Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
13 Posts

Fief: France 1429» Forums » Rules

Subject: Spam Excommunication? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
bobit the bob
msg tools
It says in the 2011? rules that the pope can excommunicate people any time, and he can stop excommunicating people any time, but he can only have one person excommunicated at a time.

It also says that when a person is excommunicated, they lose all religious titles.

By this logic it seems that you could excommunicate someone, and then remove your excommunication from them to put it on someone else, but they would still not have their religious title, so therefore no one can have religious titles without the pope's permission.

I haven't played this game, but that seems ridiculously overpowered, the number of taxes you can prevent people from gathering totals out to maybe 10 deniers a turn just from threatening to excommunicate the other players. Is it correct?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James Palmer
Canada
Ayr
Ontario
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
In the new version of the rules, the Pope can only excommunicate once per round, so that limits spamming.

I would immagine if the Pope went too willy nilly with it too, it would make the Pope ripe for assasination, etc.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Simone Ferrari
Italy
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Excommunication is limited to once per round and there can be only one person excommunicated at any time.

So if you want to excommunicate someone you have to lift the excommunication from the previous victim.

This was clarified in the last versions of the 2011 rules too.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Christoph Wolf
Spain
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I think the real question here is, does an excommunicated bishop regain his title once the excommunication is removed?

Bear in mind though that a big part of the pope's power comes from his ability to thite all existing bishoprics. If he keeps excommunicating all bishops and does not replace them in time he will drastically limit this special income.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Simone Ferrari
Italy
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
CJWF wrote:
I think the real question here is, does an excommunicated bishop regain his title once the excommunication is removed?

No. Bishops are always elected.

Your considerations about replacing bishops are right And you need also to keep some power in your enemies to let them appear a menace to other players
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gerit Driessen
Netherlands
Mierlo
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Quote:
I would immagine if the Pope went too willy nilly with it too, it would make the Pope ripe for assasination, etc.


Hehe... devil

Nice to read here what is not in the rulebook but very much a part of the game. Diplomacy, politics, backstabbing - difficult choices...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sdric
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
mb
Felkor wrote:
In the new version of the rules, the Pope can only excommunicate once per round, so that limits spamming.


This was already the case in the 2011 version of the game.
The other thing a pope excommunicating a bishop reduce his tithe.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gerit Driessen
Netherlands
Mierlo
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
After watching the series Borgia and The Borgias, I would think the pope is powerful enough to bestow a formerly excommunicated bishop or cardinal with their dignity once again. That would be what was possible historically I think.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thierry Mattray
France
Nantes
flag msg tools
publisher
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
CJWF wrote:
I think the real question here is, does an excommunicated bishop regain his title once the excommunication is removed?


He will regain his title ... if he is elected again ! ;)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Marc Bishop
Canada
Gatineau
Quebec
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
After playing a 4 player game with 2 alliances (2 v 2) I can say that the pope easily prevented the other two players from ever retaining a bishop title and even more so a cardinal title even if those same players had clear regional majority (owned all or most cities in bishophric). Since only titled lords vote to elect the king, the alliance that controlled the bishops and cardinals won the king elections easily since they could even transfer titles to their newborn lords and gain more votes.
The pope removes opponant titles (hence votes and tax), gives religious titles to ally and can have a definitive edge in electing a king which he can form an alliance with and then wins the game as soon as the king give him a free and available fief title (king already has 1 fief title = 4 vp). If the pope wants to be a jerk, he can divorce his married lord from his ally at the battle phase - if he has pope and has two fief titles, he wins on his own.

I will try the following variant next time I play a 4 player game: the pope can only excommunicate one lord. The excommunication is permanent until the lord's death. Only after the lord's death can the pope retrieve his excomm marker and then give it to another player. It may still be slightly over powered since the 3 votes the pope has plus his ally's religious titles can still block most bishopric elections that would advantage their opponents (ties means no title given which is a win for the pope). Again king elections are slanted towards the pope and his ally.

This variant is most likely not necessary for 6 players since most players will still have bishops even if the excomm is being spammed around (although there will be votes at almost every turn... Which slows the game). But for 4 players I feel the pope and his ally can easily win the game especially since they can set up a voting engine that will give them the king and free fief titles.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Board Game World
United States
Springfield Gardens
New York
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Interesting point about frequent Excommunication,
Her is a scenario, if the Pope gave the excommunication marker to Bishop A, so he lost all his church titles, next turn the excommunication marker was given to another bishop after the election phase. If Bishop A wants again to regain his title he still need one more turn election phase to be elected, (so basically the Excommunication affected 2 Bishop in one round - the first and the second) I think this is over powered.

One question: can the Pope annul marriage even if no body asked his to do so? (to brake an alliance of 2 different allied players, they still want to be allied)?

Regards
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rav
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Potatopotato wrote:
Interesting point about frequent Excommunication,
Her is a scenario, if the Pope gave the excommunication marker to Bishop A, so he lost all his church titles, next turn the excommunication marker was given to another bishop after the election phase. If Bishop A wants again to regain his title he still need one more turn election phase to be elected, (so basically the Excommunication affected 2 Bishop in one round - the first and the second) I think this is over powered.

One question: can the Pope annul marriage even if no body asked his to do so? (to brake an alliance of 2 different allied players, they still want to be allied)?

Regards


One player must request the marriage be annulled. You can't just go around breaking people up. He's the pope, not a wifestealer/maneater.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Board Game World
United States
Springfield Gardens
New York
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
He's the pope, not a wifestealer/maneater.[/q]

Hahaha, I liked your comment
Regards
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.