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Hearts and Minds: Vietnam 1965-1975» Forums » Rules

Subject: Campaign cards - still confused rss

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Mirlitho -
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Even after reading the threads about the campaign cards I'm still confused about the conditional effect of those cards.

Can you help ?

After reading the cards and the rules I thought the condition (battles and PC-changes in the campaigne zone) was just needed for the +3 SRPs option.

My opponent tells me that the condition is in fact mandatory : it excludes battles and PC-changes outside of the campaign zone if you want to play the campaign card as its event and get the Hawks/Doves.

Thank you.

 
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Stan Hilinski
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Here's Starlite for reference:
"You may play 3 SRPs instead of 1 SRP for Actions this turn if you spend all Battle, Pacification, and PC-Change Actions in Zone I.
Zone I Battles: Roll 2 dice and use the best roll (this turn only).
+1 Hawk every Allied turn this year that you control all provinces in Zone I."

The first line says "may play 3 srps," which means it is optional. Your friend sees "must play 3 srps," but that is not what it says.

You can get the Battles bonus (second sentence) and score Hawks (last sentence) even if you do not choose to do the "3 srp" option. So yes, you can play the card, not spend the extra srps, and still earn Hawks.

Your first understanding was correct. This rule applies to all zone campaign cards.
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Ralph Shelton
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Stan, the issue is whether battles, pc changes, and Pacifications can be done outside the zone of the campaign card during the turn it is played.

The rules are clear that you may spend the 3SRP or not, but give the impression that if you only spend 1SRP you can battle, etc outside the campaign card zone.
 
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Stan Hilinski
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You can do that stuff outside the zone, but you can't use the 3srp bonus if you do. You get only 1 srp per the basic then.
 
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Ralph Shelton
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That seems to conflict with this statement on consimworld?

http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?14@@.1dd1a58f/835

Questioner wrote:
when a campaign card is played you can only attack,pc change and pacify in the zone the offensive is for. is this just on the turn the campaign card was played or for the year?


Stan Helinski wrote:
The first turn. The card gives you 3 RPs plus 3 more RPs from your stockpile. All pacifications, pc-changes, and battle actions must be spent in the zone using those 6 RPs. The restriction does not just apply to the extra 3 RPs; it is all 6. I realize that the rules are ambiguous, so I updated v2 rules and playbook to clarify this.
 
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Stan Hilinski
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That idiot "Helinski's" reply assumes the player has chosen to spend 3 srps as the event allows in its first sentence.

Let's walk through it. I play Red's "Mekong Delta."

I choose not to spend +2 or +3 rps from my stockpile as the event allows. Maybe I don't have extra srps. So I do the card with its 3 rps plus maybe 1 srp as per the standard rule. Since I am not exercising the event's first option, I can spend those 3 or 4 RPs as I want anywhere. The rest of the event still applies.

But suppose I decide to do the first option. I add 2 or 3 srps to the card's 3. Then I must spend all 5 or 6 to do battle and pc-change actiosn in zone IV -- "Mekong Delta's" target zone. If I can't or don't want to do this, then I don't get the extra srps.
 
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Ralph Shelton
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The card has much different wording than the rulebook for Zone Campaigns. The rules do not have the word if in them. Emphasis added by me below to highlight differences. The card is clearer than the rules in the 2nd edition if you meant "if" all along. Having played the cards by the letter of the rule for several years, I find it disconcerting that what the rule says is so incorrect and never represented your true intent.

Zone Campaign Card wrote:

You may play 3 SRPs instead of 1 SRP for Actions this turn if you spend all Battle, Pacification, and PC-Change Actions in Zone I.


Hearts and Minds Rules wrote:

A Zone Campaign card gives you 3 RPs for Actions (printed in the top left corner). The event lets you spend up to 3 more RPs from your stockpile for Actions, but you must do all battles, PC-changes, and pacifications in the target zone. You get to spend 3 SRPs for actions instead of the normal 1 SRP. All other Actions, such as movement, may occur anywhere. The restriction applies to all 6 RPs that the card supplies (3 card RPs plus 3 event RPs). You must do all battle, PC-change, and pacification actions in the target province.


 
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Stan Hilinski
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revnye wrote:
The card has much different wording than the rulebook for Zone Campaigns. The rules do not have the word if in them. Emphasis added by me below to highlight differences. The card is clearer than the rules in the 2nd edition if you meant "if" all along. Having played the cards by the letter of the rule for several years, I find it disconcerting that what the rule says is so incorrect and never represented your true intent.

Zone Campaign Card wrote:

You may play 3 SRPs instead of 1 SRP for Actions this turn if you spend all Battle, Pacification, and PC-Change Actions in Zone I.


Hearts and Minds Rules wrote:

A Zone Campaign card gives you 3 RPs for Actions (printed in the top left corner). The event lets you spend up to 3 more RPs from your stockpile for Actions, but you must do all battles, PC-changes, and pacifications in the target zone. You get to spend 3 SRPs for actions instead of the normal 1 SRP. All other Actions, such as movement, may occur anywhere. The restriction applies to all 6 RPs that the card supplies (3 card RPs plus 3 event RPs). You must do all battle, PC-change, and pacification actions in the target province.



Somehow I missed your note back in July. It appears my rulebook effort to clarify did the opposite. The rules should have more "if's" as you note. I will try again in the FAQ I am (finally) working on.
 
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