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Subject: deduction Mechanics rss

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Fernando Berdichevsky
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I'm thinking about getting a new deduction game.

I have a wide variety of games but I've noticed that there isn't any deduction game (other than the classic Clue).

My first thought was to look for "deduction" in the BGG but apparently it´s not a Mechanic worth noting. (sidenote: how could that be!)

So, about two months ago I saw a video review of a deduction game where you used a "book" with sleeves to keep track of your info (so, no pen and paper) and you secretly placed tokens (with 0,1 or 2 points) and at the end you scored points for correct bets.
can anyone point me out what game it is?

On the other Hand: please recommend me what the best deduction Game is! remember I'm open to every suggestion regarding playtime, number of players, theme or complexity.

Thanks!
 
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Craig C
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Just last week I spotted 27th Passenger: A Hunt On Rails. The KS begins this week, I believe, and it looks like an entertaining deduction game.

For more established fare, Letters from Whitechapel and Fury of Dracula (Second Edition) are often mentioned as good ones.
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Bill Eldard
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I recommend P.I..

There's no need for bookkeeping, although some like to have a check-off list.

Essentially, when a player selects a clue card from the 9 face-up clue cards displayed, the player to his/her right (who holds the criminal, crime, & location cards for that player) provides the feedback. Let's use the Suspect Shorty. The active player takes up Shorty's clue card from the 9 displayed.

1- If Shorty is the criminal, the player is told to place a disk on Shorty's tile on the gameboard.

Ex. Red selected the Kidnapping clue card, and since that is the crime in the solution set for Red, was told to place a red disk on the Kidnapping tile.


2 -If Shorty is not the criminal, but the criminal is in a neighborhood adjacent to the one Shorty is in, the player is told to put a cube on Shorty's tile.

3 -If Shorty is neither the criminal nor adjacent to the criminal, the player keeps Shorty's card in front of him/her as a reminder.
Ex.
 


4 -The player can place a detective tile in the location, and the player to the right will respond as follows: For criminal, crime, or location that's correct, the player is told to place a disk on the detective. For each that is in an adjacent neighborhood, the player places a cube on the detective. And it neither is the case, the player places nothing on the detective.
Ex. Green and Blue have sent detectives to Central Station. Green' detective came up dry, but Blue's detective earned a disk and a cube, meaning that one of the tiles at that location (suspect, crime, or location) is in the solution, and a tile in an adjacent neighborhood is also in the solution -- but he doesn't know which is which.
 


It's a simple system.

Each player holds to solution (criminal, crime, and location) for the player to his/her left, so unlike Clue, every player has his/her own set to solve.
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Dan Blum
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Quote:
My first thought was to look for "deduction" in the BGG but apparently it´s not a Mechanic worth noting. (sidenote: how could that be!)


It's a category, not a mechanic (as far as BGG is concerned).
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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tool wrote:
Quote:
My first thought was to look for "deduction" in the BGG but apparently it´s not a Mechanic worth noting. (sidenote: how could that be!)


It's a category, not a mechanic (as far as BGG is concerned).


Oh... I've should have known. Sorry about that.

 
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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thanks for the suggestions!

P.I. I'll check it out right away.


About the KS projects I'm afraid that due to custom problems to import stuff in my country, I can´t purchase anything that way.

(that causes me to not back any project either and, believe me, many games had slipped away from my grasp )
 
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S McCulloch
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Check our Tobago, it is out of print but does show up second hand.
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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Many wrote:
Check our Tobago, it is out of print but does show up second hand.


Thanks for the Suggestion, I did check it out!

I'd love to have that game, but it shows on Amazon for about u$s80+. add the shipping and handling and that's prohibitive for an Argentinian Gamer.


Edit: change the figures I messed up with another game!
 
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Kevin Bodman
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I think the game you are referring to is Lady Alice
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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bluewave wrote:
I think the game you are referring to is Lady Alice


Yes!!! That's the one!!

Thank you very much! What do you think about it? Worth buying?
 
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Andy E
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The best deduction game I've ever played is Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective. The players are presented with a case in the style of Sherlock Holmes which they must solve faster than Sherlock himself. The players proceed by choosing a lead to follow (it's extremely open-ended, they can go pretty much anywhere in London), finding the corresponding address of the lead in the casebook, and reading any story tidbit they find there. This continues until the players decide they know what's going on.

I've also really enjoyed Letters from Whitechapel. In this one, one player plays as Jack the Ripper. The rest are policemen trying to capture Jack before he can take five victims. Jack's movement is secret (kept track of on a shielded notepad). The policemen try to determine Jack's secret hideout and block him off from it.
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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Thank you!

I Will check on Sherlock holmes:cd. It looks neat.

I've played letters from white chapel and I don't think of it as a deduction game (although it has a deduction element) but more like a hidden movement mechanic.

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Jin Juku
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NOIR: Deductive Mystery Game is probably my favorite deduction game right now. It plays great from 2 - 4 players, and I've even played it with 5. It's the size of a standard deck of cards, but a ton of fun.

Plunder is an interesting deduction game. It's kind of like the deduction part of Clue, without having to roll and move, but a little more complex because of having to guess the secret "code" for each other player. I enjoy this one a lot, too.
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Wim van Gruisen
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andye wrote:
The best deduction game I've ever played is Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective.

End of thread, really. Just mentioning that the game has two expansions, giving you a total of thirty scenarios.
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Quintious .
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One that's very popular with my group is Gentlemen Thieves. It can be explained in relatively short order, plays solidly, and provides a consistent experience each time.

I'm a big fan of Letters from Whitechapel, but some people in my group don't like it because I'm a bit too wily of a Jack, and it kind of frustrates them more than anything.
 
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Ahmet U
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Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective is more like a choose your adventure game. Yes, you deduce the killer but it's not one of the players, it's in the story booklet. So if you went through a scenario and read the solution that's it.
I wouldn't call it a deduction game in the same vein as The Resistance for instance.
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Wim van Gruisen
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Terrorvision wrote:
Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective is more like a choose your adventure game. Yes, you deduce the killer but it's not one of the players, it's in the story booklet.

It is a game. It is centred around deduction. The player who makes the best deductions wins. What more do you need?

I mean, if you read a detective book, and the killer turns out to be not the reader, does that mean that it actually isn't a detective book for real?
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Fernando Berdichevsky
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Whymme wrote:
Terrorvision wrote:
Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective is more like a choose your adventure game. Yes, you deduce the killer but it's not one of the players, it's in the story booklet.

It is a game. It is centred around deduction. The player who makes the best deductions wins. What more do you need?

I mean, if you read a detective book, and the killer turns out to be not the reader, does that mean that it actually isn't a detective book for real?


Hey no need to argue. I own the resistance. It is deduction, but different from what I'm looking for.
I also read a lot of Sherlock like novels. It IS deduction no question about that. Even in games like Clue or lady Alice none of the players is the murderer nor the victim. But that's what I'm looking for now. That kind of deduction. Tobago is more like reverse deduction in that sense.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Keep it coming
 
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Mark Nicosia
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Deduction, hidden movement, and hidden roles are my favorite mechanics and styles of games, by far. Gonna be a long list, I already know, but, my favorites that I know will always be in my collection...

Sleuth
Letters from Whitechapel
Scotland Yard
The Resistance: Avalon
Clue: The Great Museum Caper
Mr. Jack
Ninja: Legend of the Scorpion Clan
Citadels
One Night Ultimate Werewolf
Cheaty Mages!
Escape from the Aliens in Outer Space
Mystery of the Abbey
Lord of the Rings: The Confrontation
Heimlich & Co.
Code 777
BANG! The Dice Game
Saboteur
Zendo
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Clare Cannon
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Mystery express is a fun deduction game in a similar vein to clue

Mystery Express
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Clinton Sattler
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Take a peak at

Hanabi
Clans
Confusion: Espionage and Deception in the Cold War
Divinare

In addition to the recommendations above.

Good Luck!
 
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Pete
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I love Sherlock Holmes Consulting Detective: The Thames Murders & Other Cases, but I don't think I'd call it a deduction game. But then that begs the question, "what is a deduction game?" I think the answer is that deductive reasoning games involve a logical process of elimination.

Deduction in logic is determining the particular from the general, or essentially applying general rules to particular facts in a closed system. Abstractly, deduction games (like Sleuth and Clue) ask you to determine a particular result from a closed group of options by applying propositions or statements to eliminate possibilities (thus "deducting" them from the solution set). For example, if Mr. Green in the Library with the Rope produces a shown card, and you have Mr. green and Library, you can deduct the Rope from the solution set.

Sherlock Holmes, Consulting Detective is not a "deduction game" in this sense. If anything, it requires you to use inductive reasoning, extrapolating from a small set of facts a theory that might explain the relationships betweeen the clues and/or statements given. The information set is not closed, but open, and often it is required that you add knowledge to the game that is not given to arrive at a solution.

Other deduction games include Alibi, Mystery of the Abbey, and even more generally, games like Citadels, which involve some element of trying to deduce what character other players are holding from known knowledge.

Inductive reasoning games are not common in the board game arena, but this kind of thinking is common in roleplaying games and some computer games.

Pete (loves playing SH:CD but it's not anything like other deduction games)



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T.W. McLain 3
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Mr. Jack is one of my favorites.
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Wim van Gruisen
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In many card games deduction plays an important part, as you have to deduce what cards other players have, based on clues in the bidding and playing of cards. I recommend Bridge.

Edit: and heartily support the mention of Hanabi, above.
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David P
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Tobago isn't really a deduction game. It's also a bit telling that only a handful of people have played the game more than a dozen times. I think the older games are also the best in this category. Sleuth, Code 777, and, for a lighter game, Inkognito. I haven't played Zendo, but by all accounts it's one of the best, and it's a game with very healthy playcounts too.
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