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Subject: Combo question rss

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Jonny G
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I just read on a deck builder that there is a snoop+neural EMP combo. I am wondering if I am missing something because I can usually only get the trace to go off once or twice. I doubt that is enough to drain the hand for Neural. Is there another aspect to this that I am missing?
 
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Micheal Keane
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You're not missing much. You'll likely need more than just Snoop to trash the Runner's hand.

One thing to remember is that Snoop's power counters are used as a paid ability. So if the Runner gets down to a couple cards at their end of their turn, you trash what's left of their hand and then hit them with the EMP.
 
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Snoop counters act like an additional Neural EMP in hand. You don't use Snoop or Neural EMP unless it results in a flatline, that is the "combo".
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Captain Frisk
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gawbo005 wrote:
I just read on a deck builder that there is a snoop+neural EMP combo. I am wondering if I am missing something because I can usually only get the trace to go off once or twice. I doubt that is enough to drain the hand for Neural. Is there another aspect to this that I am missing?


Nope - you're basically coming to the conclusion that most people have associated with using ice for combos.

Basically - subroutines on ice work 1 time - maybe. Any time the subroutine is landing more than that - and the runner is either bad, or you are in trouble.
 
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Captain_Frisk wrote:
Basically - subroutines on ice work 1 time - maybe. Any time the subroutine is landing more than that - and the runner is either bad, or you are in trouble.

Awesome, 6 credits for a 6 strength sentry is a really good deal! I wonder why we don't see it more often...
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Captain Frisk
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slacks wrote:
Captain_Frisk wrote:
Basically - subroutines on ice work 1 time - maybe. Any time the subroutine is landing more than that - and the runner is either bad, or you are in trouble.

Awesome, 6 credits for a 6 strength sentry is a really good deal! I wonder why we don't see it more often...


Disclaimer: Not Making News:

Because if the runner has economic advantage, you've paid $6 for a piece of ice that the runner can run through for $3. I don't know about your meta, but Andy and Kate are popular in mine, so then you're down to $2...

If you have economic advantage.... wait how did you do this? You just spent $6 rezzing snoop!
 
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Captain_Frisk wrote:
slacks wrote:
Captain_Frisk wrote:
Basically - subroutines on ice work 1 time - maybe. Any time the subroutine is landing more than that - and the runner is either bad, or you are in trouble.

Awesome, 6 credits for a 6 strength sentry is a really good deal! I wonder why we don't see it more often...


Disclaimer: Not Making News:

Because if the runner has economic advantage, you've paid $6 for a piece of ice that the runner can run through for $3. I don't know about your meta, but Andy and Kate are popular in mine, so then you're down to $2...

If you have economic advantage.... wait how did you do this? You just spent $6 rezzing snoop!


For some reason every time I look at this card I think it is trace 6! I have no idea why when it is clearly trace 3, just like last time I looked at it. :p
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Captain Frisk
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slacks wrote:

For some reason every time I look at this card I think it is trace 6! I have no idea why when it is clearly trace 3, just like last time I looked at it.


Yeah - this is why it never lands. Maybe with that new NBN asset!
 
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Markus ScratchingGeekyItch
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How do you not have an economic advantage over the runner as NBN? They need to run everything, trashing all your Sansans and Ashes or whatever. Gaining Economic advantage as corp nowadays is easy unless you get siphon chained early. I have landed all 3 traces for 6 netdamage on Shinobi in Making News many times.
 
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markusjarlstig wrote:
How do you not have an economic advantage over the runner as NBN? They need to run everything, trashing all your Sansans and Ashes or whatever. Gaining Economic advantage as corp nowadays is easy unless you get siphon chained early. I have landed all 3 traces for 6 netdamage on Shinobi in Making News many times.


The majority of tournament winning runners fall into two camps on economy;
1. Account Siphon
2. Kate+ Prepaid Voicepad
Then add more burst economy (Dirty Laundry, Sure Gamble, Lucky Find, etc.).

There are others, but these are the large majority of economies right now. IMO it is not a good idea to plan around not getting hit by an early Account Siphon.
 
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Markus ScratchingGeekyItch
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Yeah I have variants of both those runner archetypes and play them often. Still not enough money to run Ash server twice to trash sansans repeatedly and still be rich. The thing is you play against people expectations of what your ID does. So if they see Ash and Sansan they will have very little hesitation facechecking all ice even on low/semilow creds.
 
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Yi Sheng Siow
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for what it's worth. there was a tournament winning list a while ago on stimhack that ran snoops and some other damage(can't remember whether it was emp or something else)
 
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Andrew Barrett
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Hi Guys,

I made and played the snoop+emp deck, I will post some clarifications here as well as on the NDB page.

Invasion of privacy allows you to choose and discard events and resources, snoop tokens allow you to hit anything (you usually get a snoop token if you rez a snoop) Neural EMP is a random discard obviously.

Snoop reveals the runners hand to you when they run it, if they break it or not, it's an on encounter ability so you get to see the types of cards they have in hand, this will let you know if it is worth using invasion of privacy or not.

Invasion of privacy you only use on turn one after hedge fund to ruin an opponent, or after you have snooped their hand and know you will hit something (there are situations you would do it blindly, but that's not important for our purposes).

If you snoop an opponent and get a counter, and see that their hand is program event event resource, on your turn you can invasion of privacy for 3, their hand becomes program -- -- --, you can snoop the program with a counter, and use your last click to flatline them with neural emp.

Snoop is basically house of knives for NBN, you just pay for it, which is why you have 3 sweeps weeks and 3 melange mining corps, you have a bunch of credit draining stuff like NAPD and sansan city grid, if you have the right cards for a combo you can just put 1 snoop on a remote, and install sansans, napds, snares, whatever behind it every turn to put the runner into a position where you can kill him or win with an astrotrain.
 
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Zak Jarvis
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You're not missing anything except, maybe, how useful even a single 'Snoop' token is. Especially if you run it as an import in a Jinteki deck, one card can make all the difference. Never mind being "House of Knives for NBN", run it in Jinteki alongside 'House of Knives'. Try it with 'Tori Hanzo' to cause brain damage with HOK tokens on her server. See how you can engineer a situation where the runner needs a full hand to run without facing instant death even before hitting any traps or damaging ICE.
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