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Subject: First Game Confusion! rss

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Paul Glickman
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We played our first game of this yesterday. I was the Conclave, and we had the Claw and Vigilance on our side, and we were playing against the Bareg Threll Syndicate.

Firstly, the first Syndicate mission gives no indication of where to play the ship in the Aftermath phase. Bit confusing.

Now, far more importantly, the whole game played very strangely. The Vigilance and my Conclave sat in one section, very quickly upgraded enough to instantly kill any ship without being damaged. The Claw hopped around destroying things and taking a bit of damage, but also outscaled the baddies quickly.

Now, my issue comes in here - though we could kill anything, we couldn't really make progress. Two sectors were overrun (including the one the Vigilance and I were in), and we killed a Smuggler to move the Solar Ransom mission to the non-overrun sector, moved there, and all gunned down ships every turn until eventually the Flagship came out. We then read the Flagship, realized we had to make sure there were no more than 2 other ships in the sector, and promptly gave up - we were likely going to win, but it might have taken another half hour of grinding and waiting until the flipped station cards had no more movement into that sector.

That being said... Is it likely that we got any rules wrong? The game lasted forever, and stopped being fun about 45 minutes in - though it was very enjoyable up to that point, it then felt like the game had no idea how to respond to us being super powerful - we could barely make a dent in the enemy, but they couldn't flip our last sector either. I've never played a board game in which it didn't feel like we had any way to catch up - not that we weren't powerful enough, but that it was literally impossible to deal with all the flipped station cards because we could kill at most 3-4 ships a turn.

Did we just play poorly? It didn't seem like it, and it felt like we were favoured, it was just... Very slow going.

TLDR; game lasted forever and felt unwinnable and unlosable. Did we do something wrong?
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Kyle S.
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Paul G wrote:
Firstly, the first Syndicate mission gives no indication of where to play the ship in the Aftermath phase. Bit confusing.


This is a slight typo. It is supposed to say "In this sector". So the ship goes into the sector with the Mission (unless that sector is at fleet limit of course, then it would get scrapped )

Paul G wrote:

Now, far more importantly, the whole game played very strangely. The Vigilance and my Conclave sat in one section, very quickly upgraded enough to instantly kill any ship without being damaged. The Claw hopped around destroying things and taking a bit of damage, but also outscaled the baddies quickly.

Now, my issue comes in here - though we could kill anything, we couldn't really make progress. Two sectors were overrun (including the one the Vigilance and I were in), and we killed a Smuggler to move the Solar Ransom mission to the non-overrun sector, moved there, and all gunned down ships every turn until eventually the Flagship came out. We then read the Flagship, realized we had to make sure there were no more than 2 other ships in the sector, and promptly gave up - we were likely going to win, but it might have taken another half hour of grinding and waiting until the flipped station cards had no more movement into that sector.

That being said... Is it likely that we got any rules wrong? The game lasted forever, and stopped being fun about 45 minutes in - though it was very enjoyable up to that point, it then felt like the game had no idea how to respond to us being super powerful - we could barely make a dent in the enemy, but they couldn't flip our last sector either. I've never played a board game in which it didn't feel like we had any way to catch up - not that we weren't powerful enough, but that it was literally impossible to deal with all the flipped station cards because we could kill at most 3-4 ships a turn.

Did we just play poorly? It didn't seem like it, and it felt like we were favoured, it was just... Very slow going.

TLDR; game lasted forever and felt unwinnable and unlosable. Did we do something wrong?


The game has two win conditions on normal mode. The most important one for any game is going to be "Kill the flagship".

For new players, what they don't realize at fist is that you have 100% control over when the flagship comes out (unlike every other Opposition)! Once you are strong enough, bring the Cryoshade out ASAP! I hear this problem a lot, and its always related to players stalling themselves out. After 2-3 rounds, you should already be actively working on bringing the flagship out to get the win.

Don't even try to win GSF by clearing the board. It's a red herring of a win condition in my opinion. Build up a bit and get that flagship into play so you can blast it out of the sky. That is what you should be working towards against the Syndicate, and this should solve your problem.

Play against the Technovores next time. They are much easier to wrap your head around and the Flagship comes out the first time a sector is overrun. After playing against them, you will have a much better feel for how to manipulate "Solar Ransom" in your favor for a quicker and more rewarding game experience.

Let me know if this helps!
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Paul Glickman
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That... Honestly is not a response that makes me happy. Playing suboptimally shouldn't make the game take triple the length, it should make you lose.

We knew that we needed to kill the Flagship, and were aiming to get our ships up to the level that we could - and that happened quite quickly, or so it felt.

The ships being played in the same sector may have helped a lot, because we could have used the fleet limit to our advantage (the fleet limit seems like the most important rule, by the way) - but attacking the Solar Thingy would be very difficult, as we'd have to kill every other ship in that sector, something impossible to do quickly with what we had access to. We could keep killing 3, but more would just travel there.

The one rule that felt very wrong was the station cards flipping - we went through the station deck two and a half times. Do you really refill the slots when they're empty? So the first turn, a guaranteed 3 cards flip, then the next turn, very likely 6 more are flipping as you can't really kill ships the first turn - and from there, more and more ships spawn as your ships get incredibly powerful, but have no way to kill two people at a time.

Secondary Engaging also seems like it will always be a terrible idea, as not engaging ships makes you lose.

So "you guys played poorly and so the game got boring" is actually the answer?
 
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Kyle S.
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Paul G wrote:
That... Honestly is not a response that makes me happy. Playing suboptimally shouldn't make the game take triple the length, it should make you lose.


Normal mode is kinda training wheels for Elite Mode where that is much more the case. It's not that you were playing "suboptimally". It's really just that with the Syndicate, you control when the Flagship is deployed. Staying alive and keeping at least 1 sector contested is good play, you just needed to think a step further ahead much sooner. You chose to wait to deploy the flagship, so the game length was all your choice. That might come off wrong, but you gotta take it at face value. This is why I don't recommend Syndicate for new players and much prefer folks to start with Technovores.

Vigilance with Conclaves help should be ready to engage Cryoshade on round 3 in my experience. Vigi is amazing at gaining Weaponry FAST, and Cryo starts with a pittiful amount of Weaponry. Again, the sooner you bring Cryo out, the better.

Paul G wrote:
The ships being played in the same sector may have helped a lot, because we could have used the fleet limit to our advantage (the fleet limit seems like the most important rule, by the way) - but attacking the Solar Thingy would be very difficult, as we'd have to kill every other ship in that sector, something impossible to do quickly with what we had access to. We could keep killing 3, but more would just travel there.


You brought Claw! He is so helpful here. 1) Use him to move ships OUT of the sector with the Flagship, then move him back in for Ramming Speed to scrap a ship in that sector, then scrap another ship during your engagement. Thats a net of 3 Opp ships out of that sector just from Claw alone. Keep looking for tricks like this to help you out. Keep Claw's deck small to access Ramming Speed as often as possible. Conclave also has its Blink for a secondary engagement. You might loose an engaged ship, but moving an unengaged ship to a sector already overrun is a net gain in your favor and speeds up clearing the Cryoshade's sector. You have a lot more tricks at your disposal than you think!

Paul G wrote:
The one rule that felt very wrong was the station cards flipping - we went through the station deck two and a half times. Do you really refill the slots when they're empty? So the first turn, a guaranteed 3 cards flip, then the next turn, very likely 6 more are flipping as you can't really kill ships the first turn - and from there, more and more ships spawn as your ships get incredibly powerful, but have no way to kill two people at a time.


Keep the fleet limit in mind. Ships can't deploy from being flipped in sectors at fleet limit. Also, some advanced strategy will open once you are more familiar with the cards where you can manipulate the sector cards. Buying what you DONT want to flip can be just as, if not more so, important than buying what you want to install. In an overrun sector, buy the cards that flip into deploying ships into other sectors. Or make sure only ships flip, so that they get scrapped if at the fleet limit.

There are going to be a lot of Opp ships. Thats OK though. Your goal is to prevent all three sectors from overrunning, as long as you have 1 contested sector, you have room to build and eventually take on the flagship. Keep that in mind.

Paul G wrote:
Secondary Engaging also seems like it will always be a terrible idea, as not engaging ships makes you lose.


It's situational, yes. Useless? I've had it decide games before at the final second to scrap flagships on Elite Mode where that Aftermath I would have lost. But generally you are right, usually you do not want to sacrifice an engagement especially early game . But look at my comment on Blink above. There was a valid use for a secondary engagement that actually is a net gain in your favor.

Paul G wrote:
So "you guys played poorly and so the game got boring" is actually the answer?


Again, this is part of the reason I do not recommend the Syndicate for new players due to Solar Ransom being totally in the players control. You can easily put yourself into a stalemate on normal mode. But once you know that, you can find a better strategy to not put yourself in that position. Yes, it sucks that it can happen, but it doesn't suck that you can change that! That's the exciting part for me at least. Finding new and better strategies for each Opp and each Strike Force Deck.

If you wanna bump up the challenge a bit and feel some pressure, play with all the Elite Mode Icons active on the Flagship panel. I highly recommend this for everybody. You won't stalemate then even if you tried
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Mike Clarke
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I have just got the game but I'm wondering if Elite (at least the tokens on the Flagship) isn't the ONLY way to play.

I don't think you ever lose on normal mode. The worst is the stalemate described above. Do I have that right? And does Elite mode threaten you with a loss or is just a longer game?
 
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Kevin
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Paul G wrote:
The one rule that felt very wrong was the station cards flipping - we went through the station deck two and a half times. Do you really refill the slots when they're empty? So the first turn, a guaranteed 3 cards flip, then the next turn, very likely 6 more are flipping as you can't really kill ships the first turn - and from there, more and more ships spawn as your ships get incredibly powerful, but have no way to kill two people at a time.


Paul, just to clarify something how many ships did you start off with? Normally with 3 players it's 6 ships (3 times twice the number of players), 2 for each sector. Even though you're going to play a ship from the Opposition deck since it was not in play when the Aftermath phase began I don't believe it counts as being "unengaged" (more experienced players please feel free to correct me here). From my understanding of the rules and doing some additional research, I've been led to believe at the beginning of a phase the game checks all cards on the board and takes a snapshot. For example, during the Aftermath Phase Actions Event, when placing an Opposition ship in the same sector as the "Solar Ransom" mission if that card has an [A] symbol on it then the effect of the card does not happen because it was not in play at the beginning of the Aftermath phase (again please correct if I'm wrong). Seems to me that ideally 3 Station cards should have been flipped here during the Aftermath Opposition Cards Flip Event, assuming 1 person in each sector and 1 Station card being flipped per sector, plus 1 Opposition from the deck during the Phase Actions Event.

Bigfoote wrote:
There are going to be a lot of Opp ships. Thats OK though. Your goal is to prevent all three sectors from overrunning, as long as you have 1 contested sector, you have room to build and eventually take on the flagship. Keep that in mind.


Have to agree with Bigfoote here! Playing Syndicate there will be so many ships that all you can really do is manage it because clearing the board usually isn't an option. I played a game recently against the Syndicate with 2 overrun sectors and then once I had the last Contested sector on lockdown I purposefully deployed the Flagship. Beat it in 2 rounds too because Vigilance had a [W] value of 19

Cheers to hoping this helps you in future games and hopefully I can learn something here too
 
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Paul Glickman
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We started with 6 ships! Given the turn order, it seemed that the extra ship would be played first, so that means that at least 4 cards will be played (3 station, 1 opposition) and then it just spirals out of control from there.

In retrospect, our Claw did buy a LOT of cards, had a huge deck, and had no combo to keep us alive. Wouldn't we have had a similar problem if we used any 3 except the Claw?

The Fleet Limit seems like the most important skill in the game so far, though I could be wrong. We're going to try this again later in the week with the Spiderdudes, thanks a lot for the help! My problem was that the game seemed SUPER fun, until it just... stopped working. We ended up with 32+ attack each (except the Conclave), just didn't feel like we had enough ways to interact with the board. If we could literally engage two baddies and just add their numbers up, we could still have instantly taken 2 out per non-Conclave person.

Strange game.
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Kevin
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Paul G wrote:
In retrospect, our Claw did buy a LOT of cards, had a huge deck, and had no combo to keep us alive. Wouldn't we have had a similar problem if we used any 3 except the Claw?


The Claw buying a lot of cards is never a good thing >_< very mobile and very effective character though. My favorite character at the moment is between Grey Hammer and Uxshenti's Wrath. Technovore will be much less challenging than Syndicate but you can meet either win condition and don't have to worry about "Solar Ransom"

Yes, this is a very strange game but I'm thoroughly enjoying it so far!
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Mike Clarke
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I'm still wondering whether you can lose the game on normal mode. It seems to be inevitable that you can hang on in one sector until you load up enough tech to become invincible.

I haven't played enough games to know whether that's true but after one play it certainly seems that way and I've heard others here suggest as much. Can anyone else weigh in on this and whether and how, if that's true, Elite mode changes that dynamic.
 
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Paul G wrote:
We started with 6 ships! Given the turn order, it seemed that the extra ship would be played first, so that means that at least 4 cards will be played (3 station, 1 opposition) and then it just spirals out of control from there.

In retrospect, our Claw did buy a LOT of cards, had a huge deck, and had no combo to keep us alive. Wouldn't we have had a similar problem if we used any 3 except the Claw?


There might be confusion here. Sectors will only flip a MAX of 3 cards each. 4 unengaged Opposition ships in the Trade Outpost? You still only flip the top 3 cards only.

You are right that all Icons get activated first before the flip event. But the fact that only a max of three cards flip is your hard cap. You won't be able to save all three sectors from overrun. You may not be able to keep 2 contested for long. But ultimately the Flagship is your goal.

On Claw and other combination of ships: Different combination of ships are going to have their own strengths and weaknesses. Swap out Claw with someone else, that other Strike Force Ship will bring its own tools and utility, and its your job to figure out how to best use those decks and make them the most efficient they can be. Experiment with the number of cards you buy and what you buy for each ship. Keep in mind that Boost cards you buy get scrapped after use and are not recycled (thats often forgot). Deck bloat for any ship (save UX) is going to be a massive problem for efficiency.

I have written a few guides on some SF ships, but the playtesting the new SotM expansion has taken up finishing those guides. But since we were talking about Claw, I'll link to my Claw guide. Maybe it'll spark some ideas for how to think about other Ships as well.

https://greaterthangames.com/forum/topic/pilot-operations-ma...

mikecl wrote:
I'm still wondering whether you can lose the game on normal mode. It seems to be inevitable that you can hang on in one sector until you load up enough tech to become invincible.

I haven't played enough games to know whether that's true but after one play it certainly seems that way and I've heard others here suggest as much. Can anyone else weigh in on this and whether and how, if that's true, Elite mode changes that dynamic.


Hey Mike!

Yes you can lose on normal mode. The threat of losing will almost never come from your own ship blowing up (well...Technovores on Elite sure have that danger), but really the threat of loosing comes from not being able to prevent all 3 sectors from overrunning.

Some folks are gonna pick up the basic strategy of this game quick, and normal mode may not provide the challenge you are looking for. Elite Mode really helps this!

I'v played this game a ton, from playtesting to live. My personal favorite sweetspot for this game is playing with all Elite Mode Icons and winning by killing the Flagship. To my sensibilities, this balances the theme and difficulty in a really great place. Need more of a challenge? Add the +1/+1 to each Opp and also require a board clear with the flagship kill for the "true" Elite Mode" (that will add a bunch to game length keep in mind).

Elite Mode Icons do two things in this game:
1) Enhance the theme of each Opp by a large margin
2) Increase the threat of Overrun loss by a large margin (especially the Singularity! The hardest Opp we have)

Those icons save this game for me. Frankly the game is no where near as fun without them. Play with them on. You will see what I mean. Report back and let us know what you think.
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Pydro
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I think Paul meant that 4 cards total flip: 3 Station cards and 1 card from the Opp deck (from Solar Ransom). This is what would happen, at least until you get to the Fleet Limit.
 
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J Karrde
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mikecl wrote:
I'm still wondering whether you can lose the game on normal mode. It seems to be inevitable that you can hang on in one sector until you load up enough tech to become invincible.

I haven't played enough games to know whether that's true but after one play it certainly seems that way and I've heard others here suggest as much. Can anyone else weigh in on this and whether and how, if that's true, Elite mode changes that dynamic.

That may be the case against the Syndicate on normal, but definitely not when you play the others. I've lost against the Singularity on normal. Only played them once so far, but they are rough!
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Mike Clarke
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That's really helpful Kyle. Thank you.I've looked at some of the other baddies and can see where they'll be more challenging with the possible exception of the Technivores.

As far as dealing with ships, I think a key strategy is preventing their deployment by buying up tech that flips into ships. A ship that doesn't deploy is one you don't have to fight and the icons on them make it easy to see in advance which ones will flip into ships.

So that beings up another interesting question. Are you allowed to peek under the top card to see what's coming next. I'm guessing not. Otherwise you might be able to see that boost you're buying is revealing a potential flipped ship in which case, you could arrange it so ships hardly ever spawn which I think is contrary to the game's intent.

If so, Does that also mean you can't remove the top card either to look at it until you've purchased it. I ask because this raises card management issues where you have to be careful about keeping the cards straight and players orderly.
 
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Pydro
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Station manipulation is incredibly important. Once you learn the cards, you will have a great resource at your disposal. However, you cannot look at the back of the Station cards to see what it is. The cards never change, so eventually you will learn what is on the back.

The problem with lifting the cards is seeing what is next, which could, theoretically, greatly effect what you buy. So, technically, no, you can't lift up the cards. If it is an issue of ease of gameplay, I say do it. The game is supposed to be fun.
 
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Mike Clarke
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You don't have to look at the back. The iconography on the blue side tells whether it's a ship or a boost on the reverse side. Check it out.

Ok finished a second two player game against the Threllians (still on normal) as I believe Elite mode for this particular opponent just prolongs it. We couldn't get to the big baddie because boost effects (we had the ship flip thing covered) also brought in new ships so the game really started to drag because we couldn't engage the bad guy (he's got to be the last one) until the sector was cleared.

My question is this: would it really break the game to allow you to take on two ships at once combining their defense and attack. Restricting attacks to one apiece the way these ships proliferate is a) frustrating b) makes the game way too long and c) is NOT fun.

Did anyone ever consider this in play testing and if so, why was it rejected? I ran a couple of mock battles and if you remove Defense on both ships one for one and then weapons the same way it actually works. And this way some of these smaller ships are still dangerous too.
 
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Kyle S.
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mikecl wrote:
Ok finished a second two player game against the Threllians (still on normal) as I believe Elite mode for this particular opponent just prolongs it. We couldn't get to the big baddie because boost effects (we had the ship flip thing covered) also brought in new ships so the game really started to drag because we couldn't engage the bad guy (he's got to be the last one) until the sector was cleared.


Hard to give advice here without any specifics. Who did you bring? Sector choice? What did you do early game?

Cryoshade does NOT have to be the last Opp in the sector. There just can't be other unengaged ships with him. Thats a big difference.

Lets say you are in the sector and brought Cryoshade out. Remember, fleet limit = 4 in a 2 player game. If you are both in that sector engaging and scrapping and buying, only 2 cards are going to flip during the Aftermath. During the Req phase, try and buy anything that will flip into a ship, but only worry about the first 2 station piles (those are the only ones in danger of flipping and in the most need of manipulating). Scrap 2 ships during engagment leaving 2 ships. Hopefully you bought well and no ships deploy into your sector. This means next turn you can engage Cryo and the last Opp ship in sector and start dealing it damage.

Heck, if you can get a Blockader into that sector and scrap it, NO cards will flip at all giving you a free round of breathing room and put that sector back into contested. That is a really important bounty and you wanna make the most of it when you can. Killing Dispatchers also lets you move ANY ship to another sector for a bounty, clearing out the sector even faster. Bounties man, don't forget about those things!

Buying Strike Force Tactics will help clear more ships out faster. Extra movement abilities will help a lot here too. There are ways to game the system in your favor, you just gotta find them!

mikecl wrote:
My question is this: would it really break the game to allow you to take on two ships at once combining their defense and attack. Restricting attacks to one apiece the way these ships proliferate is a) frustrating b) makes the game way too long and c) is NOT fun.


Engaging 2 ships at once was very powerful. It would have been a whole lot harder for the Opposition to overrun you and flip cards. There was a time when some boosts allowed you to do this, and some ships like Warbeast could engage 3 ships with some cards. To counter balance multiple engagments, we needed A LOT more Opposition ships on the table. This game already takes up a lot of room, imagine even more Opp ships out to track and move. It didn't work well.

Example of what I mean. 2 player game. starts with 2-1-1 ship placement. Engaging multiple ships, you lock down the first sector immediately with 1 ship and then another sector with your second. 1 card flips. The threat of losing is now completely gone. Thats really not fun.

The small ships are still dangerous for the sole reason of you can't attack multiple things at once. They will flip cards or allow another Opp to flip cards. Thats why me and Pydro stress station manipulation to mitigate what the Opposition actually does flip. Some of the most powerful cards for a SF ship to buy are often times best left on the table to flip because its effect is not as threatening. Thats a whole other mini-game of cost/benefit analysis which some folks will enjoy (like me).

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Hi Kyle great reply. To answer some of your questions.

1) We were using Vigilance and Conclave of Nyphon (great name).
2) We were aware we could engage Cryoshade as long as all remaining Opp ships were engaged.
3) We practised station management by buying up cards that flip into ships then got killed by Oppposition boost cards that summoned ships anyway at a time when if we didn't defeat Cryoshade we would have to leave to prevent the last sector from being overrun after three hours of play.

Then come back and try again risking the same result.

We didn't. We just quit as the game had turned into work instead of fun which is the ONLY reason you play. Trust me we couldn't have summoned the Flagship any sooner. We did it as soon as we could and it still managed to build two to its weapons until we thought we could get to it then found we couldn't.

What if you engaged two ships but only counted the lead as engaged. Would that solve the problem you outlined with this strategy? You wouldn't do it in the early going because you'd get killed and by the time you could you'd also be ready for the big baddie, no?

I think the game needs some kind of steady progression to a conclusion where you take your chances and either win or lose.

That would allow you to clear out more than one ship at exactly the time you're ready to take the big guy on. You could handicap it so that ships engaged this way give your ship two less firepower and defense or something similar.

EDIT: we did clear out one ship using a move bounty but I'm not sure we noticed the blockade bounty. We had blockader ships we dispatched so I might have missed something there.

 
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mikecl wrote:
EDIT: we did clear out one ship using a move bounty but I'm not sure we noticed the blockade bounty. We had blockader ships we dispatched so I might have missed something there.



OMG! Yeah man, the Blockader bounty prevents cards from flipping in the Aftermath in the sector you killed it in! THAT'S SO HUGE! This obviously means 0 card flips, but it ALSO means that an overrun sector would turn back to contested for a round! You can see just how key this is. Deciding when and where to kill Blockaders is a huge part of Syndicate Strategy.

Let me touch on Station Manipulation for a quick second: The cards that always flip into ship, you know what you are getting. Its the Boosts that are the wild card draws. Before your next game, thumb through the Opp Boost cards, and identify the worst ones. Make note of the Strike Force side and keep those in the back of your mind. (And hey man, if you wanna cheat a bit and look at the backs during games and just pretend like you know exactly what they are like a vet...I won't tell anyone if you dont )
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Paul Glickman
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Looking at the backs of the cards is almost definitely not cheating, it's alt-tabbing to Google to learn what a unit does in any game.

Blockaders make things contested!? That's awesome! Had we got that right, we might have won a lot more easily. Definitely gonna give this one another shot!
 
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Mike Clarke
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Bigfoote wrote:
mikecl wrote:
EDIT: we did clear out one ship using a move bounty but I'm not sure we noticed the blockade bounty. We had blockader ships we dispatched so I might have missed something there.



OMG! Yeah man, the Blockader bounty prevents cards from flipping in the Aftermath in the sector you killed it in! THAT'S SO HUGE! This obviously means 0 card flips, but it ALSO means that an overrun sector would turn back to contested for a round! You can see just how key this is. Deciding when and where to kill Blockaders is a huge part of Syndicate Strategy.

Let me touch on Station Manipulation for a quick second: The cards that always flip into ship, you know what you are getting. Its the Boosts that are the wild card draws. Before your next game, thumb through the Opp Boost cards, and identify the worst ones. Make note of the Strike Force side and keep those in the back of your mind. (And hey man, if you wanna cheat a bit and look at the backs during games and just pretend like you know exactly what they are like a vet...I won't tell anyone if you dont )


Ok I'll give it another run because it's not fair to slag a game if you're not using all the rules. What do you think of the other idea I proposed?
 
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Kyle S.
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Paul G wrote:
Blockaders make things contested!? That's awesome! Had we got that right, we might have won a lot more easily. Definitely gonna give this one another shot!


As per the rules, if an overrun sector flips 0 cards during the Aftermath flip event, it immediately goes back to contested.

Since the bounty for Blockaders prevents any card flipping in that sector for the whole round, 0 cards would flip in the flip event, thus contesting the sector again, buying you some much needed time.

mikecl wrote:
Ok I'll give it another run because it's not fair to slag a game if you're not using all the rules. What do you think of the other idea I proposed?


Yes, give it another go! Once you add in the elite mode icons and have the basic rules and strategy down, theres a lot to love about this game.

As for your other idea, I think one of the things that can make Strike Force ships different from eachother is their extra scrapping power. If everyone could potentially scrap multiple ships in a round, what makes Claw better than Vigilance at that point? I love game designs of all kinds, and one basic rule I love is "Constraint breed Creativity". Just some food for thought.

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