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Subject: Domestic Sleepers - 0 point agenda that 'takes up' deck space? rss

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Brad McCoy
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Since the points of the agenda are scored off the cards ability text, it technically doesn't count towards the Agenda point requirement in a Corp deck, correct? Thusly, it takes up valuable deck space along the lines of Runners running Notoriety?

For those who don't know, Domestic Sleepers is an Upstalk data pack HB agenda that is 0 points, 2 cost, with text estimate [Click, Click, Click] Place an agenda counter on Domestic Sleepers. It is now worth 1 Agenda point.
 
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Kaiwen Zhang
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true, but now FA decks only need to FA 6 points, and then score domestic.

and this agenda is worthless when stolen too.

If you were using deck space to add more FA options (such as trick of light or SfSS), you can maybe remove it now.
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Andrew Keddie
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Also switches on Archer if you want to run it out of HB.
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Michael Redston
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It's insane. It's hard to tell just how insane it is without proper playtesting, but it might just be the tool HB needs to be almost on par with NBN FA.
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J F
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I thought this originally as well, but it actually has a lot of potential. Ultimately every card you have takes up deck space, so if you're goal is to get out agenda points it's not actually that big an issue.
 
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Marcus Aurelius
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It's a very strong card that will surely make it into every HB FA deck sooner or later. This together with Shi.Kyu, depending on metagame might actually make Data Dealer a good card.
 
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Alex Rockwell
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-2 3/1 agendas.
-1 fast advance card.
+1 NAPD contract/etc.
+2 2/0 agenda.

Seems like a possibly useful swap.
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Andrew Keddie
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Thinking about it more; it also enables Midseasons without giving up any points. Maybe Custom Biotics might make more of a showing?
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Michael Redston
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CommissarFeesh wrote:
Maybe Custom Biotics might make more of a showing?

Said no one ever.

Also, NAPD is still the best Midseason-enabler, as it leaves the runner with 4 fewer credits to battle the trace with.
 
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Marcus Aurelius
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kroen wrote:
CommissarFeesh wrote:
Maybe Custom Biotics might make more of a showing?

Also, NAPD is still the best Midseason-enabler, as it leaves the runner with 4 fewer credits to battle the trace with.


Strongest Midseason-enablers are cards that can do something significant if the runner decides not to run them. Such as APP and BN. Because if they know what's going on and decide not to run your NAPD then you have to score it and you are that much farther away from creating the difference you need for a strong Midseason Replacements (5 clicks and 4 clicks further) with only 2 Agenda points to show for it. In terms of a midseason bait play of course. Naturally if they nab it from RnD it's ideally NAPD or Sleepers.
 
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Sasha F
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I'm supremely happy with Gila Hands in my HB FA. Dropping Gila for Domestic Sleepers would still take consideration if it was a 2/1. As it stands, adding Domestic Sleepers AND another 4/2 doesn't sound like it will improve my FA deck.

I have no doubt that this card will be boss in many HB builds, but I actually think FA is not it's best archetype. Heavy taxing with program destruction in the form of Archer screams for this card. It makes pure 3 AP agenda composition outside of Harmony Medtech a possibility. There are plenty of uses, but I don't think FA is necessary top in line.
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Peter Hopkins
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I've been running an HB deck with only 3 point agendas that runs Punitive Counterstrike that's fairly successful. This card would only make that deck better as the runner has to score 3 agendas (the first two without being hit by double PC), the Corp only needs 2 once they draw the Domestic Sleepers. It's a one point agenda the Runner is basically unable to steal.
 
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Andrew Keddie
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kroen wrote:
CommissarFeesh wrote:
Maybe Custom Biotics might make more of a showing?

Said no one ever.


Except I did. Just then. You quoted me. The post is right above yours, timestamped and everything.

You surprise me Kroen; you experiment with unusual decklists (and are often knocked for doing so) but then are immediately dismissive of certain cards or strategies when mentioned by others. I find the juxtaposition confusing.
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Andrew Duncan
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CommissarFeesh wrote:
kroen wrote:
CommissarFeesh wrote:
Maybe Custom Biotics might make more of a showing?

Said no one ever.


Except I did. Just then. You quoted me. The post is right above yours, timestamped and everything.

You surprise me Kroen; you experiment with unusual decklists (and are often knocked for doing so) but then are immediately dismissive of certain cards or strategies when mentioned by others. I find the juxtaposition confusing.


He's just worried he'll need to credit you when he next makes a Custom Biotics deck.
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Michael Redston
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CommissarFeesh wrote:
You surprise me Kroen; you experiment with unusual decklists (and are often knocked for doing so) but then are immediately dismissive of certain cards or strategies when mentioned by others. I find the juxtaposition confusing.

Custom Biotics will not be viable before the next deluxe, and probably not even then. H&P gave nothing to Custom Biotics as it can't use Jinteki cards. It's one of those ID's (like The Professor) that won't be truly viable until the card pool is much, much bigger.

Psychoseason is still better in NBN.
Scorched Earth is still better in Weyland.
FA is still better in ETF.

People are trying too hard to take decks that work perfectly and constructing them in Custom Biotics. That line of thinking is doomed to fail, IMO. Don't get me wrong, I have high hopes for Custom Biotics and am certain that it's time to shine will eventually come, but it's just not there yet.
 
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Tim Vaduva
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kroen wrote:
Custom Biotics will not be viable before the next deluxe, and probably not even then.


I think Custom Biotics has a decent chance to become better in the Lunar cycle because the Grail ICE has a natural home in that ID. May not win any nationals, but I wouldn't be surprised to have them win a few store championship-level tournaments.
 
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Michael Redston
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tvaduva wrote:
May not win any nationals, but I wouldn't be surprised to have them win a few store championship-level tournaments.

Literally any ID can win store championships. It still doesn't make the ID viable.
 
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Oscar Iglesias
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kroen wrote:
tvaduva wrote:
May not win any nationals, but I wouldn't be surprised to have them win a few store championship-level tournaments.

Literally any ID can win store championships. It still doesn't make the ID viable.


You can play and enjoy the game with any ID.
So, all IDs are viable.
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Ony Moose
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Midseason/Pyschographics/Commercialisation/Archived Memories/Reclamation Order works well in Custom Biotics though!

Install Project Vitruvirus, Pyschographics for 10 tokens, score and start the commercialisation/psycho train to easy win!

The deck isn't necessarily all there, but when it works it works
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Phillip Edwards
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Domestic Sleepers is good to feed Archer, Data Dealer, and Frame Job. That's just with the current card pool. You can still get your agenda point out of it if you need it. It seems like it "takes up" deck space but, IMHO, it's a good card; not a good agenda card but a good card that has functionality and may get addiional complimentary cards in the future.
 
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Josh Churley
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consider thinking of it as a type of trap. It doesn't replace agendas in your deck, it replaces junebugs/secretaries etc.

consider this - you can Install/Advance/Advance this card behind taxing ice as bait, except this 'trap' is more like a Thomas Haas rather than a Junebug. They all lay on different points on the risk/reward spectrum.

They run a junebug, they get hit for 4 net dmg, if they don't, you get nothing. Higher risk, higher reward
They run a thomas haas, you get your money back, they get nothing. If they don't, you get your money back later. Lower risk, lower reward
They run a Domestic Sleepers, nothing happens other than them spending money like they would on any other bait run (unless they have data dealer). If they don't, you get 1 Agenda point, which no other trap card can currently do.

This is in addition to the obvious benefit of being able to score a point out of hand in HB without a FA card, and the Archer play
 
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