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Subject: Want to get into Ambush, but don't want to buy the old game. Any alternatives? rss

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Jeremy Wong
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This game is fairly old, and I'm having trouble finding it.

That said ,I'm still interested in playing this Pre-WOTC Avalon Hill classic.

I'm curious if anyone has any experience with this game as a print-and-play, or how critical the different components are, or if you've ever tried to play it on VASSAL (or if that's even an option!)

Thanks cordially for the help in advance, BGG.
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Confusion Under Fire
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There are a few for sale in the market place which are reasonably priced.
I doubt very much if there is a PnP version and I am sure that you have to own the game to play on VASSAL.

The game has a lot of essential components that would be hard to recreate such as the paragraph booklet and the sleeve.

The system is quite unique and apart from very similar games in the family there is nothing else quite like it. It is an experience you will not regret if you do buy it.
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Jeremiah Lee
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Yeah, I gotta agree with Mike (above). This would be impossible to play on vassal without the components, and it's not a PnP friendly game. This is a special system, with some odd components that don't really fit into what's available to (or sensible for) PnPers to craft. I've built many games, and this is not something I'd ever want to do, even if I had the time.

$40/50, as it's listed on the bgg marketplace isn't outside of the normal for a new game, and this game is absolutely worth the cost.
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Pokey 64
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Don't forget to keep an eye out for the sister game set in the Pacific theatre. It plays exactly the same as Ambush!.

Battle Hymn and the expansion Battle Hymn: Leatherneck.

If not that, there's also Open Fire. It's very similar but your platoon is tanks rather than soldiers. I say similar because they changed a couple mechanisms but the game plays very much like Ambush! and Battle Hymn.
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T. Dauphin
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It's a Victory Games creation, BTW, not Avalon Hill.

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Kurt
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You might want to check out Two Hour Wargames. They have a game called Nuts!. Although it's a miniatures rules set, it's man to man combat in WW II and the gameplay has a real Ambush! feel. Everything that can be done in Ambush can be done in Nuts!.

You can download the core rules for free at the Two Hour Wargames website to get a feel for the mechanics.
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Pelle Nilsson
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tekawiz wrote:
You might want to check out Two Hour Wargames. They have a game called Nuts!. Although it's a miniatures rules set, it's man to man combat in WW II and the gameplay has a real Ambush! feel. Everything that can be done in Ambush can be done in Nuts!.

You can download the core rules for free at the Two Hour Wargames website to get a feel for the mechanics.


And a similar campaign of solitaire missions to play like Ambush has?
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Jim P
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Jeremiah_Lee wrote:
Yeah, I gotta agree with Mike (above). This would be impossible to play on vassal without the components, and it's not a PnP friendly game. This is a special system, with some odd components that don't really fit into what's available to (or sensible for) PnPers to craft. I've built many games, and this is not something I'd ever want to do, even if I had the time.

$40/50, as it's listed on the bgg marketplace isn't outside of the normal for a new game, and this game is absolutely worth the cost.


I agree here too. With the cost of games nowadays this would be a steal.

The cost to PnP this game would most likely cost more than $40 to complete.
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Kurt
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The reason I even mention this comparison is because a few days ago I was looking for scenarios to play with Nuts!

I looked at the Amubush! mission descriptions and they can easily be implemented in Nuts! and they would be replayable.

For example: Mission 1 Bloody St. Mick.

In Nuts! your squad makes the approach to the building objectives, just like Ambush! I may run into something that is "just the wind blowing" or I may run into a German or two or even a squad may pop up any where on the board with LOS. Not the same locations like in Ambush! There are tables that will allow the Germans to move or charge into melee.

Once the shooting starts there is also an option to bring in reinforcements, German or American.

In Nuts! whenever your squad approaches a building, I will have to check for occupants, could be nothing, could be Germans, could be civilians. There are also rules for questioning civilians. Maybe I give them some chocolate and cigarettes to help them talk. There are rules for searching buildings/bodies for objects.

At anytime there can be enemy snipers, mine fields or be on the receiving end of a artillery barrage. There are rules for vehicles.

Nuts! also has a campaign system unlike Ambush! If you want predesigned scenarios/campaigns, THW does offer expansion books for the Pacific, Eastern Front, Battle of the Bulge, Hurtigen Forest, 82nd AB in Normandy, even weird WW II.

For me there is no reason to bring back out Ambush! since Nuts! does the same or better. The amount of missions are limited by your imagination. Although it's more fun to play in a 3d environment, you could use the Ambush! components with a little tweaking.
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Pelle Nilsson
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Nuts! does sound like something worth taking a closer look at. Thanks for the description.
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Kurt
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Pelle, I'd be interested in hearing what you think.

I just reviewed all the Ambush! scenarios again and will try to play them in Nuts!. I'm going to add the random events from Shell Shock, such as the ambulance arrives, war correspondent, dogfight in the sky, etc. I'll set up my table top as close to the Ambush! maps as possible and have my squad make their way to the objective.
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Kurt
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I just picked up three of the Nuts expansion books. The scenarios have a similar Ambush! flavor to them.

Blood Upon the Risers, These are the airborne rules with 11 scenarios. Taking villages, capturing enemy OP, defend/hold a bridge etc.

The Big Hurt, There are 21 scenarios covering the Battle of the Hurtgen Forest but are generic enough to be used for any skirmish. Some include capturing a dam, providing cover while a tank is being repaired, destroy a heavy bunker, etc.

Clash of Titans, covers urban warfare on the eastern front but are generic enough where the fighting can be in any city. There are 6 scenarios. Some of the rules include foraging for food, boats/swimming, animals from escaped zoos, booby traps, sewer fighting, getting strafed/bombed, snow storms and more.

And this is all solitaire.

So if you're looking for an Ambush! alternative the Nuts rules and expansions should give you a pretty close experience.
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Ralph Graham
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Shown below where you can get downloads of the complete set, all the games, for about $7. The only problem I've had is that in the original Ambush game the downloaded maps don't show the difference between levels 2 and 3 on either map A or B. The colors look the same to me. You can get the info for the maps from the Vassal module- hope they're accurate. The seller of the downloads at gamers-garage was not helpful in straightening this out.

www.gamers-garage.com

-Look for their Avalon Hill/Victory Games Ambush Collection
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John "Omega" Williams
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Neet and all to see some of that up for sale.

But that does not look even remotely legal. It looks like they gatherd scans from all over and are selling them.
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Ralph Graham
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I wondered about it, but they may have acquired the rights, or did they expire under copyright law? I am presuming they did. They did are offering bundles of other old games, too.
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Russ Williams
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ragram wrote:
I wondered about it, but they may have acquired the rights, or did they expire under copyright law? I am presuming they did.

Copyright lasts for decades after the death of the creator. The game is certainly still under copyright unless (very unusually) the game was explicitly placed in the public domain or something, which I seriously doubt happened with Ambush.
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Jeremiah Lee
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russ wrote:
ragram wrote:
I wondered about it, but they may have acquired the rights, or did they expire under copyright law? I am presuming they did.

Copyright lasts for decades after the death of the creator. The game is certainly still under copyright unless (very unusually) the game was explicitly placed in the public domain or something, which I seriously doubt happened with Ambush.
Agreed. It seems very unlikely that the rights are available to this website. That said, it's possible.
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John "Omega" Williams
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No. Its not even remotely possible. About all of the Metagaming material is still locked up by the owner. There were tries as recent as last year and still no success. Same for the General and other magazines.
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Pelle Nilsson
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Omega2064 wrote:
No. Its not even remotely possible. About all of the Metagaming material is still locked up by the owner. There were tries as recent as last year and still no success. Same for the General and other magazines.


It is probably the same Australian dude that has had at least two different sites selling similar materials in the past. Don't think he ever had Ambush! on the old sites though.
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Matthias Kievernagel
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Quote:
Same for the General...

Though this one can be found on the internet archive.
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John "Omega" Williams
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mkiever wrote:
Quote:
Same for the General...

Though this one can be found on the internet archive.


Being on Internet Archive in absolutely no way makes it legal.
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