extra costs.
At the moment Dungeon Lords + Expansion would set me back 50 €. That's 20 bucks cheaper than the Anniversary Edition.

Quite unhappy because of this because I'd really like to give this a go.


Why kickstart? It isn't a limited edition, it will be released at retail by the end of the year, and bonus and online retailer will have it at a discount. Save your money and buy later for less.
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Thomas Lang
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Kassanova wrote:
Junkfoot wrote:
This is very tempting but extremely expensive. The big box is nice and all but is it really worth it? And furthermore what about the VAT for European backers? You can't tell me that's not hidden shipping costs, I've backed a couple of games and other distributors seem to be able to ship inside of Europe without such a huge amount of extra costs.
At the moment Dungeon Lords + Expansion would set me back 50 €. That's 20 bucks cheaper than the Anniversary Edition.

Quite unhappy because of this because I'd really like to give this a go.


Why kickstart? It isn't a limited edition, it will be released at retail by the end of the year, and bonus and online retailer will have it at a discount. Save your money and buy later for less.


You're probably right, it would have been nice to get the whole package together with Dungeon Petz and its addon, but there is discernible discount involved what.so.ever... it's ridiculous. And the whole VAT discussion has to be the lamest argumentation I've heard of lately. Why are only they doing it? And why can't they keep up "normal prices? They're already over the top without the stupid VAT. Just leaving that out like everybody else wasn't an option either? Even though it might have generated less questions? Just don't understand.
 
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N. P. P.
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Yeah, I just saw this and was really excited for a minute, because I have wanted to add Dungeon Lords to my collection for some time now. I guess I'll wait for the regular release and hope for a decent discount.
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Thomas Lang
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Skippy668 wrote:
Yeah, I just saw this and was really excited for a minute, because I have wanted to add Dungeon Lords to my collection for some time now. I guess I'll wait for the regular release and hope for a decent discount.


Which would be a veritable slap in all the backers' faces... well, they'll see how it turns out. Apparently there are enough folks to back this
 
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Ryan Thompson

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Junkfoot wrote:
Kassanova wrote:
Junkfoot wrote:
This is very tempting but extremely expensive. The big box is nice and all but is it really worth it? And furthermore what about the VAT for European backers? You can't tell me that's not hidden shipping costs, I've backed a couple of games and other distributors seem to be able to ship inside of Europe without such a huge amount of extra costs.
At the moment Dungeon Lords + Expansion would set me back 50 €. That's 20 bucks cheaper than the Anniversary Edition.

Quite unhappy because of this because I'd really like to give this a go.


Why kickstart? It isn't a limited edition, it will be released at retail by the end of the year, and bonus and online retailer will have it at a discount. Save your money and buy later for less.


You're probably right, it would have been nice to get the whole package together with Dungeon Petz and its addon, but there is discernible discount involved what.so.ever... it's ridiculous. And the whole VAT discussion has to be the lamest argumentation I've heard of lately. Why are only they doing it? And why can't they keep up "normal prices? They're already over the top without the stupid VAT. Just leaving that out like everybody else wasn't an option either? Even though it might have generated less questions? Just don't understand.


The problem is this kickstarter is from Mr. B games a company in the US. I bet if you wait for the inevitable retail release at the end of the year you can buy it in Europe without paying VAT.
 
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Duncan Idaho
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Junkfoot wrote:
the whole package together with Dungeon Petz and its addon,


Oh man, I'd be all over a special edition Dungeon Double Pack.
 
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Thomas Lang
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Kassanova wrote:
Junkfoot wrote:
Kassanova wrote:
Junkfoot wrote:
This is very tempting but extremely expensive. The big box is nice and all but is it really worth it? And furthermore what about the VAT for European backers? You can't tell me that's not hidden shipping costs, I've backed a couple of games and other distributors seem to be able to ship inside of Europe without such a huge amount of extra costs.
At the moment Dungeon Lords + Expansion would set me back 50 €. That's 20 bucks cheaper than the Anniversary Edition.

Quite unhappy because of this because I'd really like to give this a go.


Why kickstart? It isn't a limited edition, it will be released at retail by the end of the year, and bonus and online retailer will have it at a discount. Save your money and buy later for less.


You're probably right, it would have been nice to get the whole package together with Dungeon Petz and its addon, but there is discernible discount involved what.so.ever... it's ridiculous. And the whole VAT discussion has to be the lamest argumentation I've heard of lately. Why are only they doing it? And why can't they keep up "normal prices? They're already over the top without the stupid VAT. Just leaving that out like everybody else wasn't an option either? Even though it might have generated less questions? Just don't understand.


The problem is this kickstarter is from Mr. B games a company in the US. I bet if you wait for the inevitable retail release at the end of the year you can buy it in Europe without paying VAT.


I guess you're right, but what about all the strechgoal goodies?
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Paul Grogan
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If you buy anything in Europe, you will be paying VAT, it might be hidden, but you will still be paying it.

Other KS campaigns which say "€45 including shipping" do include VAT, they just aren't listing it. And since the VAT does not apply in the US, CGE have chosen to list it separately. Simply put, if a copy is sold in US, CGE pay no VAT. If they sell within Europe, they have to pay VAT themselves.

It's not good I know, and I'd much prefer to live in the US for things like this
 
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Mathieu Hotton
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i already own both games and expansion, and i still pledged. Took a paladin level, not for the wooden box but for the art of David Cochard. 95 $ for a wooden box seems a lot, but you get a special limited edition and ornament, so it's cheap compared to the 210$ for your own picture dedicated (golem).

I can always sell my old edition. I think it will cost me 100 euros in the end. And they deliver it, they promised before the end of the year and i believe in them, as they succeeded in editing Tash kalar under a month before essen last year, they have great partnership within the industry.
 
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Junkfoot wrote:

I guess you're right, but what about all the strechgoal goodies?


No kidding! $90 is not that much higher than I would expect to pay for the base game and the expansion. I'd rather have all of the Kickstarter exclusives than die with another $10 in my bank account.
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Ben Kyo
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It actually works out fairly cheap for someone in Japan, compared to what we usually pay. Unless you happen to have just ordered Dungeon lords for ~$75 and festival season for ~$50, and only managed to cancel the dungeon lords part of your order in time. Even then, the Kickstarter for $105 seems pretty reasonable.

...just saying.
 
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Thomas Lang
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Benkyo wrote:
It actually works out fairly cheap for someone in Japan, compared to what we usually pay. Unless you happen to have just ordered Dungeon lords for ~$75 and festival season for ~$50, and only managed to cancel the dungeon lords part of your order in time. Even then, the Kickstarter for $105 seems pretty reasonable.

...just saying.


Hm... moving to Japan to feel that I'm having a better deal at kickstarter... sounds legit!
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Justin R
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I've been drooling over this KS as well, having wanted Dungeon Petz for a while now. Haven't had an opportunity to try before I buy, but sounds pretty great the way Rahdo describes it.

I understand Dungeon Lords (DL) to be a bit more complex, and I like the idea of the additional components per the KS campaign, but pricing out the DL + DP tier on CSI, the KS boils down to paying $25 for what strike me as minor upgrades, and without the benefit of getting a chance to find out for myself whether I like the base games enough to purchase the expansions.

I think I'll pass, but I'll surely own Dungeon Petz by the end of the year, so may consider the retail release of the DL Anniversary Edition.
 
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Simon Barnes
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Yeah, I've finally come to the conclusion this KS wasn't aimed at me. I haven't played the game yet, so buying through KS may have been an opportunity to save a few quid to compensate for the risk.

I'll hopefully pick up a second hand set from a KSer.
 
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Chris S.
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I've seen cheaper wooden boxes. Why is this one so expensive?
 
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