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Subject: Game Etiquette Court-You Be the Jury! rss

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Erin Sparks
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Hear ye, Hear ye, the court of gaming etiquette is now in session. The following occurred a couple of weekends ago and the court is asked to hear the case of "J" and "S". The Jury will be reminded that the specific rule of the particular game mentioned is not the focus of this case, rather the question rests upon the handling of the rule discrepancy.

5 players sat down to play "Scene it: TV", a TV party/trivia game where clues appear on a tv screen. Some of the clues in this game start out as pixelated pictures which get clearer and clearer over the course of 30 seconds. A player wins by being the first to guess whose picture it is. About halfway through the game (after many of these kinds of clues), the host, "S", tells "J" that she is breaking the rules by answering more than once during the 30 seconds. A quick check in the rule book shows that it only states "the first person to give the correct answer gets another turn." 3 of the 5 agree that this does not prevent multiple guesses, so long as you're the first to guess correctly. The 4th is unclear about her position but is willing to go with the majority. "S" is adamant - only one guess per puzzle is allowed. He declares a "house rule". He becomes upset that the other players do not support the "house rule". A rift develops between "S" and "J".

The Defense ("J"): The rule does not prevent multiple guesses. The majority agreed with this finding. "House Rules" should be agreed upon by all players and discussed BEFORE the game, not in the middle.

The Prosecution: ("S"): No TV game shows allow multiple guesses. A "house rule" means that if it's your house, you make the rule. It is rude to dispute this rule, just as if you are asked to remove your shoes in someone's house and you refuse to do so.

Jury, who do you find for? In a wild departure from normal trial procedure, you may ask questions of the court if you require any clarifications.
 
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"S" needs to understand that if no one else likes the house rule, they'll be alone in their house as everyone else goes off to have fun elsewhere.
 
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Larry Welborn
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Discounting whether or not the "house rule" is a good rule or not, I would support "J". House rules should generally be applied only before the game starts and with majority agreement. If a problem arises during a game that requires a house rule, then once again the majority should rule.

The easiest solution would have been to finish the first game, then play again using the house rule and let everyone decide which way they like to play for future games. Although, there may not be any future games if the animosity continues.
 
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Luke Morris
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It's my ball and I'm going home shake
 
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Jay Borden
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The way you start it is the way you end it. Any rule changes are saved until the next game.

I never played the game, but I would guess "one answer" is the correct way. Regardless, I would still want to finish the game with the same rules we've been playing with up until that point.
 
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Ken H.
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1. Scene It is very light, non-competitive, and short. You should go out of your way to avoid rules disputes in games like this. What's the point? The game will be over in a minute anyway. From the story, it looks like S was the instigator here -- he should have just let it go. If you absolutely must dispute the rule, at least do it between games.

2. You can't add house rules in the middle of a game! Strike two for S. It's one thing if the printed rule is unclear and the game cannot continue without a ruling. That doesn't apply here though -- the rule was crystal clear and S just didn't understand it.

3. Unless S is a casino, with a group of armed guards ready to throw people out onto the sidewalk, then he needs to take a lighter stance on what a "house rule" is. Was he providing free drinks? Some sort of door prize? If not, then he should suck it up and go with the majority vote....

J wins by a mile.
 
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Michael Barlow
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1) TV Scene it? Get a real game.

2) Troubled interpretations of rules should be discussed before a game starts, preferably by email during the week before.

(Most games my game group plays have house rules. I always explicitly state that we will not discuss rules questions/problems/intrepretations on the night we play because it cuts down on play time.)

[With one troubled soul, I've unfortunatly had to repeatedly state that just because the rules don't explicitly state that he can't do something I never thought to add in, doesn't mean he can--but that's another topic]

3) Introduction of house rules is never to occur during a game.

4) S needs a break from the game. And a life.
 
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Diz Hooper
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It sounds like S is a sore loser. House rules should be decided before a game starts. If it is an unanticipated ambiguity, then the house rule can be discussed and used in the NEXT game. If the rule ambiguity makes it impossible to play the game without implementing a house rule, then majority rules. If a grown man (or woman) starts throwing fits like a kindergartener, that's a good sign for everyone to go home and decline invitations in the future.
 
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Kevin Brown
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I think the house rule is a good one, otherwise you would have people just shouting out as many names as they could as fast as they could whether they could tell who it was or not. Assuming, of course, that they want to take the game that seriously.

However, introducing house rules in the middle of a game is considered bad form by most people so I would find for the defense.
 
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Eric
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Case Dismissed. there is No reason to procecutate "J", the rule didn't pass the approbation, in any democracy 3 against 5 wins. Unless the rule is from a dictatorship, then whatever, flee the coutry or fight against oppression!
 
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Galen
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Unless the house rule is absolutely necessary you must start the game with it and then only if everyone agrees to it.

It is also a stupid house rule.
 
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James Moss
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Looks like everyone has this discussion summed up, but I'll throw in my two cents as well:

The rule, as described, does not prevent multiple guesses. However, if everyone is waiting for an answer to be displayed at the end, disputes could arise as to who said what. I have not played the game, so I'm not sure.

House rules shouldn't be made in the middle of the game, blah, blah, blah, end like you began, yadda-yadda-yadda.

In my group, most proposed house rules get a one game playtest before being ratified. Perhaps that would be the way to go in this instance.

 
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Bruce LeCompte
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Since the rulebook clearly leaves out the "only one guess allowed" part of "the first person to give the correct answer gets another turn." Then it is allowed that multiple guesses are acceptable. It does not matter what is normally allowed on TV game shows. (Although "S" and "J" were playing a game on a TV does not make it a "TV Game Show").
Also, like others in the Jury have pointed out, House rules don't go into effect until the current game is over (Especially when the rule is in the minority). It also doesn't matter whose house it is. Suck it up. 3 out of 5 are there to have fun shouting out the answers to hopefully be the first correct the 4th is there to placate one of the other 3, the 5th is going to be playing a party game by themselves if they can't get over it. Case dismissed.
 
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Brett Myers
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I'd ask "S" if he only allows one guess in Pictionary or Guesstures. Same principle applies - they're very similar game activities.
 
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Mike Jones
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It sounds the me that the 'house' rule shouldn't be the debate. The owner was just trying to stop the arguemnet by declaring it a house rule. But, the arguement was about a vague rule; that arguement didn't come up until half way through the game. It seems to me that 'S' was playing it one way and 'J' was playing it another way. Until the middle when someone said 'hey that's not the way it should be played'. Then the arguement ensued. With one person finally saying, 'then I declare it a house rule'. Where to them it wasn't even a house rule, but the way it should be played.

Now I own three Scene It games. I've always thought that it was clear that it should be only one guess. (And that's how I was taught to play it before I owned it). But, I mostly play with the family, so we actually play mulitple answers. I pulled the rules and read them. It really does say the first person to answer correctly and doesn't say you can't make multiple guesses or that you can make only one. But to take that arguement further, under trivia it says you have answer the question correctly before the time is up. Does that mean that when you ask questions from the cards, that if you can make multiple guesses on the and you just have to come up with the correct answer within 30 seconds? So, under that same logic as the multiple answers I can now say as many answers to the questions in 30 seconds and if one of them is right I get credit for being right. 'S' was right on how it should be played, it really should be just one guess and it shouldn't even a house rule. I can not imagine a game where you have 30 seconds to shout out as many possible answers to a questions. The writers probably thought it was implied.

IT A PARTY GAME! The Rules should be secondary. House rule or no house rule, if the group wants to change mid game then so be it. It's a party game. The rule became a dispute AND they voted on it. The group decided to allow multiple answers. So, the group (the party) can change the rule if they want to. It's a party game. 'S' should be tared and feathered for not going with the flow and the group. While they may have been right in the rule, they were wrong not going with the majority. Especially taking the nature of the game.



 
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Antonio Chavez
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Well I mostly agree with what has been stated (J by a mile), but I just wanted to pitch in regarding S's attitude.

You see, in most of the world there is a concept called "hospitality", which in a nutshell means that, when there are visitors in your home, you go out of your way to make them feel welcome and at ease. Using "it's my house" as a way of bullying people into accepting your rules seems to me the antithesis of hospitable behaviour and, therefore, not only very much against the spirit of a game, but a plainly barbaric display of contempt for civilization.

The verdict: S shall play thirty-three solo games of Busen Memo. The rest of the group should be allowed to watch. J should be allowed, nay, encouraged to mercilessly S by constantly guessing out loud as to what his next move should be.

So it shall be done.
 
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Mark Crocker
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It sounds as if "J" should be able to blurt out as many answers in machine gun fashion, as she wants. Regardless, the host cannot invent a house rule in mid turn....period.
 
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SAKURA in KYOTO 2018 Back to Kansai
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rockhpi wrote:
...the host, "S", tells "J" that she is breaking the rules...He becomes upset that the other players do not support the "house rule".


Hmmm, it seems to me that the jury is trying a gender resolution case. Therefore, S is wrong because he is male. In any decision between males and females, the male is automatically wrong. That's not justice of course, but the law has been laid down for thousands of years and is practised as such.

Next case.
 
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Erin Sparks
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I will step in here and just make a few notes about all the comments (thank you all by the way)...

Quote:
It's my ball and I'm going home
He actually said that

Quote:
TV Scene it? Get a real game.
I'm working on them! It was fun for a party/trivia game though

Quote:
otherwise you would have people just shouting out as many names as they could as fast as they could
We discussed this point and no one was doing it that way.

Quote:
The owner was just trying to stop the arguemnet by declaring it a house rule.
The owner started the argument-everyone else was fine playing it as we were.

Quote:
Does that mean that when you ask questions from the cards, that if you can make multiple guesses on the and you just have to come up with the correct answer within 30 seconds?
No, for a trivia question we made the person decide on a "final answer." The pixelated pictures are different, however, because it is slowly being revealed over the entire 30 seconds and in essence the question never stops being asked until time is up.

Thanks again for all the responses!

RockHPI
 
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Eric Clark
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It looks like my input is no longer needed, but I'll toss this in anyway. For one thing, the "no multiple guesses" interpretation of the rule is flat-out wrong. More importantly:

Quote:
"House Rules" should be agreed upon by all players and discussed BEFORE the game, not in the middle.


HELL, yes. The prosecution has no case.
 
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Chris Malme
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rockhpi wrote:
The Prosecution: ("S"): No TV game shows allow multiple guesses.

This may (or might not) be true in the US, I don't know. However, it is not universally true - here in the UK, I can think of a couple of game shows where certain rounds of the show allow multiple answers from the same contestents in a limited time. (Trivial examples: the last round of "They Think It's All Over", certain rounds in Catchphrase, and many many more.)

rockhpi wrote:
A "house rule" means that if it's your house, you make the rule. It is rude to dispute this rule, just as if you are asked to remove your shoes in someone's house and you refuse to do so.


A "house rule" is a bespoke rule that the players as a whole have agreed on, before they start of play (or occassionally, under extreme circumstances - i.e. to fix otherwise broken gameplay - during the game). At least, that is what it is in my household.

 
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Randy Cox
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I missed this when it was posted. I think that the whole thing is screwed up. The person who was rat-a-tat-tatting answers was not playing within the spirit of the game. The owner/dictator was being a bit too rigid. I think the solution should have been to say "only your most recently blurted out answer counts." Then, if the defense says "Tom Cruise. Bill Clinton." Then that person's answer is Bill Clinton and someone else will have to say Tom Cruise if that is, in fact, the proper answer.

In short. Nobody won in this argument.
 
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Alexander B.
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I bet I can guess what REALLY happened here.

J, being a girl and therefore generally much better at language games than guys, is playing with S who is a competitive guy who thinks that makes him good at all games.

He gets his rear handed to him and gets upset about it.

This happened to me with Boggle. I thought I was "joe-game-expert" since I have played them my entire life and usually won. Then I play a game of Boggle with 1 other guy and 3 women. I got totally crushed!

One woman got 4 TIMES my score (my guy friend faired better only having his score doubled, and he is a professional writer and serious gamer). She had probably played no more than one or two games in her entire life (meaning 2 games of ANYTHING total).

I'm better at Scrabble, but my lady friends who never game at all give me extremely stiff competition and I usually still lose.

I have met guys who are great at these games, but I have found that many women tend to have an affinity for all language games that is nearly unbelievable. So: beware! And don't forget to have fun!!
 
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Lance McMillan
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Simple solution: everyone agrees with 'S' that his "house rule" (of only one answer allowed per puzzle) is now officially adopted, and then everyone agrees that with that stupid rule in place the game isn't any fun anymore and so they all want to play something else. 'S' gets to gloat in his self-righteous victory of having imposed his will on all the other players, and then gets his piggy nose rubbed in the mud because nobody wants to keep playing his game -- maybe that'll teach the baby some manners.
 
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Gabe Alvaro
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I the jury find the defendant not guilty!

Here's why:

rockhpi wrote:
"S" is adamant - only one guess per puzzle is allowed. He declares a "house rule". He becomes upset that the other players do not support the "house rule".


House rules are not made by the actual physical space of the house or its owner, but by the group of actual people that forms the "house". S was being a dictator and that's wrong behavior when playing a game. It is especially wrong given that J's tactics seem to be well within the rules of the game. If the objective of all games is to have fun through fair competition, then it would seem S went out of his way to spoil a good time. Let's hope S learns from this.

That was fun! laugh Sorta like the old IBM "You make the call" football commercials for Monday Night Football.
 
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