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Subject: Worth getting if I have Splendor? rss

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Adam Kazimierczak
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This looks like the less pretty ancestor of Splendor, but possibly with some different mechanisms thrown in. For those who have played both, does St Petersburg fill a different space in your collection?
 
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Walt
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Zero similarity. Really. Totally different games.

You may want to wait for Saint Petersburg (second edition).

You can try this PC version of St. Pete. to see if you like it:
Item for Geeklist "Sebastian Sohn's SoftBoard Games: Free, Commercial, and Abandoned Computer Version of Board, Card and Role-Playing Games with Computer AI (Artificial Intelligence) Opponents with Screen Shots"
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Des Lee
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I'm not sure if the two have much in common to be honest, apart from a very high level similarity with buying cards that give you later discounts.

That aside, I believe saint Pete to be a much better game with a lot more depth and replayability.

I like splendor, but if I was stuck on a life raft with only enough food and water for me and one boardgame, splendor would be over the side feeding cardboard sharks faster than you can say "but wait! I have nobles visiting!"
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Jeremy Yoder
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I wouldn't even put these in the same category.

Yes, StP has the element of discounted cards and an option to hold cards, otherwise, everything else is very different -- it's much more satisfying and meatier. Honestly, I don't see why people are so ga-ga over Splendor. I played it and thought, "That's it?" and yes, it really is -- an entire game wrapped around a single base mechanic that's used in many other games, with little more.

Splendor is very easy to learn, easy to play, and very light (yes, it has some choices as to when to go for cards or hold them, I get that) so it will appeal to the non-gamer crowd, but gives gamers a more than you see at first glance. And it works great as a filler.

Yet Splendor has no flavor or personality. My wife (a non-gamer) and I yawned through this game.

Contrast that with StP, which has personality, flavor, more choices, and more factors to weigh. However, for those who don't want more choices, would rather have a filler (and are content with a theme that rivals Checkers) Splendor works -- hence, my wife actually tried it. In contract, she would not even attempt StP as it has too many moving parts for her.
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Adam Kazimierczak
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Good to know-- hope the reprint comes soon!
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Eric Brosius
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You can tell from my avatar that I love Saint Petersburg and think it's a great game, but I agree that they have almost nothing in common (other than allowing you to "buy" cards.)
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Stephen Keller
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I disagree with some of you guys. The first thing that I thought of when I finished my first game of Splendor was how much of a St. Petersburg vibe I was getting from it.

The mechanic of buying cards that generate snowballing benefits is at the heart of both.

That being said, I find Splendor to be a slow/plodding experience. And, I'm saying that about a 30 minute game. I like the St. Petersburg feel but I don't think I'm going to end up playing Splendor many more times.

St. Petersburg is by far the better title. There's definately room for both games in a collection. I'll be selling Splendor soon enough. I don't think I'll ever sell St. Petersburg.
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chris thatcher
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I really dont understand how people can say there is no similarity. Basically splendor seems to have ripped the whole card mechanic. (Pay for card, or take into hand, even the discount)
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Terry
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Max DuBoff
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Tariff wrote:
I really dont understand how people can say there is no similarity. Basically splendor seems to have ripped the whole card mechanic. (Pay for card, or take into hand, even the discount)


That's a bit of an exaggeration, true, but the reason we're saying that is that, even though Splendor mechanically has some elements reminiscent of St. Petersburg, they feel so different to play that those similarities are almost irrelevant.
 
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Stephen Keller
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carlsbad wrote:


Thankyou, you have brought up the valid example of how apples and oranges are quite similar to each other. Comparing Splendor to St. Petersburg is quite similar in nature.


APPLES/ORANGES
Grown on fruit tree: Yes/ Yes
Color: Depends/ Orange
Texture: Smooth/ Rough
Mean Circumference (CM): 25.6/ 24.4
Mean Diameter (CM): 7.9/ 7.6
Mean Weight (g): 340/ 357
Edible: Yes/ Yes
Sweetness: 2+/ 2+
Fiber: 4.5/ 2.4
Can be Juiced: Yes/ Yes
Calories per 8 oz.: 117/ 112
Potassium: 295/ 496
Vitamin C: 103/ 124
Folate: 0 74


Also, Apples and Oranges can be substitutes for one another. They both qualify as fruits that can meet your daily suggested requirements. Apples and oranges can be physically manipulated to look similar. They can be cut into similar shapes and can be blended/processed to have similar qualities. I can even substitute an orange for an apple in a smoothy. Taste will be different but they'll still give me a similar outcome. Some days I'll pick an apple over an orange. But I'm still typically picking between the two as the fruit of the day.

There are many things in this world that are so far apart that you might not be able to fathom how to compare them. Apples and oranges, on the other hand, are seemingly very close by comparison.
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fiomtec
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But what I really want to know is: are they going to sculpt apples or oranges with the faces of well known designers, artists and personalities from the BG community?
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Terry
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Synnical77 wrote:
carlsbad wrote:


Thankyou, you have brought up the valid example of how apples and oranges are quite similar to each other. Comparing Splendor to St. Petersburg is quite similar in nature.


APPLES/ORANGES
Grown on fruit tree: Yes/ Yes
Color: Depends/ Orange
Texture: Smooth/ Rough
Mean Circumference (CM): 25.6/ 24.4
Mean Diameter (CM): 7.9/ 7.6
Mean Weight (g): 340/ 357
Edible: Yes/ Yes
Sweetness: 2+/ 2+
Fiber: 4.5/ 2.4
Can be Juiced: Yes/ Yes
Calories per 8 oz.: 117/ 112
Potassium: 295/ 496
Vitamin C: 103/ 124
Folate: 0 74


Also, Apples and Oranges can be substitutes for one another. They both qualify as fruits that can meet your daily suggested requirements. Apples and oranges can be physically manipulated to look similar. They can be cut into similar shapes and can be blended/processed to have similar qualities. I can even substitute an orange for an apple in a smoothy. Taste will be different but they'll still give me a similar outcome. Some days I'll pick an apple over an orange. But I'm still typically picking between the two as the fruit of the day.

There are many things in this world that are so far apart that you might not be able to fathom how to compare them. Apples and oranges, on the other hand, are seemingly very close by comparison.


Well, it's settled then I guess. Apples are the same as oranges, and therefore St Petersburg is the same as Splendor.

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Terry
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Synnical77 wrote:
.The mechanic of buying cards that generate snowballing benefits is at the heart of both.

So St Petersburg is the same as Monopoly then?

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Randall Bart
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Chess is a lot like Poker. They both have kings and queens.
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Stephen Keller
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carlsbad wrote:
Synnical77 wrote:
.The mechanic of buying cards that generate snowballing benefits is at the heart of both.

So St Petersburg is the same as Monopoly then?



If you feel that way then I guess I'll have to trust your experience. I don't see it personally but comparisons are often in the eye of the beholder.

There's been many times where I've seen a person and commented on how they looked similar to another person. Sometimes the person that I mention this to simply doesn't see it. It just comes down to some people making certain links in their brains that others do not make links for.

With Monopoly the acquisition of new resources comes from people landing out your spaces. It's random how this is doled out. There is no guarantee of return. In St. Petersburg and Splendor when you purchase a card it is guaranteed to be an ongoing source of currency. Yes, the way the currency is delivered is different but it still comes down to the basic idea of buying a card that perpetually gives returns.

Ever since I first played St. Petersburg there was a certain feel/vibe to it that I really liked and have wanted to find in another game. People have suggested numerous "snowball" games to me but any that I've tried never had the core feel of St. Petersburg to me. Years ago I gave up the quest of finding a similar game.

Recently I tried Splendor. All I knew about it was people were liking it and it came with heavy chips. Upon my first play I got a sense of that inextricable feeling that I get from St. Petersburg. Just out of the blue and totally unexpected I had found a game that on some level felt like St. Petersburg. Some weeks later I come to the Splendor forum and notice a thread asking a comparative question about Splendor and St. Petersburg. Yes, other people are picking this vibe up too.

This is why I'm continuing to discuss. I don't like the seeming scoffs at the notion of them being similar. It's there whether only some of us can see it or not.

I'm also starting to see that this might be coming down to people comparing the components and pieces of something as opposed to what's being done with them. Two different approaches will end up with at least two different answers.
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Stephen Keller
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carlsbad wrote:


Well, it's settled then I guess. Apples are the same as oranges, and therefore St Petersburg is the same as Splendor.


Actually, this is a great example of how two people can see different things. The stuff I wrote about the comparison of apples and oranges was meant to point out their similarities. You read it as me trying to say that they're exactly the same.
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Bill Eldard
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Barticus88 wrote:
Chess is a lot like Poker. They both have kings and queens.


I'd never considered that before. My worldview has just taken a tectonic shift.
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Terry
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Synnical77 wrote:
In St. Petersburg and Splendor when you purchase a card it is guaranteed to be an ongoing source of currency.


Therefore St Petersburg is the same as Boom Town. And Settlers of Catan the Card game. And Vegas Showdown. And Homesteaders. And about 300 other games.

 
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Stephen Keller
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carlsbad wrote:


Therefore St Petersburg is the same as Boom Town. And Settlers of Catan the Card game. And Vegas Showdown. And Homesteaders. And about 300 other games.



I'm confused by your insistence of using the language of 'the same'. X=Y. If you feel that that's what I'm saying then I apologize for not being clear or verbose enough.

If you feel that St. Petersburg is the same as Boom Town, Settlers, Vegas Showdown, and Homesteaders then I can't argue that with you. We all see things through different lenses. I've played Vegas Showdown, Homesteaders, and Settlers and didn't feel a similarity to St. Petersburg unfortunately. I understand the parts that you're thoughtfully pointing at but from my perspective they are usurped by other ideas or mechanisms.

I've honestly asked in the past for suggestions on titles that had the same feel as St. Petersburg. I've received numerous suggestions but never found one that fit the bill (until now). The people suggesting them clearly had reasons for such comparisons. I even took the time to try to identify what it was that they must have been focusing on. Just because our thoughts weren't in sync doesn't mean that either of us were wrong. Actually, it really meant that we were both right.


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norman rule
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carlsbad wrote:
Therefore St Petersburg is the same as Boom Town. And Settlers of Catan the Card game. And Vegas Showdown. And Homesteaders. And about 300 other games.


Ok, we get it. You don't think they are at all alike.

Personally, I don't see a lot in common, but I do understand what some people are saying. I find them to both be enjoyable games, regardless of any similarity/difference.

Do you really have to "prove" that the guy is wrong because he thinks they are they have similarities?
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I just played St Petersburg for the first time today without any knowledge of what to expect. One of the first things that popped to mind as I was learning: This is kinda like Splendor!

Obviously, there are differences as you get deeper into the game, but the similarities were hard to ignore when first learning the game. St Petersburg is a meatier game that takes an hour or so to play.

Meaningless anecdote:

* The person teaching the game was the only person at the table who had played St Petersburg before.

* I was the only person at the table who had played Splendor before.

* I totally crushed everyone at the table. Is 99 victory points good for a first time player?
 
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Walt
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ProdigalPlaneswalker wrote:
* I totally crushed everyone at the table. Is 99 victory points good for a first time player?

St. Pete without expansions (neither Saint Petersburg: New Society & Banquet Expansion nor Saint Petersburg (second edition)) takes 5, usually 6, or 7 turns. It's a good score for five turns, okay for 6, not very good for 7. Also, the fewer players, the higher scores. So, 99 without context, no way of telling. Sorry.
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Magic Mike
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Tall_Walt wrote:
without context, no way of telling. Sorry.


Four players, but I didn't track how many turns...
 
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Walt
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Assuming the most common 6 turns (and no expansions) it's a good score.
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