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Subject: [HPB] Pathfinder Card Game - Louisville rss

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Jeff Meyer
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One lucky person could swing by the half price books on hurstborne to snag a used copy of Pathfinder Adventure Card Game: Rise of the Runelords – Base Set for around $30. Plus this week there is an e-coupon for 20-40% off so you could pick it up for under $20. Price estimate is from a worker - they don't have it out on the shelf yet, but I pestered him when I saw it back in the incoming trades area.

Good luck!
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Curt Carpenter
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Ugh
 
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Jeff Meyer
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curtc wrote:
Ugh


?
 
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Curt Carpenter
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I have about 150 "hot deals" for people who live near me in my local for sale list. Should I create a post in Hot Deals for each one? That doesn't seem to be a great use of the forum.
 
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Jeff Meyer
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I bow to your organizational superiority. Next time I just won't share at all, especially when posting from my phone while on my lunch break. I hope those few kilobytes of data I wasted don't break down the forum into chaos.

Admittedly, I like your method for posting local deals (though I curious how obvious it is to find for the casual user like me and not a power user like youself) but try not to come across like a grumpy hall monitor in middle school.

Try to be more constructive in your suggestions, I will try to be more constructive in my retorts.



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Curt Carpenter
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I'm not suggesting my method for local sales. Far from it. Just keep in mind that this is a large community, and test the barometer of "what would happen if everyone or lots of people did this"? Many people are subscribed to this forum, so every post pops up and requires some time and attention, even if just to dismiss. For the forum to be useful, there needs to be a reasonable signal to noise ratio, for a broad set of geographically distributed people (admittedly with a North American bias, but that is what it is on this site, which doesn't have localized Hot Deals forums).
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Jeff Meyer
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I get that. Anyway will try to be less accidentally obnoxious in the future.
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Dianna
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jefimeyerhoff wrote:
I get that. Anyway will try to be less accidentally obnoxious in the future.


Well, I am much obliged to you I admit! I'm trying to arrange a pick up now
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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jefimeyerhoff wrote:
I get that. Anyway will try to be less accidentally obnoxious in the future.


You were not obnoxious in your posting in any way accidental or otherwise.

Curt posting his own local sales would have been inappropriate because they are a personal sale of his own games.

Your posting of the HPB deal may have just been a single local sighting report, but that is exactly how almost all physical chain deal reporting begins.

Your seeing this at your local HPB, could very well lead to countless others finding the same at their own local branch by people who would never have checked otherwise.

Considering that there have been well thumbed and appreciated Hot Deals forum posts regarding sales from FLGS that have less than a half dozen locations in a very limited geographic region, the posting of a significant find at huge chain like HPB is absolutely appropriate.

I don't even have HPB in my area, but I applaud your sharing, as this is exactly what the Hot Deals forum IS for. While Curt's post was well intentioned, please do not hesitate to make exactly the same kind of posting again in the future.

If you were going to change anything, it may just be to put "YMMV" in the title of the post rather than "Louisville", and note in the first post that you're not sure if it's a chain wide deal, but you spotted it at your local branch. (which you basically did and this is just semantic hair splitting but this format would have likely avoided the unfortunate heckling)


Missed that this was for a single used copy trade in.
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Curt Carpenter
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NuMystic wrote:
Curt posting his own local sales would have been inappropriate because they are a personal sale of his own games.

Huh? So it's ok for someone to post about the sale of a single used game, so long as it's not from the person who currently owns the game??? Like I could get my buddy to post 150 posts for me and that's ok??? That really makes sense to you?

NuMystic wrote:
Your seeing this at your local HPB, could very well lead to countless others finding the same at their own local branch by people who would never have checked otherwise.

Perhaps you didn't notice, but this is about a single used copy.

NuMystic wrote:
Considering that there have been well thumbed and appreciated Hot Deals forum posts regarding sales from FLGS that have less than a half dozen locations in a very limited geographic region, the posting of a significant find at huge chain like HPB is absolutely appropriate.

I guess we could debate the definition of "significant find". And the size of the chain is completely irrelevant to this "deal" of a single copy.

NuMystic wrote:
I don't even have HPB in my area, but I applaud your sharing, as this is exactly what the Hot Deals forum IS for.

And I would debate that. Or at least if I lost the debate and posts like this became the norm, I'd stop subscribing. Or more realistically just complain more. Because there's a lot of value to the community for deals that have broad appeal. But if the noise gets too high, it's too much to wade through. There are also regional forums where regional deals can be posted. I would argue those are a better choice.

NuMystic wrote:
If you were going to change anything, it may just be to put "YMMV" in the title of the post rather than "Louisville", and note in the first post that you're not sure if it's a chain wide deal, but you spotted it at your local branch. (which you basically did and this is just semantic hair splitting but this format would have likely avoided the unfortunate heckling)

That would have been even worse.
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Paul Sauberer
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From the pinned definition of "What's a hot deal?"

Quote:
A Hot Deal posting HAS:
1. A price.
2. A Region or virtual platform in the subject line ([US], [Europe], [Global], [Kansas City, MO, USA], [iOS/Android/PC/Mac], etc.)
3. A descriptive subject line that includes: retailer and price or discount percentage.
4. A board game or board game related item for sale.

A Hot Deal posting DOES/IS NOT:
1. From a dealer.
2. An auction
3. Contain a referral link / request of any kind.
4. Contain a members-only website (members-only stores, like Costco are ok)


It looks like the OP qualifies.

The price would be good for someone in the Louisville area. It is clear that it is local. Easy to skip if one isn't interested.

If there was a single copy of an in-demand OOP game on an FLGS shelf and the poster didn't want to buy it themselves and sell it on the second hand market, I'd think a post here would be appreciated by people in that area. Posting in the regional forums wouldn't be appropriate because they aren't for "Hot Deals" and the people looking for "Hot Deals" wouldn't necessarily know to look there.
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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Yes, I did indeed miss that it was used. My apologies for the oversight.
 
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Curt Carpenter
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Psauberer wrote:
From the pinned definition of "What's a hot deal?"

Quote:
A Hot Deal posting HAS:
1. A price.
2. A Region or virtual platform in the subject line ([US], [Europe], [Global], [Kansas City, MO, USA], [iOS/Android/PC/Mac], etc.)
3. A descriptive subject line that includes: retailer and price or discount percentage.
4. A board game or board game related item for sale.

A Hot Deal posting DOES/IS NOT:
1. From a dealer.
2. An auction
3. Contain a referral link / request of any kind.
4. Contain a members-only website (members-only stores, like Costco are ok)


It looks like the OP qualifies.

Then I'm arguing against the definition. In any case, that was just one dude's post that an admin happened to like. And the thread is locked so it can't be discussed. As stated in the thread, it was really an attempt to capture what was tribal knowledge. And I think part of posting in "Hot Deals" means that it has to actually be, you know, a "hot deal" by some definition. And the description you posted doesn't mention that at all. By the description above, every single item for sale by every single retailer could be an individual post in Hot Deals.

Again, it just fails the "what if everyone did that?" test.
 
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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curtc wrote:
the thread is locked so it can't be discussed.


Apparently not.

curtc wrote:
Again, it just fails the "what if everyone did that?" test.


That's just a Slippery Slope Fallacy.

As noted by Paul, while this is a questionable case being only a single copy, at least it was appropriately noted as local-only and easily skipped, and it seems another forum member has indeed benefited from it.

Yes, it would be a problem if the forum was completely over-run with such single copy deals but that's an entirely imaginary threat since things like this pop up so very rarely.

I personally would have chosen to post it in my regional forum, but it's ultimately not much different than a post noting a great deal on Amazon from a 3rd party merchant with only a copy or two left in stock. Most won't benefit, but if someone does, and it's easily skipped… it hardly spells doom for the Hot Deals community.
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Paul Sauberer
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curtc wrote:
Psauberer wrote:
From the pinned definition of "What's a hot deal?"

Quote:
A Hot Deal posting HAS:
1. A price.
2. A Region or virtual platform in the subject line ([US], [Europe], [Global], [Kansas City, MO, USA], [iOS/Android/PC/Mac], etc.)
3. A descriptive subject line that includes: retailer and price or discount percentage.
4. A board game or board game related item for sale.

A Hot Deal posting DOES/IS NOT:
1. From a dealer.
2. An auction
3. Contain a referral link / request of any kind.
4. Contain a members-only website (members-only stores, like Costco are ok)


It looks like the OP qualifies.

Then I'm arguing against the definition. In any case, that was just one dude's post that an admin happened to like. And the thread is locked so it can't be discussed. As stated in the thread, it was really an attempt to capture what was tribal knowledge. And I think part of posting in "Hot Deals" means that it has to actually be, you know, a "hot deal" by some definition. And the description you posted doesn't mention that at all. By the description above, every single item for sale by every single retailer could be an individual post in Hot Deals.

Again, it just fails the "what if everyone did that?" test.


Mea culpa. I didn't include the next sentence from the pinned post.

Quote:
For the good of the community, please do a cursory bit of research to determine if the deal is really hot or not.


So you don't have to worry about whether every game at every retailer qualifies, because it doesn't.

If you want to continue to argue against a definition that's about 3 years old, it seems kind of pointless. Your view seems to be an outlier and destined to remain so.

In this case, though, it was specified and someone benefited. That seems to be a very effective test of whether the post was worthwhile. If everyone made posts that follows the tribal knowledge and benefits someone it seems like a good way to go.
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Curt Carpenter
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NuMystic wrote:
curtc wrote:
the thread is locked so it can't be discussed.


Apparently not.

I'm not talking about this thread. I'm talking about the thread Paul took the definition from.

NuMystic wrote:
curtc wrote:
Again, it just fails the "what if everyone did that?" test.

That's just a Slippery Slope Fallacy.

It's not a fallacy just because there's an entry in Wikipedia. Indeed you added the word 'fallacy' that doesn't even exist in the Wikipedia title. The article explains that there are valid uses of it.

NuMystic wrote:
Yes, it would be a problem if the forum was completely over-run with such single copy deals but that's an entirely imaginary threat since things like this pop up so very rarely.

I hope that threads like this make them more rare in the future.

NuMystic wrote:
...it's ultimately not much different than a post noting a great deal on Amazon from a 3rd party merchant with only a copy or two left in stock. Most won't benefit, but if someone does, and it's easily skipped…

It's a huge difference. In that case the deal is available equally to all (again, at least in North America--I think we all agree it would be better if there were regional Hot Deals forums).
 
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Curt Carpenter
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Psauberer wrote:
So you don't have to worry about whether every game at every retailer qualifies, because it doesn't.

How about every game under MSRP?

Psauberer wrote:
If you want to continue to argue against a definition that's about 3 years old, it seems kind of pointless. Your view seems to be an outlier and destined to remain so.

Most of what's debated on BGG is pointless. But I care about it, so I debate. I'm not so sure my view is an outlier. I suspect only my willingness to debate it is.

Psauberer wrote:
In this case, though, it was specified and someone benefited. That seems to be a very effective test of whether the post was worthwhile.

I would even challenge that. In a forum where hundreds or thousands of people are subscribed, I think there should be some reasonable portion of subscribers who at least potentially have the deal available to them.

Psauberer wrote:
If everyone made posts that follows the tribal knowledge and benefits someone it seems like a good way to go.

I agree. But I don't think tribal knowledge supports posting for a single copy of a used--in print--game in a FLGS. That's my point.
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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curtc wrote:

It's not a fallacy just because there's an entry in Wikipedia.


Never said that's why it was a fallacy.

curtc wrote:
The article explains that there are valid uses of it.


Indeed, and it also explicitly states in the very first line of the entry:

Wikipedia wrote:
In logic and critical thinking, a slippery slope is a logical device, but it is usually known under its fallacious form.


Which is exactly the form I was addressing hence my use of the word.

curtc wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
Yes, it would be a problem if the forum was completely over-run with such single copy deals but that's an entirely imaginary threat since things like this pop up so very rarely.

I hope that threads like this make them more rare in the future.


Clearly. And even in cases where there is absolutely no gray area whatsoever as to the relevance of a post, such corrections can be made in a welcoming and friendly way. Especially when a member is clearly posting with a sincere intent of providing value to others (regardless of whether you personally agree).

The value of the Hot Deals forum springs in it's entirety from volunteer efforts.

Leaving generous posters feeling attacked and denigrated, however misguided they may have been, does not benefit the community as a whole. "Ugh" indeed.

With a volunteer army there will always be a continual need to educate. That is how the "tribal knowledge" is propagated, but this can be done without being derisive and insulting. One can inform while still showing appreciation for well intentioned posts that just happened to be off the mark.

curtc wrote:
NuMystic wrote:
...it's ultimately not much different than a post noting a great deal on Amazon from a 3rd party merchant with only a copy or two left in stock. Most won't benefit, but if someone does, and it's easily skipped…

It's a huge difference. In that case the deal is available equally to all


And yet, this isn't "National Hot Deals Only" forum. There's a case to be made for regional Hot Deals forums but we don't have them now and it's a trivial matter to click "mark read" when posts are not personally relevant. Whether that's because it's in Louisville or simply a game I couldn't care less about doesn't change the click either way.



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Alejandro G.
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Oh Curt...
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I subscribed to this thread just to watch the show that I knew was coming the moment I read the OP.

...continues chewing popcorn...
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Jeff Meyer
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parelle wrote:
jefimeyerhoff wrote:
I get that. Anyway will try to be less accidentally obnoxious in the future.


Well, I am much obliged to you I admit! I'm trying to arrange a pick up now


Score. Hope it worked out well.
Also thanks for the group debate :-)
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Curt Carpenter
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NuMystic wrote:
One can inform while still showing appreciation for well intentioned posts that just happened to be off the mark.

100% correct. I didn't intend to come across so negative, but I see that I did. I will strive to do better. Horse dead.
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