Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
47 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Police Precinct» Forums » General

Subject: The Discussion about THE STING! rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Welcome to "THE STING!"

We are here to discuss a particular card.

Yes...

Just ONE card!

We think it's a very cool card that offers players a nice addition to the Event Deck.

Dan King (Game Boy Geek) has long been an advocate of adding MORE cards to the Event Deck, and he was nice enough to Guest Star on our latest episode of Police Precinct by adding a card to the mix.

This is an original Dan King Card Design...



We are very honored and excited to have Dan involved in this way.

Thanks Dan!



Hang on!

This discussion is not quite over yet.

We would love YOUR feedback on a few areas regarding this card as follows...

UNDERSTAND
We would like to invite anyone who is an experienced Police Precinct player to answer this poll...

Poll
Thought this card does bring some new dynamics to the game, as it is written now, I feel like it is...
NOT confusing to me at all, furthermore I predict that other players will NOT have issues figuring this card.
It took me a minute to really understand it, but I think overall it's fine and I think CMG should print it as is.
SOMEWHAT confusing to me, I hope it does not get printed in this state, and I will post why I feel this way below.
      15 answers
Poll created by Common Man Games


ON CAR
Next up, tell us your thoughts on this...
First we need to explain that some of us (within the Lines/Karl/Dan group feel that it would be better to have the Punks ON the actual cop car as they drove around Commonville, BUT some of us are also concerned that this will create confusion among people regarding if those Punks can now be considered to be part of a Bad Hood that adjoins one of the Street Spaces that the car enters (or worse yet a Street Riot or something like that!). Soooooo...

Poll
When it comes to the STING card, I feel like...
Yes, the Punks should go on the Character Card to avoid confusion.
No, the Punks should always be ON the board until they make their way back into general supply, and furthermore, I do NOT think anyone will be confused by them riding in (on-top-of) a player's car.
      16 answers
Poll created by Common Man Games


MISSING
Look at the image above (the latest version with MORE white-space), and then the image below (the old version featuring "more words"), THEN answer this...

Poll
When I look at these two cards...
I see NOTHING missing in the new version. Meaning that I do not feel like anything critical is being left out in the new version.
I DO see some issues with the new card. Something DID get lost in the translation from one card to the next, and I will comment below to describe what I think it is.
      12 answers
Poll created by Common Man Games




Thanks in advance to ALL who join in on this discussion!

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Delaric wrote:
The older version is a little more clear, but also there is so much text it's hard to separate out the instructions. I can definitely see problems arising on first seeing this card in game.

If there's any way to bullet-point the instructions that might help, or otherwise separate out the steps that need to be taken a little more.

Alternately, with the new card, I think it would be helpful to separate the instructions within that paragraph. So it would read:

Quote:
After the next ... arresting officer's Character card. They must be dropped of at the Bank and left there for one turn. Then, they must be picked up from the Bank and dropped off at the Station. After the punks are dropped off at the Station, return them to the supply.


That separation and more clear enunciation of the procedure makes a lot more sense to me. I like the way the guidelines are laid out at the bottom of the card in the new version.


Hey Justin!!!!

I like your approach!

I challenge you to a duel!

No, wait, I mean...

I challenge you to a re-write!

I would love to see what you can come up with that makes good sense, keeps fun theming in tact, and uses the same amount of space as our "new version".

Here is the wording...

(have fun with it)

blankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblank

The GBG was paid off by a gang to
create falsified evidence alleging excessive force. The Punks must be taken to the Bank for a pay-off and then back to the Station to sign paperwork.

After the next successful arrest attempt, place all arrested Punks on arresting officer’s Character card. They must be dropped off at the Bank and picked up again on a different turn to be brought to the Station for the final drop off. After that return them to the general supply!

The Punks must always be on a Character card or in the bank and can´t be left out on the street.

The Punk tokens may be swapped between players if their cars share the same Street Space.

Swapping, pick-ups & drop-offs can all
happen DURING movement and are NOT
considered actions.

blankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblankblank

If you are willing to take this challenge then I do hereby wish you...

Good luck!

And THANKS!!!!


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lines J. Hutter
Germany
Munich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Common Man Games wrote:
I challenge you to a re-write!

I´d like to add to this challenge:
"...wihtout increasing text length"
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
hang on...

Let me check it.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Welcome to the Justin version of "THE STING!"



You may notice that I did a little editing.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Delaric wrote:
lol. Well don't let anyone tell you you have an easy job


It always looks easier from the outside for sure!

laugh
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Justin, let me ask you...

1. Are you ok with my edits?

2. Do you think that this version is easier to understand than the earlier one?

If you do...

I want to put it to a poll.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nah!

wow
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Let me tell you why...

The card must stand alone (can't link to the rules as it is part of an expansion not the base-game).

(and the rules are packed)



I really like the team-work aspect of the swapping.



That said...

Let's hear what others think!

Anyone got a feeling about the swapping?

Love it?

Hate it?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Justin,

what about this...

Common Man Games wrote:
Justin, let me ask you...

1. Are you ok with my edits?

2. Do you think that this version is easier to understand than the earlier one?

If you do...

I want to put it to a poll.



thoughts?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
cool!

Thanks for your involvement in this!!!

thumbsupthumbsupthumbsup

PS - I assume you are the one person (up to this point) out of 7 (who have voted so far) in the "UNDERSTAND" poll that felt the card should NOT be printed as is. If so, I assume that at this point you would cast your vote in the middle zone ("It took me a minute to really understand it, but I think overall it's fine and I think CMG should print it as is"). Is that about right? I only ask because I do not want to move forward with this card until we have made every effort to get it to the point of being the best it can be!


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jake Staines
United Kingdom
Grantham
Lincolnshire
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
To be honest, regardless of the wording the sentiment of the card is the part that bothers me the most. The suggestion seems to be that the police are happy to just pay off extortionist gang members as if it's perfectly OK and happens every day?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lines J. Hutter
Germany
Munich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Common Man Games wrote:
I really like the team-work aspect of the swapping

+1
I'd keep it.
It also stays in line with the green van which you can "swap" too in a similar manner
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Krajewski
United States
Fitchburg
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Here's my attempt at it. Trying to make it both clear and briefer:


The GBG was paid off by a gang to create falsified evidence alleging excessive force!

After the next successful arrest attempt:
- Place all arrested Punks on the arresting officer’s car
- Drop off the Punks at the Bank for a pay-off
- On a later turn, pick up the Punks from the Bank and drop them off at the Station to sign the paperwork (and return them to the general supply)

Punk tokens may be swapped freely between players in the same Street Space and the Bank DURING movement and are NOT considered actions.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Krajewski
United States
Fitchburg
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Bichatse wrote:
To be honest, regardless of the wording the sentiment of the card is the part that bothers me the most. The suggestion seems to be that the police are happy to just pay off extortionist gang members as if it's perfectly OK and happens every day?

And I agree with you here as well. At least the way it reads it seems like the police are just paying the bad guys, and doesn't really seem like a good thing you'd want to do.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Bichatse wrote:
To be honest, regardless of the wording the sentiment of the card is the part that bothers me the most. The suggestion seems to be that the police are happy to just pay off extortionist gang members as if it's perfectly OK and happens every day?


+1 from me too, but...

-1 at the same time.

Let me explain:

I want the game to be...

Fun, playful, thematic, realistic, funny, serious, educational, the everyday nitty-gritty, the unusual extreme, and...

Everything in-between!

sometimes these things butt up against each other making for tricky choices.

One of the critical things to me (that needs to happen always with this game) is that the folks who work in this industry (Law enforcement) feel supported by our community and put in a good light.

There are those who don't deserve this treatment, but the vast majority do.

This is why we call a bad cop, a...

"Dirty Cop"!

And the cops who are not "Dirty" get referred to in the game as...

"Good Cops"

We try to maintain this spirit throughout the game.

When this card was initially discussed as a possible card to include, the card implied that the police really were using excessive force, which I was careful to eliminate.

I feel like there are lots of situations in our modern society where organizations (businesses/government, etc) have to do things that they don't feel great about and shouldn't have to (settle lawsuits, etc.).

And that we as a society and Law Enforcement organizations in particular have accepted that, for the greater good, we will allow certain criminals to receive special treatment (lenient sentences, etc) if they give info or even more so if they testify against another bad guy (which is much of what our game SNITCH is about).

So...

I don't see the pay-off as a great thing (+1), but maybe more of an unfortunate part of our world.

Overall I see it as just a fun card to include in with all the rest (-1).

(imho)


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mkrajew wrote:
Here's my attempt at it. Trying to make it both clear and briefer:


The GBG was paid off by a gang to create falsified evidence alleging excessive force!

After the next successful arrest attempt:
- Place all arrested Punks on the arresting officer’s car
- Drop off the Punks at the Bank for a pay-off
- On a later turn, pick up the Punks from the Bank and drop them off at the Station to sign the paperwork (and return them to the general supply)

Punk tokens may be swapped freely between players in the same Street Space and the Bank DURING movement and are NOT considered actions.



looking promising!

will post in a minute.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Welcome to the Mike version of "THE STING!"



You may notice that I did a little editing.



(larger font size and more white space)

Anyone feel like this leaves out crit info?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Let's get down to business here...

Poll
When it comes to the Mike version of the card, this is how I feel...
PERFECT - it blends simplicity with clarity and I love it!
BEST - It might not be "perfect" so to speak, but it is the best version yet, and I think CMG should print it as-is.
NEEDS IMPROVEMENT - This card is pretty cool in a lot of ways, but I do think it is missing critical bits of info, and I will explain more in the thread as to exactly what I think it's missing.
      10 answers
Poll created by Common Man Games


Be heard!

and...

Thanks!!!

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Filippelli
United States
Kenosha
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I like Mike's version. I have one comment about the first sentence concerning the words, "alleging excessive force." From the way it is written, it looks like the evidence is doing the alleging and not the GBG. Begin the sentence with: "Alleging excessive force," and then add the rest of it to see if that makes it more clear.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dootsman2002 wrote:
I like Mike's version. I have one comment about the first sentence concerning the words, "alleging excessive force." From the way it is written, it looks like the evidence is doing the alleging and not the GBG. Begin the sentence with: "Alleging excessive force," and then add the rest of it to see if that makes it more clear.


Now reads like this...

The GBG was paid off by a gang to create falsified evidence which supports allegations of excessive force!

Sound good?

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Filippelli
United States
Kenosha
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Sounds Sah-weet!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Cool!

I'll generate the card here in a little bit.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Common Man Games
United States
Denver
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Welcome to the "New and Improved" Mike version of "THE STING!"



This includes the edits suggested by Mark.



 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jazzy Bear
United States
Quad-Cities
Iowa
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Clean!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.