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Subject: The next evolution of Resistance rss

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Chris
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Resistance background:
I've played 10-15 games of The Resistance, as well as over 100 logged games of Resistance Avalon (with countless un-logged games). When I first started playing The Resistance, I thought it was fun, but not a 10 for me. Then I played Avalon, and I was floored. I loved the deduction combined with the partial but imperfect information and the fast paced, social nature of the game. I was a little disappointed with the Arthurian theme but the game was so great I was willing to let that one slide.

Initial Impressions:
When I heard that there was an expansion for Resistance that included all of my beloved Avalon roles, but set in a cyberpunk universe, I pictured the "Shut up and Take My Money!" gif.

Little did I know, there was more! I recently was privileged enough to do some play-testing of the newest Hunter module of the Hostile Intent expansion. Keep in mind, I was skeptical about playing Resistance without roles, but I liked the theme better, so I was ready to give it a try.

New Rules:
Each team has a secret leader (called a Chief), and a secret assassin (called a Hunter). The basic game is the same, except that at the end of each mission, someone gets investigated as to whether they are the chief or not. In order for either team to win, not only must they win 3 missions, but their Hunter must also correctly identify the other team's Chief.

This new element to the game adds a whole new layer to the game. No longer is it simply a race to get 3 missions by any means necessary, the investigation phases become critical. If someone has a bad poker face and outs themselves as a spy, they can still be useful to the team by helping to throw the resistance team off the scent of the spy Chief.

Verdict:
In many ways, this new module feels like the Resistance game I know and love, but the Hunter module adds a new tactical element to the game. One of my favorite moments in Avalon is that moment when the Assassin reveals, after the red team has lost, and the Assassin makes one last ditch effort to strike at Merlin to steal the win. The Hunter module guarantees that, no matter which side you draw, you'll get at least one of those moments!
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Julian Vickers
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So is this a review..or?

I also backed the kickstarter and I'm pretty excited about it. I'm thinking of proxying up some cards to play these roles with.
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Ian Noble
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Juju114 wrote:
So is this a review..or?

I also backed the kickstarter and I'm pretty excited about it. I'm thinking of proxying up some cards to play these roles with.


Looks like a review to me. I actually played A LOT of these games with Chris, so I can vouch for his Resistance knowledge. Also, what he said about the Assassin moments. Many of the games came down to a big discussion on who is Merlin. Im a big fan of base Avalon, but the addition are cool to change things up a bit.
 
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Chris
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Juju114 wrote:
So is this a review..or?

I also backed the kickstarter and I'm pretty excited about it. I'm thinking of proxying up some cards to play these roles with.


Yep - I helped playtest the Hunter module.
 
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Julian Vickers
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alenen wrote:
Juju114 wrote:
So is this a review..or?

I also backed the kickstarter and I'm pretty excited about it. I'm thinking of proxying up some cards to play these roles with.


Yep - I helped playtest the Hunter module.


Sorry, from the look of your original post, it looked more like a short overview of the expansion. I'm eager to hear more personal opinions and experiences
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Kārlis Jēriņš
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I'm not entirely sure how this is going to work. Could you clarify, please?

In Avalon, the Assassin got to make his attempt in case the Minions lost the missions, and that was a chance to steal the win. Going by your phrasing, it seems that here it is the winning team that must make the attempt. If so, and they miss, what happens? Does the opposing team automatically win or do they have to guess the others' chief as well? And if so, what happens if they miss as well?
 
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Chris
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TheNameWasTaken wrote:
I'm not entirely sure how this is going to work. Could you clarify, please?

In Avalon, the Assassin got to make his attempt in case the Minions lost the missions, and that was a chance to steal the win. Going by your phrasing, it seems that here it is the winning team that must make the attempt. If so, and they miss, what happens? Does the opposing team automatically win or do they have to guess the others' chief as well? And if so, what happens if they miss as well?


It works like this - After the resistance team completes its 3rd mission successfully, the resistance Hunter must reveal himself, and then, similar to the Assassin/Merlin relationship in Avalon, the resistance Hunter must correctly identify the Spy Chief.

If the resistance hunter is correct, the resistance wins. If he is incorrect, then the result of the 3rd successful resistance win is switched to a spy victory.

The exact same setup works for the spies as well (3rd failed mission, Hunter reveals and must identify resistance chief, success = victory, fail = flip the mission to resistance win and continue)

If it happens to be the 5th mission, then Hunters take turns back and forth trying to identify the opposing Chief.
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Davido
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I get the IB&B emails, but somehow this slipped under my radar. That's what I get for not making it out to game in the foothills
Inst-pledge, thanks for the review and heads up.
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Ian G
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I enjoyed Avalon quite a bit. However once our group got a strong meta game it seems like the game is won or lost some there between the 1st and 2nd mission. In addition many of the Avalon alternate modes either help one side too far in one direction.

Would these changes significantly change the Meta, replay ability, and balance?

Is it worth getting if I already have Avalon?
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Chris
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Manyallaluk wrote:
I enjoyed Avalon quite a bit. However once our group got a strong meta game it seems like the game is won or lost some there between the 1st and 2nd mission. In addition many of the Avalon alternate modes either help one side too far in one direction.

Would these changes significantly change the Meta, replay ability, and balance?

Is it worth getting if I already have Avalon?


Assuming you don't care about the theme differences, the game feels different. There's discussion over who gets the investigator token, there's discussion over who should be investigated sometimes, there's discussion over what the investigator saw. This makes the games take a little longer than before, which is ok with me, because I like the discussion.

I guess my advice is - If you enjoy Resistance style games, this is another take on an idea you already like. If you're not a fan of games like Resistance, then this isn't going to change your mind. As for whether it's "worth" getting, that's something only you and your budget can answer

One small note, I tested it primarily at 6 and 7 players, and it's still best with 7. The 6 player count was still interesting, and for me, better than the base game with 6 due to the investigation stuff.

Edits: Typos and syntax
 
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Ambie
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alenen wrote:
TheNameWasTaken wrote:
I'm not entirely sure how this is going to work. Could you clarify, please?

In Avalon, the Assassin got to make his attempt in case the Minions lost the missions, and that was a chance to steal the win. Going by your phrasing, it seems that here it is the winning team that must make the attempt. If so, and they miss, what happens? Does the opposing team automatically win or do they have to guess the others' chief as well? And if so, what happens if they miss as well?


It works like this - After the resistance team completes its 3rd mission successfully, the resistance Hunter must reveal himself, and then, similar to the Assassin/Merlin relationship in Avalon, the resistance Hunter must correctly identify the Spy Chief.

If the resistance hunter is correct, the resistance wins. If he is incorrect, then the result of the 3rd successful resistance win is switched to a spy victory.

The exact same setup works for the spies as well (3rd failed mission, Hunter reveals and must identify resistance chief, success = victory, fail = flip the mission to resistance win and continue)

If it happens to be the 5th mission, then Hunters take turns back and forth trying to identify the opposing Chief.


Do the Chiefs have any additional information that would make them act differently than normal resistance/spies? With Merlin/Assassin, the Assassin could look for clues as to who Merlin was since Merlin knew who the spies were, but if there's no additional power to the Chiefs, it seems like the first guess for the Chief would just be a blind guess. And then the other side would have the advantage, since they know who the Hunter is and won't pick that person as the Chief.

Edit - nevermind, just re-read about the investigator token.
 
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Chris
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For the benefit of others reading the thread:
Each mission has an investigation phase where the investigator hands cards to their target. The target then returns one of those cards back to the investigator. (Similar to lady of the lake mechanically). The cards reveal whether the target is a chief or not a chief.

This is part of what makes the game more strategic. It used to be that you wanted to win as soon as you can. With this module, you may not want to win right away, because if you guess wrong you give the other team more information. Particularly this is true in 6 player because there are only 2 spies.
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Marcus
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Can a player be investigated more than once by different players?

 
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Chris
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AmongFriends wrote:
Can a player be investigated more than once by different players?



Sure, but that's something only a dirty spy would do!
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Kārlis Jēriņš
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alenen wrote:
TheNameWasTaken wrote:
I'm not entirely sure how this is going to work. Could you clarify, please?

In Avalon, the Assassin got to make his attempt in case the Minions lost the missions, and that was a chance to steal the win. Going by your phrasing, it seems that here it is the winning team that must make the attempt. If so, and they miss, what happens? Does the opposing team automatically win or do they have to guess the others' chief as well? And if so, what happens if they miss as well?


It works like this - After the resistance team completes its 3rd mission successfully, the resistance Hunter must reveal himself, and then, similar to the Assassin/Merlin relationship in Avalon, the resistance Hunter must correctly identify the Spy Chief.

If the resistance hunter is correct, the resistance wins. If he is incorrect, then the result of the 3rd successful resistance win is switched to a spy victory.

The exact same setup works for the spies as well (3rd failed mission, Hunter reveals and must identify resistance chief, success = victory, fail = flip the mission to resistance win and continue)

If it happens to be the 5th mission, then Hunters take turns back and forth trying to identify the opposing Chief.


Okay, got it. Thanks for the clarification!
 
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Adam Harrison
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When is the investigation token handed out? Is it part of the vote, or does it only get handed after the mission result is revealed? I read somewhere else that the leader is the investigator if the mission is successful, is that true?
 
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Chris
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There were a few different ways this was tested.

In the most recent version I tested, the leader hands out an "investigator" token at the same time the mission team is being proposed. So you're voting not only on who will go on the mission, but who will hold the investigator token.

Once the mission completes, if it's a success, the leader investigates whoever he wants. If the mission fails, the person with the investigator token gets to investigate anyone he likes.

There were plenty of times when a leader would propose a mission I was ok with, but I had to downvote the mission team proposal because I didn't like who had the investigator token. I also approved a few missions, even suspecting there was a spy on the mission, because I was ok with the person who had the investigator token. As the mission team proposer, handing the investigator token to someone can swing their vote to vote for a mission they might not otherwise approve "Well, if a spy fails this mission, at least I'll get to investigate someone"
 
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Jason Boyd
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Thanks for the review Chris.

Just wondering, does the new Hunter/Chief mode do away with the Merlin/Assassin cards. Is this a Merlin/Assassin v2?
 
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