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Descent: Journeys in the Dark (Second Edition)» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Is Belthir broken? rss

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Tim Acker
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Our overlord is playing the Belthir lieutenant pack. My question specifically relates to the "hazard pay" card which lets the OL reinforce an additional monster by spending threat. The problem is that the cost is based on the monsters size (1 for small, 2 for large, 3 for huge, 4 for massive). This works fine for most monsters (eg the OL needs to spends 4 threat tokens to reinforce a shadow dragon or 1 to reinforce a goblin archer), but for the stronger small monsters the mechanic seems broken. Size seems a crude indicator for how good the monsters are.


We recently played an encounter where the OL had volucrix reavers and hybrid sentinels as open groups and the normal reinforcement rule was one per turn.
The OL used hazard pay to reinforce an additional hybrid sentinel or reaver every turn by spending only 1 threat. This often meant that he was reinforcing the master sentinel and reaver every turn!

It just seems like the cost for these stronger, small monsters should be higher, say 2 threat, to be at least in line with a barghest. Any thoughts? Or has anyone anything from FFG on this?
 
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Jeff Paul
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Well, he is tough, but that's not broken.

The players will get to reuse those threat tokens as well. One every round that he uses the card.

In addition, your OL has spent a TON on threat tokens. That means he hasn't gained/used OL cards. Many of which hurt the players a lot.
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David Aubert
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Not having cards Under the nose right now, but maybe a simple 'errata' can solve this :
4 threat to reinforce a monster with a monster limit 1/1 (One standard / One Master)
3 for monster with limit 2/1
2 for monster with limit 3/1
1 for monster with limit 4/1 and kobolds

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Jeff Paul
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Keep in mind you only earn a threat token the first time you knock a hero down each quest.
 
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Tim Acker
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Thanks for the replies.

Regarding the OL cards, the OL also had the plot card which lets him draw both a OL card AND a threat token when he downed a hero, so he was generating threat quickly without losing cards.

Good point on the once per down, will have to make sure we keep track of that.

I was also thinking something related to group limits, or at least 2 threat for the small master minions.
 
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Raymond Morehouse
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Nope, I don't think it is broken. Remember heroes get to reuse the threat tokens that the OL uses. For a dice roll, it means that the heroes will rarely miss. That's a lot of extra damage.
 
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M M
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All lieutenants have their perks. An extra reinforcement for an extra threat is actually a pretty mild bonus. By no means does that mean that he's broken, just that the OL chose well for the game parameters.
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David Williams
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timza wrote:
Regarding the OL cards, the OL also had the plot card which lets him draw both a OL card AND a threat token when he downed a hero, so he was generating threat quickly without losing cards.

Good point on the once per down, will have to make sure we keep track of that.


When the OL gains a threat for defeating a hero, you are supposed to also place a hero token in the OLs play area to show which heroes have given the OL threat. Limit 1 threat per hero per quest.

That said, even without being familiar with the card I would agree this plot card seems particularly strong when combined with hybrid sentinels. They are one of the stronger 'small' enemies, I think. And the only one I recall which only recruits a single monster for 2 heroes, albeit a master.

Essentially the single master sentinel should be comparable in strength to a minion shadow dragon, ettin, etc.

OTOH, perhaps this is partially by design as Belthir and hybrid sentinels seem thematically suited to each other. And the opportunities to combine monster choice with plot card choice is one of the things that makes it more interesting for the OL. Also sentinels won't be an option for some quests, so they can't pull this trick every time. Thank goodness!
 
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Dreadknot Knotdread
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I've never been able to generate many threat tokens as an OL. I'll have to give this Belthir deck a try.
 
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Charmy 004
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The really nice thing about Belthir's deck is you can pick up "Fight with Honor" to power your plot cards with traps instead of threat.

This makes the cost of reinforcing with a Small monster even better, and also denies the heroes a Fortune token too!

Other good targets for Hazard Pay include the Ironbound and Deep Elves.

I like Bel'thir's deck a lot, but I don't think its OP. There are really awesome things that other plot decks do too.. Fighting Queen Ariad in the Finale with Aurium Plating from Valyndra is naaasty for the heroes! whistle
 
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