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Drew1365 wrote:
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Moments after making a grim statement about Ukraine on Friday, the president popped into the East Room, where the first lady, Michelle Obama, was holding a mock state dinner for children to promote her Let’s Move nutrition initiative. “My big thing,” he confessed to the kids, “chips and guacamole!” There was plenty of laughter all around.

How dare that son of a bitch put on a happy face for kids.
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Personally, I've always found the most *annoying* (and ineffective) managers are the ones that - at the first sign of trouble - insist EVERYONE drop EVERYTHING else they are doing, so they can all stand over the shoulders of the only person actually working on the problem...collectively wringing their hands with furrowed brows.

There doesn't seem to be anything particularly time consuming for the President to do, here. Get briefings on the situation? Sounds like he is doing that. Make phone calls to Putin and/or Netanyahu? Can't see why that would take so much time out of a schedule that it would justify throwing it away and running back to DC.

(I agree there is an 'optics' problem, here, as too many in this country seem to LIKE to see the 'drop-everything-to-concentrate-fully-on-wringing-of-hands-with-troubled-facial-expressions' type of managers, but I can't fault someone for not indulging that expectation)
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Haters gonna hate.
 
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verandi wrote:

Haters gonna hate.


It's so nice to see that 6 years of Jesus H Obama has turned RSP into a GW Bush fan club. Cause hey, if Jesus Obama does it then the former haters of Bush here in RSP are all now fans. Right?



So which is it RSP? Bush was even better than Barry O because he continued reading in a real crisis, or, Barry O is just as bad as Bush. Check your hypocrisy before answering please.
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Drew1365 wrote:
kuhrusty wrote:
How dare that son of a bitch put on a happy face for kids.

Well, if he'd stopped to read a book to them -- "My Pet Goat" for example -- then I'm sure we'd all be fine with it. shake

WTF is your point?

Regardless of whether you think Bush could have made a difference in that 10 minutes, do you see how some people might expect a different response from the President the day after a passenger plane gets shot down in the Ukraine than during a coordinated attack on American soil? I mean, I know they both involve airplanes, so that's gotta be confusing, but there are some differences.
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kuhrusty wrote:
Drew1365 wrote:
kuhrusty wrote:
How dare that son of a bitch put on a happy face for kids.

Well, if he'd stopped to read a book to them -- "My Pet Goat" for example -- then I'm sure we'd all be fine with it. shake

WTF is your point?

Regardless of whether you think Bush could have made a difference in that 10 minutes, do you see how some people might expect a different response from the President the day after a passenger plane gets shot down in the Ukraine than during a coordinated attack on American soil? I mean, I know they both involve airplanes, so that's gotta be confusing, but there are some differences.


No, the point is about arguing one way and then another way on a different day; a frictionless moral and logical centre. It is the single basic property that is common to all liberals as conservatives see it. It manifests itself in several ways, such as history starts afresh every morning, for example.

In this case, that President Bush decided not to drop everything and run out of the room in a panic has been described in an innumerable number of negative ways as incompetent and apathetic. However, when President Obama acts along the same lines, it is in characterized as a positive.

Personally, I think Drew is incorrect here. I think President Obama acted as US president ought to, especially in the interconnected time of 2014.

Now, if you add political optics to the equation, justly or not, for some reasons President Obama's optics are judged by liberals to be good, while the same optics were bad for President Bush.

Nothing new. That's what makes a liberal think like a liberal.
.
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isaacc wrote:
In this case, that President Bush decided not to drop everything and run out of the room in a panic has been described in an innumerable number of negative ways as incompetent and apathetic. However, when President Obama acts along the same lines, it is in characterized as a positive.


I think you miss kuhrusty's point.

Not "dropping everything and running out of the room" (in order to continue with a photo op) is a very questionable thing to do when your country is actively in the middle of being attacked.

Not "dropping everything and running out of the room" (in order to continue with a photo op) is a reasonably sensible thing to do when discussing events on the other side of the planet, which have no direct involvement with America, American citizens, or American interests. Enough involvement with our international interests that he should keep tabs on it, for sure, but what else? We aren't "the world police", here.
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Yeah, I was laughing when I read this quote in the NY Times...

"'It is rarely a good idea to return to the White House just for show, when the situation can be handled responsibly from the road,' said Jennifer Palmieri, the White House communications director. 'Abrupt changes to his schedule can have the unintended consequence of unduly alarming the American people or creating a false sense of crisis.'"

I had to check the calendar to see if was 2001 again.
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The funniest thing about RSP today is seeing the O-Lickers defend this:

“Abrupt changes to his schedule can have the unintended consequence of unduly alarming the American people or creating a false sense of crisis.”

Yep. America will panic if it gets wind Obama is going to miss a fund raiser or not play the back nine due to some silly war or passenger jet shoot down. After all, it's only Israel and that yucky Ukraine.
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isaacc wrote:
No, the point is about arguing one way and then another way on a different day; a frictionless moral and logical centre. It is the single basic property that is common to all liberals as conservatives see it. It manifests itself in several ways, such as history starts afresh every morning, for example.

In this case, that President Bush decided not to drop everything and run out of the room in a panic has been described in an innumerable number of negative ways as incompetent and apathetic. However, when President Obama acts along the same lines, it is in characterized as a positive.

Personally, I think Drew is incorrect here. I think President Obama acted as US president ought to, especially in the interconnected time of 2014.

Now, if you add political optics to the equation, justly or not, for some reasons President Obama's optics are judged by liberals to be good, while the same optics were bad for President Bush.

Nothing new. That's what makes a liberal think like a liberal.

When Tripp posts ridiculous stuff, it's easily dismissed, because he's repeatedly said he's just here for laughs. I think of you as serious, so your post is confusing me. You really think conservatives think that way about liberals? You really think the MH17-9/11 situations are similar enough to make Presidential responses worth comparing? Or are you just out for laughs?
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galad2003 wrote:


Obama might be worse than Carter, but even then he wouldn't be 'the Worst President Ever'.

Still really hard to top James Buchanan's immense incompetence in the handling of the building secessionist crisis of 1859.

Darilian
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galad2003 wrote:
Darilian wrote:
galad2003 wrote:


Obama might be worse than Carter, but even then he wouldn't be 'the Worst President Ever'.

Still really hard to top James Buchanan's immense incompetence in the handling of the building secessionist crisis of 1859.

Darilian


Well fuck, so he's the worst President since 1859? I'll concede that point.


Harding is another tough act to follow. So is Tricky Dick Nixon.

Some put Hoover on that list, but I like Herbert Hoover, the 'Great Engineer'.

Darilian
 
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I'm trying to decide if Koldie is buying Putin's line that this is all an organized conspiracy by the Ukranian military trying to discredit the pro-Russian rebels (in which case this is a valid comparison, but I really didn't think anyone BOUGHT that argument)...

...or if he thinks an accidental shot at an airliner mistaken for a troop transport (the other side's argument) is the same thing as an organized plot by an international terrorist organization to seize a series of aircraft and crash them into civilian buildings to maximize non-combatant casualties?
 
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Koldfoot wrote:
XanderF wrote:
I'm trying to decide if Koldie is buying Putin's line that this is all an organized conspiracy by the Ukranian military trying to discredit the pro-Russian rebels (in which case this is a valid comparison, but I really didn't think anyone BOUGHT that argument)...

...or if he thinks an accidental shot at an airliner mistaken for a troop transport (the other side's argument) is the same thing as an organized plot by an international terrorist organization to seize a series of aircraft and crash them into civilian buildings to maximize non-combatant casualties?


Accidental? Source?


Note that I don't mean "accidental" as in "nobody meant to fire that shot".

I don't think there is any disagreement that this was an INTENTIONAL shoot-down...just that the target was not intended.

There have been quite a lot of transports and government aircraft shot down in that region, recently. Which is unsurprisingly, because: occupation and rebellion and all that.

That said, more level heads are looking at this as a 'wrong place and wrong time' thing - pro-Russian rebels accidentally shot the aircraft down, thinking it was another transport (like they'd been shooting down for some time in the same region). Putin's position is that this is a great Ukrainian conspiracy to discredit Russia, and that a Ukraine fighter aircraft tailed the airliner - waiting to shoot it down until it entered the combat area.

If your argument is the latter...I agree, this would be quite a comparable situation and not treating it as an international escalation would be negligent. If you buy the (more sensible, IMHO) former explanation for the issue...I can't fathom how you can compare this to 9/11. It's UNFORTUNATE, for sure. War collateral damage is OFTEN unfortunate. But a conspiracy on the scale of 9/11? Organized attack against a nation?? I don't see it...
 
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A brunette talking-points bimbo? On Fox News? You smash those glass ceilings, Kymbyrly!
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As others have said, the shooting down of the Malaysian airliner and 11/9 are not comparable scenarios.

I personally think this idiotic need to drop everything for a "look serious and leader like" photo shot is ridiculous, and may in fact hinder rather then help. But when your country is attacked, the commander in chief must be seen to be taking an interest.

I also love the hypocrisy of Cons using the "but bush did it" argument.
 
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