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Subject: Disembarkment into port and subsequent relieving force combat rss

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Rasmus D
Denmark
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The following is a tricky situation. Side 1 would like to disembark corps into a port that is being besieged by side 2, and then in the same land step move relieving forces in to lift the siege. However, the following rules are in play:


7.3.5 * LANDING FROM SIRPS-"DISEMIBARKING": Corps being transported on fleets at sea (see 6.2.5) must be "disembarked" into any adjacent land area during their Land Movement Step or be eliminated. Corps being transported on fleets that moved into a port must disembark in the port's area. When disembarking from fleets located in a blockade box, corps must land in the area containing that blockade box's port. Disembarking exhausts a corps, entire movement allowance for all purposes, and counts the same as having crossed a river for purposes of any combat in that area during the disembarking player's sequence (see 7.5.2.7.1).

7.3.5 Disembarking: If an area contains a friendly port that is besieged, counters may be considered to be disembarked directly into the port (if there is room) or into the port's area, as the controlling player desires.

7.5.2.10.3.6 Retreat after Disembarking: Corps which disembarked into a land area (7.3.5), or used a crossing arrow with the enemy corps being directly on the other side, and are then forced to retreat in the subsequent land combat step must surrender (all army factors and any accompanying leaders become prisoners). If part of the force disembarked and part of the force has walked over land all must surrender.



The last poses a potential problem, as the relieving forces and the garrison would then be forced to surrender if side 1 lost the relieving field combat. But can the besieging corps from side 2 be considered to be directly on the other side of the disembarkment?

Also in the rules about the relieving combat:


7.5.4.2.3 Relieving Force-Limited Field Combats: If the besieged force attacks with the help of "relieving forces" (ie., external corps that enter the area from another area) or such relieving forces attack without assistance from any part (all besieged factors do not have to be used) of the besieged force, a "limited" field combat instead of a defender attack combat is fought. Limited field combats are fought at the same time as field and trivial combats (ie., before any siege assault or defender attack combats). A limited field combat is a normal field combat (use all normal field combat rules) that may not exceed one "day" (three combat rounds) in length and uses the following special rules:
7.5.4.2.3.1 Relieving Force Fails TO Win: If the relieving force breaks or does not win within 3 rounds, the siege is resumed.
7.5.4.2.3.1.1: The surviving siege defenders return to the besieged city and the entire relieving force returns to the area from which it entered the siege area (returns to any one of the areas from which it entered, if more than one). If all siege defenders were eliminated, the city is captured.
7.5.4.2.3.1.2: There is no pursuit if the relieving force did not break, and, if it did break, only the relieving force may be pursued, not the siege defenders.
7.5.4.2.3.2 Relieving Force Wins: If the besiegers break, they retreat in accordance with the normal retreat after combat rules (see 7.5.2.10.3), but may only be pursued by cavalry that is in the relieving force (not in the siege defender's force) and any previously besieged corps may, if desired, then be immediately moved out of the city into the surrounding area.



It is clearly stated that the relieving force, and the garrison, is not retreated (as required for a full on surrender in rule 7.5.2.10.3.6), but is moved back to where it came from. I guess the above is a greyzone, but what do you guys think? Are you forced to surrender or not? Are there rules i have not considered?
 
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Ken
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I don't think it's a grey zone. The rules for retreat don't apply to a force that is being besieged and participates in a limited field combat. So there's no reason to apply 7.5.2.10.3.6 - the corps that are retreating don't have any corps that qualify present. Limited field combats are an exception to the usual rules in and of themselves, so I'd give their text precedence before looking to the rules for a standard field combat.
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Rasmus D
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What if the disembarking corp had landed in an adjecent empty land area, instead of the port, and then reinforced into the relieving combat?
 
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Ken
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Then the relieving force contains corps that would trigger the surrender rules and it alone would be required to surrender. Not the garrison.

It's the relieving force that is retreating, so I'd limit application of the retreat rules to that force.
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Andrew Shumway
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Please note also the distinction in 7.3.5 in disembarking into a land area vs. into a port. Assuming there is room in the port for the disembarking corps, it would go into the port city garrison, not into the land area. If that's the case then the surrender rules for disembarking do not apply as those specifically state that the relieving force has to be in the land area. Think of the disembarking force as reinforcements for the city garrison.
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Ken
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ashumway wrote:
Assuming there is room in the port for the disembarking corps, it would go into the port city garrison, not into the land area.


You've phrased this in a way that implies that the disembarking corps must go into the city rather than the area. I don't know if that's what you meant, but it is optional - the corps could go into either the city or the area at the owner's option.
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