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Takenoko» Forums » Rules

Subject: Lightning/fenced plot contradiction rss

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Nate
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The description for the lightning action is the panda moves to a plot of your choice, and then eats a bamboo (if applicable). The description for the fenced plot is that the panda can not eat bamboo on that plot. I don't see a rule that reconciles these two, i.e. using lightning to move the panda to a fenced in plot, whether it would eat a bamboo or not.

Am I missing something? Thanks in advance.
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James
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It does not eat the bamboo if you move it to a fenced plot. There's really no need for a rule to reconcile the two - the lightning action lets you move the panda, and the fenced plot rule applies when the panda is moved.
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Michal Starek
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That's why there's the "(if applicable)". I guess originally it was meant panda moves anywhere and eats a bamboo, if it's there and allowed to be eaten. (So no eating on the starting lake, a plot with 0 bamboo or a fenced plot.)

Our gaming group however likes a stronger version of this rule... in a thunder, the frightened panda runs here and there, until it eats a bamboo to calm down. Hence, you may move anywhere, WHERE YOU COULD EAT A BAMBOO (so on Thunder, you can't move to starting lake, fenced plot etc.).

One way or another, the bamboo still goes into your personal "panda stomach", even though it's not a normal panda move.
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Nate
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No, the "if applicable" was meant for instances in which there wasn't any bamboo at all (since you can move to an empty space). But the two descriptions are still at odds.

Lightning -- "The player can put the panda on the plot of his choice. To recover from his fear, the shy animal eats a section of bamboo."

Enclosure -- "The enclosure protects the bamboo in its plot. The panda can move across or stop there, but cannot eat any bamboo there."

There's nothing to say which overrides the other.
 
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David Peck
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Doesn't fenced in override regular movement? In regular panda movement the panda stops and eats bamboo as well. The fence stops this, why not the frightened panda as well?
 
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Nate
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Sydcomebak wrote:
Doesn't fenced in override regular movement? In regular panda movement the panda stops and eats bamboo as well. The fence stops this, why not the frightened panda as well?


Frightened panda can jump fences in a rush of adrenaline? I dunno...

Thematically, yeah, it's fenced in, so it should be protected. I'd just like an extra clause for one of these rules clarifying it. (e.g. ...The shy panda eats a section of bamboo (unless there is an enclosure))
 
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David Peck
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littleturd wrote:
Thematically, yeah, it's fenced in, so it should be protected. I'd just like an extra clause for one of these rules clarifying it. (e.g. ...The shy panda eats a section of bamboo (unless there is an enclosure))


But it is completely and totally NOT NEEDED. Why bother?
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Jacq L
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Thematically, I would imagine either:
1. Moving the panda to a fenced plot would mean she could eat the bamboo there, but then be trapped forever and unable to get out. (unless moved by fear of lightning again)

This is unlikely, but an interesting thematic/variant option.

2. He can go to the plot, but can't reach the noms.

This is likely.

Probably the farmer does not used chain link fences with raxorwire, though.
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Nate
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Jacqland wrote:
Thematically, I would imagine either:
1. Moving the panda to a fenced plot would mean she could eat the bamboo there, but then be trapped forever and unable to get out. (unless moved by fear of lightning again)

This is unlikely, but an interesting thematic/variant option.

2. He can go to the plot, but can't reach the noms.

This is likely.

Probably the farmer does not used chain link fences with raxorwire, though.


I think he jumps the fence in a fit of panic, noms on the bamboo, and then climbs a tree conveniently growing just on the inside of the enclosure and escapes once the lightning ends.

OR, it's possible he barrels through the fence, destroying the enclosure; and then the emperor sends workers to get it out and patch up the enclosure ... but not before the panda eats some bamboo.
 
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Bella
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We play such that the enclosure holds at all times. Therefore, with thunder/lightning, we almost never move to those locations...we go somewhere that bamboo eating is allowed and some is available. The exception would be placing the panda for a subsequent move, one that offers benefits outweighing the neglected bamboo eating opportunity.
 
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Tomello Visello
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littleturd wrote:
The description for the lightning action is the panda moves to a plot of your choice, and then eats a bamboo (if applicable).

Actually the rules never say "if applicable" at all.
This is what is said.

The player can put the panda
on the plot of his choice. To
recover from his fear, the
shy animal eats a section of
bamboo


So if we go down your road of interpretation, the Panda even eats when there is nothing present. Which is why we don't go down your road.



Here's two segments, though, from the FAQ

Storm
•The panda can be moved to any plot in the playing area, including the pond tile.
It doesn’t have to move in a straight line.
•The panda will eat a bamboo section from the plot he lands on (if the plot carries
any bamboo).
•The bamboo section that gets eaten this way is placed on the player’s mat.
•If the player choses to apply the effect of the storm, he has to move the panda to
another plot (the panda cannot stay where he is in order to eat a section there).


Enclosure improvement
•The panda is allowed to stop on a plot with an enclosure, but will not eat any
bamboo from it.


The important thing that is not in that last part of the quote is to declare that Storm/Lightning is an exception.

What is not stated in the rules is just as important as what is.

So I conclude that if a new sentence was to added then it would have to be about allowing consumption on a protected plot rather than about prohibiting such.

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Nate
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TVis wrote:
littleturd wrote:
The description for the lightning action is the panda moves to a plot of your choice, and then eats a bamboo (if applicable).

Actually the rules never say "if applicable" at all.
This is what is said.

The player can put the panda
on the plot of his choice. To
recover from his fear, the
shy animal eats a section of
bamboo


So if we go down your road of interpretation, the Panda even eats when there is nothing present. Which is why we don't go down your road.



Here's two segments, though, from the FAQ

Storm
•The panda can be moved to any plot in the playing area, including the pond tile.
It doesn’t have to move in a straight line.
•The panda will eat a bamboo section from the plot he lands on (if the plot carries
any bamboo).
•The bamboo section that gets eaten this way is placed on the player’s mat.
•If the player choses to apply the effect of the storm, he has to move the panda to
another plot (the panda cannot stay where he is in order to eat a section there).


Enclosure improvement
•The panda is allowed to stop on a plot with an enclosure, but will not eat any
bamboo from it.


The important thing that is not in that last part of the quote is to declare that Storm/Lightning is an exception.

What is not stated in the rules is just as important as what is.

So I conclude that if a new sentence was to added then it would have to be about allowing consumption on a protected plot rather than about prohibiting such.



A link to the relevant paragraph in the FAQ would have sufficed. You sound like a total dick.
 
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Kirk Monsen
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For normal panda movement it says this:

Quote:
Panda
The player moves the panda in a straight line, any number of
plots in the direction of his choice. The panda is only allowed
to move over plots, not empty spaces between plots.

The panda eats a bamboo section from the plot where he
finishes his movement


for Storm it says this:
Quote:

The player can put the panda on the plot of his choice. To recover from his fear, the shy animal eats a section of bamboo


I am not seeing any difference between the two except that in storm the Panda can move anywhere, and normal movement the Panda can only go in a straight line. This means any rule applying to one dealing with eating applies to the other.

Enclosure says this:
Quote:
enclosure
The enclosure protects the bamboo in its plot. The panda can move across or stop there, but cannot eat any bamboo there.


This does not stop a panda from moving there either normally or with lightning.

Besides that Storm lets a panda move anywhere, and normal move only lets the panda move in straight lines, can you show where these two are different that would imply different eating abilities?

Either normal panda movement and lightning can override enclosure (which makes no sense), or neither one can.
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James
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When people already pointed out why your interpretation was incorrect, you basically ignored them. When someone pointed out more explicitly why your interpretation was incorrect, you insulted him. Please try to be more respectful to people who are giving up their own time to help a fellow gamer.
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Nate
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eviljelloman wrote:
When people already pointed out why your interpretation was incorrect, you basically ignored them. When someone pointed out more explicitly why your interpretation was incorrect, you insulted him. Please try to be more respectful to people who are giving up their own time to help a fellow gamer.


No one pointed out my interpretation was incorrect; they merely said their interpretation was correct. Sounds like this was clarified in the FAQ, but that poster couldn't point that out without being a dick about it. I didn't deserve that tone, and I won't accept it.
 
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David Peck
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Humorous, yes. Dick? No. Do us all a favor and don't ask any more questions.
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Tomello Visello
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littleturd wrote:
TVis wrote:
littleturd wrote:
The description for the lightning action is the panda moves to a plot of your choice, and then eats a bamboo (if applicable).

Actually the rules never say "if applicable" at all.
This is what is said.

The player can put the panda
on the plot of his choice. To
recover from his fear, the
shy animal eats a section of
bamboo


So if we go down your road of interpretation, the Panda even eats when there is nothing present. Which is why we don't go down your road.



Here's two segments, though, from the FAQ

Storm
•The panda can be moved to any plot in the playing area, including the pond tile.
It doesn’t have to move in a straight line.
•The panda will eat a bamboo section from the plot he lands on (if the plot carries
any bamboo).
•The bamboo section that gets eaten this way is placed on the player’s mat.
•If the player choses to apply the effect of the storm, he has to move the panda to
another plot (the panda cannot stay where he is in order to eat a section there).


Enclosure improvement
•The panda is allowed to stop on a plot with an enclosure, but will not eat any
bamboo from it.


The important thing that is not in that last part of the quote is to declare that Storm/Lightning is an exception.

What is not stated in the rules is just as important as what is.

So I conclude that if a new sentence was to added then it would have to be about allowing consumption on a protected plot rather than about prohibiting such.



A link to the relevant paragraph in the FAQ would have sufficed. You sound like a total dick.
Whoa, is that reaction ever stunningly misguided.

Allow me to take a yet another stab at diminishing you to point out that a link to the document does not guide the reader straight to the paragraph intended. I further submit that posting the original text is helpful to others reading this thread, whose own memories might not be precise.

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Tomello Visello
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littleturd wrote:
eviljelloman wrote:
When people already pointed out why your interpretation was incorrect, you basically ignored them. When someone pointed out more explicitly why your interpretation was incorrect, you insulted him. Please try to be more respectful to people who are giving up their own time to help a fellow gamer.


No one pointed out my interpretation was incorrect; they merely said their interpretation was correct. Sounds like this was clarified in the FAQ, but that poster couldn't point that out without being a dick about it. I didn't deserve that tone, and I won't accept it.
Firstly, I disagree with your beginning sentence there and truly do believe that I pointed out that your interpretation was incorrect.

Secondly I would suggest that your final sentence there is one I could myself quite justifiably turn right back to you.


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Trevin Beattie
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This has already been asked and answered by the designer in “Do you take the bamboo when panda is scared by dice roll?”.
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Keith Textor
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Interesting that such a gentle game with an inordinate use of pastels would stir up such vulgarity and passion. (One would almost think this is a King of Tokyo thread.)

I would agree with the lines of reasoning that the panda would NOT eat bamboo in a "no eat" zone, but it's your game. Sheesh, play it how you want.
 
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Josh Chen
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You can't blame him though.

Look at his account name: littleturd

whistle
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