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Subject: Third round win? rss

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John Fortune
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I have played this game about 3 times and enjoy it quite a bit. A friend of mine indicated he played in a game where there was a winner in turn 3 and thought there were some flaws with the game.

Is it possible to win this game in 3 turns? Do you guys see a weakness with this game in that one guy can pull away with a quick win?
 
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Dustin Crenshaw
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It did put a sour taste in my mouth. I really hate how you can get victory points in a bunch of different ways.
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Sean Ramirez
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noblejohn wrote:
I have played this game about 3 times and enjoy it quite a bit. A friend of mine indicated he played in a game where there was a winner in turn 3 and thought there were some flaws with the game.

Is it possible to win this game in 3 turns? Do you guys see a weakness with this game in that one guy can pull away with a quick win?


Round 1:
Attack a player in a temple and win. 1/8
Attack a player in a different temple and win. 2/8
Buy Defensive Victory.
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 3/8.

Round 2:
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 4/8
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 5/8
Buy Blue Victory Point. 6/8
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 7/8.

Round 3:
Buy Sphinx. 8/8

Possible... Not incredibly likely, I don't think.
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Chris G
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That's how you would do it but you'd need to be upgrading your pyramids and getting the right cards to pull that off. Pretty unlikely and I'd say probably impossible.
 
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Ian Noble
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noblejohn wrote:
I have played this game about 3 times and enjoy it quite a bit. A friend of mine indicated he played in a game where there was a winner in turn 3 and thought there were some flaws with the game.

Is it possible to win this game in 3 turns? Do you guys see a weakness with this game in that one guy can pull away with a quick win?


Sounds like you should be playing to 10, rather than 8.
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Alexei S.
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SeerMagic wrote:
It did put a sour taste in my mouth. I really hate how you can get victory points in a bunch of different ways.
Would you rather there were only a single way to get victory points?
 
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Jonathan Harrison
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Terence Lee
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I don't believe defensive wins give you VPs. Also, you should not be able to buy more than 1 VP from the cards (even though they're different colors, according to the rules - you cannot but duplicate cards).

So in the above examples, that's 3 less VPs.

 
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Jonathan Harrison
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I’ve bolded the parts you’re missing:
dvdhwkaz wrote:
Round 1:
Attack a player in a temple and win. 1/8
Attack a player in a different temple and win. 2/8
Buy Defensive Victory.
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 3/8.

Round 2:
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 4/8
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 5/8
Buy Blue Victory Point. 6/8
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 7/8.

Round 3:
Buy Sphinx. 8/8
Sphinx and the Blue VP aren’t overlapping powers.

Defensive Victory gives you VPs for successfully defending battles.
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Jonathan Harrison
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dvdhwkaz wrote:
noblejohn wrote:
I have played this game about 3 times and enjoy it quite a bit. A friend of mine indicated he played in a game where there was a winner in turn 3 and thought there were some flaws with the game.

Is it possible to win this game in 3 turns? Do you guys see a weakness with this game in that one guy can pull away with a quick win?


Round 1:
Attack a player in a temple and win. 1/8
Attack a player in a different temple and win. 2/8
Buy Defensive Victory.
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 3/8.

Round 2:
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 4/8
Win one defensive battle in a temple. 5/8
Buy Blue Victory Point. 6/8
Gain VP for holding 2 temples. 7/8.

Round 3:
Buy Sphinx. 8/8

Possible... Not incredibly likely, I don't think.

But that is a victory virtually in turn 2; only the last VP was bought in turn 3.

So a turn 3 victory seems much more doable if you consider that in your example the third turn is almost unaccounted for.

In any case, you’ve already got a 9th VP from having a blue pyramid at level 4 (to buy the Sphinx).

Seems pretty doable to me.
 
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Alexei S.
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HuginnGreiling wrote:
But that is a victory virtually in turn 2; only the last VP was bought in turn 3.

So a turn 3 victory seems much more doable if you consider that in your example the third turn is almost unaccounted for.

In any case, you’ve already got a 9th VP from having a blue pyramid at level 4 (to buy the Sphinx).

Seems pretty doable to me.

Consider this, though:

During the first turn, you need to:
- get two different troops to two different temples
- get a blue pyramid to level 3
- buy a level 3 power
- win two battles
- not get knocked out of either temple after taking them

That's 4/5 actions already taken up, and a minimum of 6 PP just to get Defensive Victory. Where will you get the PP to move to both temples?
 
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Jonathan Harrison
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That’s where the mostly unused third turn comes in. You don’t have to do all that in the first turn. You can move much of the first turn into the second, and the second into the third.

The laid-out scheme above was unnecessarily squeezing everything but the 8th and 9th VPs into two turns.
 
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The Shader
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Short game is short. Play to ten.

Also the above player has to win 4 battles in a row with one hand of cards, so while mathematically possible it is very unlikely unless you are playing the very new or tactically clueless.

It is technically possible to do a turn one win if playing 5player stupid.

1. Buy defensive victory
2. Move one army into a central location
3. All 4 opponents throw single soldiers at you twice, granting you 8vp and an instant win.
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Alexei S.
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therealtheshader wrote:
Also the above player has to win 4 battles in a row with one hand of cards, so while mathematically possible it is very unlikely unless you are playing the very new or tactically clueless.


I think this is the objection that sinks it even if you play with proper action and PP efficiency.

Taking it further: supposing you win both battles in Round 1, in Round 2 you now have to buy Defensive Victory AND recruit replacements for any losses you incurred AND get those reinforcements in position, all before anyone attacks you again. And if your opponents see you buying Defensive Victory, they're hardly likely to attack you unless they're confident of winning.
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Andy Day

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We almost always play to 10 because a 3rd round victory is possible, and a 4th round victory is sort of likely.

That said, a 3rd round victory requires a rather complacent set of opponents.
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Alejandro Magno
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I personally find the tiles more balanced at 10 points.
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Ryan Thompson

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tlee33 wrote:
I don't believe defensive wins give you VPs. Also, you should not be able to buy more than 1 VP from the cards (even though they're different colors, according to the rules - you cannot but duplicate cards).

So in the above examples, that's 3 less VPs.



There is a ... blue(?) upgrade that gives VP's for winning as the defender.
 
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David Chapman
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therealtheshader wrote:

Also the above player has to win 4 battles in a row with one hand of cards,


Two hands. He'll get everything back after the third battle.
 
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