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Shadows of Brimstone: City of the Ancients» Forums » Rules

Subject: Grit on mutation or level up rolls rss

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Sir Bryond
Germany
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I have seen that Grit can be used for "personal rolls" not only in battle, but in town.
What about re-rolling mutation or level up rolls?
 
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Angelus Seniores
Belgium
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its not clear in the rules, but the consensus so far is that you can use grit on these
 
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Hervé Balon
Belgium
Goutroux
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There was an answer from one of the official playtesters and he says that the only rolls that you cannot use grit for them are described here:
Q: When is a player rolling in the capacity of the game [G], and when is a player rolling in the capacity of "you" the hero [H]?
A1: Here's the breakdown of how we play it during playtesting:
No:
Enemy attack/damage rolls
Selecting a hero randomly
Enemy elite chart abilities
Leveling-up chart rolls - The intent was always that you couldn't re-roll these. Pretty sure that will find it's way onto an errata sheet.
Yes:
Bandage, whiskey, and herb rolls
Mutation chart rolls
Injury chart rolls
Madness chart rolls
Travel Hazard chart rolls
Attack rolls
Damage rolls
Defense rolls
Willpower rolls
Armor rolls
Spirit Armor rolls
Movement rolls
Scavenge rolls
Adventure rewards that have rolls listed
Not sure, I never thought to use grit on it:
Dynamite bounce rolls - probably yes
Die to determine if there is a travel hazard - probably yes

There is an unofficial FAQ with every question found on the BGG forum here: http://boardgamegeek.com/article/17548524
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Finn K
United States
Texas
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I think we're going to use the happens to hero versus hero makes it happen test.

Meaning actions that heroes take in mines or skill tests both in mines and town can be gritted, pretty much nothing else can. This would include level up, town events, location events etc in the not category.

I guess thematically the hero could have woken the doc up with a bucket of water and then prevented him from self medicating with liquor, so partly could be argued. But too many events seem outside of the hero being able to affect them.

For mutations the hero should have to risk the bad results if not willing to pay for corruption removal.

Just my two cents.
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Klutz
Canada
Quebec
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hiakeem wrote:
I think we're going to use the happens to hero versus hero makes it happen test.

Meaning actions that heroes take in mines or skill tests both in mines and town can be gritted, pretty much nothing else can. This would include level up, town events, location events etc in the not category.

I guess thematically the hero could have woken the doc up with a bucket of water and then prevented him from self medicating with liquor, so partly could be argued. But too many events seem outside of the hero being able to affect them.

For mutations the hero should have to risk the bad results if not willing to pay for corruption removal.

Just my two cents.

This is exactly how I plan to play.

Rerolling a mutation, injury or madness roll seems to make very little thematic sens to me... "I broke my leg? Nope, I broke my arm!"
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Neil Edmonds
United States
Washington
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You're making a roll for something that hasn't happened yet. Several role-playing systems, and some boardgames like the Fate die in Talisman, have a re-roll mechanic. You're only allowed to re-roll a specific die once for any reason, so it's not a big deal in my opinion. I think everyone's too focused on it being called "Grit", which implies mental fortitude or physical toughness, instead of "Fate" or "Luck".

It sucks that level-up for hit points and sanity is 1D6 instead of the peril die (range 3-6), so I think re-roll should be allowed. Imagine a hero that rolls 1 or 2 on multiple level-ups. Their health and sanity isn't going to scale with the elite and brutal monsters.

I do follow the rules that it has to be something the hero rolls, so no re-rolling on monster abilities, monster to-hit, or monster damage rolls. It's pretty clear in the rules it has to be the hero's dice.

BTW - invest in a Darkstone buckle. I saw my friend's rancher dissolve into a pile of goo because they rolled the mutated tail when they already had one. We had to scramble to find the money to ressurect them (and he's quite bitter about having 1 Max Grit now when my Lawman's running around with 5 Max Grit).

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Finn K
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Grit is a resource that represents a Hero’s
ability to tough out difficult situations and pull off amazing feats; dodging a fatal blow at the last minute, scoring a particularly hard shot, or activating a powerful special ability to save the day. In short, it allows Heroes to be heroic!
Every Hero has Grit (they wouldn’t be much of
a Hero without it).

Reroll level up, mutations doors not seen to for heroic. Just my opinion.
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Marc Bennett
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Autoduelist wrote:
You're making a roll for something that hasn't happened yet. Several role-playing systems, and some boardgames like the Fate die in Talisman, have a re-roll mechanic. You're only allowed to re-roll a specific die once for any reason, so it's not a big deal in my opinion. I think everyone's too focused on it being called "Grit", which implies mental fortitude or physical toughness, instead of "Fate" or "Luck".

totally agree I see no problem rerolling mutations or injury rolls with grit. although I agree that rerolling town events is a bit hokey. its also odd you roll an event for each hero at a location, so the doc can be drunk and an expert surgeon?

Autoduelist wrote:
It sucks that level-up for hit points and sanity is 1D6 instead of the peril die (range 3-6), so I think re-roll should be allowed. Imagine a hero that rolls 1 or 2 on multiple level-ups. Their health and sanity isn't going to scale with the elite and brutal monsters.

you don't gain health or sanity every level, you roll on the level up chart. you may not ever get an increase to health or sanity (although the most likely number rolled gives health and sanity) also each class has its own level up chart, the gunslinger for example doesn't roll when he gains health and sanity, he only gains 2 ever and that's only if he rolls right on the chart.
 
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David Tehero
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We always play with the personal effect rule as well so leveling up counts in there as well. Save that grit or spend it to get another ability at random....?
 
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Njorl
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I think of grit as determination and therefore apply it to level up. If you use grit to see if you are strong enough to not be dragged underwater, to see if you have the lore to understand a puzzle, or the strength to not be sickened by dead bodies, I can't see how it doesn't apply to the strength to learn from your mistakes and accomplishments. (which is what a level up is). Determination doesn't always get you past a trauma that you saw or a pulled back muscle so it doesn't guarantee the perfect level up, but it makes it more likely.

I've played Ultimate(Frisbee) for 25 years and I am certain that determination affects how quickly/much you develop your physical and mental capabilities. I've seen enough people get better than me in 3 years than I have done in 25.
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Ken H.
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Klaxas wrote:
you don't gain health or sanity every level, you roll on the level up chart. you may not ever get an increase to health or sanity (although the most likely number rolled gives health and sanity) also each class has its own level up chart, the gunslinger for example doesn't roll when he gains health and sanity, he only gains 2 ever and that's only if he rolls right on the chart.

It reminds me of playing D&D in the old days. If you roll a 1 for hit points when you level up, you either ask the DM to let you roll again, or else pretend like you just dropped the dice and it wasn't a real roll.

I've been sticking to my guns about not using Grit on the level up chart. And I did have a recent level up where I rolled a 1 for Sanity gain. It sucks... it's not fun and leaves a bad feeling, which is not what you want when you're playing a game to have fun, so I may reconsider. However, the next time that character leveled up, I rolled a 6, so I guess it averages out.

Both my kids have also gotten level up results that they didn't like. One was the thing that gives you a trivial amount of extra XP when you kill a specific type of monster, and the other was a sidebag capacity increase. I actually like the sidebag increase, but then again I have a character who has rolled that one twice, and there is clearly a point of diminishing returns.

Synthesizing from these results, I guess maybe I could house rule that you CAN reroll if you (a) roll a 1 for Sanity or Health gain, or (b) get a result that you already got previously.


tehero22 wrote:
We always play with the personal effect rule as well so leveling up counts in there as well. Save that grit or spend it to get another ability at random....?

The question of saving the grit is not that interesting in this case. Since you gain 1 Grit when you level up, it really doesn't hurt to use one in the process. Also, since you can choose the time when you level up, you will basically never level up unless you have Grit available.
 
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