Chris G
United States
Philadelphia
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Reformation adds a really cool mechanic and a ton of unnecessary junk to the base game. If you play this game regularly with 4 or more people you should buy this expansion. It's as simple as that.

The entire reason to buy this is the faction mechanic:
- it adds a whole new layer of strategy and decision making to the game. When and who to convert becomes absolutely essential to winning the game. Runaway leader? Think they have a contessa? No problem! Just convert them and watch your friends line up to take shots at them. It's like assassination, but cheaper, lazier and sure to make them want to take revenge on your "allies" instead of you.
- It can also be hilarious. The trick is to make sure everyone is on the same team then convert the one who played before you when there's nothing but 3-4 hefty stacks of coins to come before their next turn. This game is not recommended for children due to tirades of profanity which can occur in these situations.
- It's FUN being this puppet master and manipulating other people's behavior. Who doesn't get some sick sense of satisfaction from putting everyone else in each other's line of fire and watching them squabble? You'll be resisting the urge to cackle maniacally as you do so, as you know if they hear it'll only be a matter of time before you find yourself the odd one out instead.

The expansion comes with some other stuff, but it's not all as good...
- It expands the game to allow game sizes of 7-10 that the rule book disclaimer confesses THE GAME IS NOT DESIGNED FOR. It simply isn't as fun. Why? Games drag too long, there's too much downtime, player elimination leads to much longer waits and trying to stay innocuous and out of the line of fire becomes a dominant strategy. Fortune rarely favors the bold here, and they'll often spend most of the game on the sidelines grumbling and sipping whatever beverage they may have brought with them while the cautious and indecisive continue to be cautious and indecisive, apologizing as they take each other down "because there was nothing else I could do"
- The inquisitor. Firstly, you don't need the cards to play this variant. At all. Secondly, the inquisitor takes a chunk of fun out of the game. Looking at other people's hand can be quite overpowered and also just makes the bluffing game less fun. What fun bluffing game has ever asked the player "Is he lying? Well let's just look at his card and find out." It makes a win in a 2 v 1 situation feel cheap and just isn't fun. Plus asking "to inquisit" someone makes you sound like that walking dictionary that no one likes because conversation is like an SAT test.

That's basically it. It's a neat mechanic that justifies the low price tag. Don't expect anything more than that, but it's worth it.

Just remember: this game also features the cheapest loyalists in gaming. If you fail to find good humor in buying them off at two coins a pop, they'll probably take you out first. And you'll deserve it too.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kārlis Jēriņš
Latvia
Riga
flag msg tools
I'm a sheep.
badge
A lovely, fluffy sheep.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
chg21012 wrote:
- The inquisitor. Firstly, you don't need the cards to play this variant. At all.


You don't need the base game cards to play the game either - just repurpose 15 cards from a regular deck of cards. Pointless argument.

chg21012 wrote:
Secondly, the inquisitor takes a chunk of fun out of the game. Looking at other people's hand can be quite overpowered and also just makes the bluffing game less fun. What fun bluffing game has ever asked the player "Is he lying? Well let's just look at his card and find out." It makes a win in a 2 v 1 situation feel cheap and just isn't fun.


Unless I'm much mistaken, the player being inquisited chooses which card to show to the inquisitor. Hardly overpowered.

chg21012 wrote:
Plus asking "to inquisit" someone makes you sound like that walking dictionary that no one likes because conversation is like an SAT test.


What kind of dumbass argument is this!?
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Drake Coldwinter
Canada
Quebec
Quebec
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Also keep in mind, you can use the inquisitors power only on your round (hence you can't use other more useful powers instead) also the target player chooses which card to show you.

Keep in mind it's a mind game. A player was calling Duke and Assassin as his characters and had begun killing other characters, I used the inquisitor on him, and he showed me the captain. On his turn he called Assassin on me, so I figured that he was lying on the Assassin or the Duke, so I called him liar. He showed me the assassin(so he had been lying about the Duke for a while), so I lost both my characters (for calling liar and with the assassin power).

So much for overpowered Inquisitor...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris G
United States
Philadelphia
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
TheNameWasTaken wrote:
chg21012 wrote:
- The inquisitor. Firstly, you don't need the cards to play this variant. At all.


You don't need the base game cards to play the game either - just repurpose 15 cards from a regular deck of cards. Pointless argument.


I guess that's fair. Might be relevant to those that have the base game and only want the expansion for the inquisitor though so I thought I'd include it anyway.

TheNameWasTaken wrote:
chg21012 wrote:
Secondly, the inquisitor takes a chunk of fun out of the game. Looking at other people's hand can be quite overpowered and also just makes the bluffing game less fun. What fun bluffing game has ever asked the player "Is he lying? Well let's just look at his card and find out." It makes a win in a 2 v 1 situation feel cheap and just isn't fun.


Unless I'm much mistaken, the player being inquisited chooses which card to show to the inquisitor. Hardly overpowered.


Let me clarify what I meant, since it looks like this has been a big point of contention on forums: I do not think that the inquisitor is ALWAYS overpowered. But when she inspects the card of a person who has only one card left, unless they have an inquisitor left they are completely deprived of bluffing options. This is a huge disadvantage and makes those sneaky comeback wins that you would get otherwise by playing your opponent into a losing challenge impossible. In that situation, the inquisitor ruins the fun of the game and reduces it to an exercise in math and problem solving for the player with 2 cards left.

As to the cost of a turn to use, coup does not have a tendency to punish "wasted turns" and small plays, as those targeted for coups and assassinations tend to be those in the lead or those who are perceived threats. Yes your power of inquisition may make you seem like a threat but rarely as threatening as the person with 8 coins or the one who's assassinating people. It's a slight disadvantage in a heads up or 3 way situation, yes, but an early use of an inquisitor is often a low cost move.

In addition, this is also a case of personal preference. I personally found the game less fun to play while knowing certain players' cards. Even with the mind games you can play by showing one card, you still have a wider range of bluffing options and degrees of uncertainty when all this information remains hidden. That makes the bluffing for fun, in my opinion. I can see why some people enjoy the variant but for me it has not been as enjoyable as the simple ambassador.

TheNameWasTaken wrote:
chg21012 wrote:
Plus asking "to inquisit" someone makes you sound like that walking dictionary that no one likes because conversation is like an SAT test.


What kind of dumbass argument is this!?


It's not. It's a joke.

2 
 Thumb up
0.01
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kārlis Jēriņš
Latvia
Riga
flag msg tools
I'm a sheep.
badge
A lovely, fluffy sheep.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
chg21012 wrote:
TheNameWasTaken wrote:
chg21012 wrote:
Plus asking "to inquisit" someone makes you sound like that walking dictionary that no one likes because conversation is like an SAT test.


What kind of dumbass argument is this!?


It's not. It's a joke.



Didn't think of that. My apologies.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Drake Coldwinter
Canada
Quebec
Quebec
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I played another game were 3 players were left, player A still had 2 characters, player B, an inquisitor, player C one character(contessa and 3 coins).

Player B stated he wanted to look the card of player C (he had contessa). Then player B stated, oh, you are in good position, I'll let you keep your card, but you should strike player A as he is the one on the lead...

Then player C called assassination on player A... player A didn't dare to call bluff as he was thinking player B had truly seen an assassin...

I think the inquisitor is very nice addition to the game and gives very interesting situations.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ender Wiggins
msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
TheNameWasTaken wrote:
chg21012 wrote:
[q="chg21012"]Secondly, the inquisitor takes a chunk of fun out of the game. Looking at other people's hand can be quite overpowered and also just makes the bluffing game less fun. What fun bluffing game has ever asked the player "Is he lying? Well let's just look at his card and find out." It makes a win in a 2 v 1 situation feel cheap and just isn't fun.

Unless I'm much mistaken, the player being inquisited chooses which card to show to the inquisitor. Hardly overpowered.

It's more of an issue in the late game, when examining the card of a player who is down to one influence. It's often a strong move to have them keep that card after examining it, and now they are basically reduced to using that action only and unable to bluff anymore because you'll call them out.

I like the suggested variant that allows the Contessa to block the Inquisitor; not only does this mitigate an over-powered Inquisitor, but it also helps improve an under-powered Contessa.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.