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Subject: Confessions of a former far left activist rss

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Trey Stone
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Great piece.

http://www.mcgilldaily.com/2014/11/everything-problematic/
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Junior McSpiffy
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A nice article. I wonder how much of it is exclusive to left-wing extremists/activists and how much crosses over to any flavor of extremist/activist. It seemed like there was a lot that could cross over to groups all over the spectrum.
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Dan Schaeffer
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GameCrossing wrote:
A nice article. I wonder how much of it is exclusive to left-wing extremists/activists and how much crosses over to any flavor of extremist/activist. It seemed like there was a lot that could cross over to groups all over the spectrum.


The only reason it's about far left activists is because that's where the writer started. If she had started on the far right and come to the same realizations and self-awareness, it would probably be about one ultra-conservative movement or another.
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Trey Stone
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Golux13 wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
A nice article. I wonder how much of it is exclusive to left-wing extremists/activists and how much crosses over to any flavor of extremist/activist. It seemed like there was a lot that could cross over to groups all over the spectrum.


The only reason it's about far left activists is because that's where the writer started. If she had started on the far right and come to the same realizations and self-awareness, it would probably be about one ultra-conservative movement or another.


I think it is a similar process, though different, because the particulars of the two fringes manifest in different ways, with vastly different priorities.

Granted, that's just details.
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Dan Schaeffer
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tstone wrote:
Golux13 wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
A nice article. I wonder how much of it is exclusive to left-wing extremists/activists and how much crosses over to any flavor of extremist/activist. It seemed like there was a lot that could cross over to groups all over the spectrum.


The only reason it's about far left activists is because that's where the writer started. If she had started on the far right and come to the same realizations and self-awareness, it would probably be about one ultra-conservative movement or another.


I think it is a similar process, though different, because the particulars of the two fringes manifest in different ways, with vastly different priorities.

Granted, that's just details.


One thing that will be interesting to watch for is whether her former co-radicals denounce her for apostasy or claim she was No True Scotsman all along. That pattern is not uncommon when people renounce their Republicanism, just as a lot of people made similar noises when Joe Lieberman went "independent" to caucus with the GOP.
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tstone wrote:


Nice article, shame it's a bit pointless. Anyone who is radical won't see it the correct way. They will just say 'Yeah those crazy extremists, good job I'm not like them!'
 
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tstone wrote:


It was "okay". The key insight she made is that left-leaning activists are political vaporware. Trying to compare a right-leaning activist to one like her is deflection in my view as most right-wing activists do have an actual alternative plan, ideologically speaking.

She still can't move away from code words and phrases like 'oppressive politics'... which alludes to any politics not supported by the self-anointed champions of oppression, which is merely an arbitrary line drawn to signify them/us.

She is beginning to understand the way straights relate to gays but she'll always be somewhat wrong and off-kilter. A+ for seeing that she does have more to learn though.

Many people have taken her path. My instinct is many more lefty people have become moderate or conservative than the reverse but that impression is based on the tendency for the Left to have more sway in the media. So if there was any significant number of conservatives migrating it'd be front and center. When a liberal migrates you have to dig and scratch to hear about it.

David Horowitz is probably one of the more well-spoken former Leftoids, him being a lot more than a little bit radical in the 60's, He was full blown radical and an unrepentant communist.

Thanks for the link. Hopefully she'll write more and perhaps become a spokesperson for her community that isn't sticking their finger in everyone's eye and demanding we all think differently.
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Junior McSpiffy
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DWTripp wrote:
Trying to compare a right-leaning activist to one like her is deflection in my view as most right-wing activists do have an actual alternative plan, ideologically speaking.


A deflection from.... what? From getting to stand over the confessions of a reforming radical and gloat? Should I wait for you finish a maniacal laugh of some sort?

And what is the difference between touchy-feely but empty platitudes of the left and concrete but unworkable solutions wrought from similar groupthink on the right? If both lead to nothing of substance being accomplished, then isn't the difference an academic one at best?
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Junior McSpiffy
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Koldfoot wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
DWTripp wrote:
Trying to compare a right-leaning activist to one like her is deflection in my view as most right-wing activists do have an actual alternative plan, ideologically speaking.


A deflection from.... what? From getting to stand over the confessions of a reforming radical and gloat? Should I wait for you finish a maniacal laugh of some sort?

And what is the difference between touchy-feely but empty platitudes of the left and concrete but unworkable solutions wrought from similar groupthink on the right? If both lead to nothing of substance being accomplished, then isn't the difference an academic one at best?


Unworkable solutions? You mean like drill, baby, drill? Or did you have another example?


Total repeal of ObamaCare.
Build a wall, kick everyone out and let the unemployed pick our lettuce

Those are the two that come to mind while I cook dinner. I am sure if I give it anything more than cursory thought, I could come up with quite a few more.
 
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Trey Stone
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Or the, "if we invade everyone we don't like and just keep shooting people, it will bend the world to our will and solve all of our problems."
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If we deregulate everything, then corporations have no impetus to work against the public good. FREE MARKET, BABY!
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Jorge Montero
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My favorite right wing unworkable solution is to cut the federal budget, except without really cutting anything. It's unworkable because they'd never really cut anything.

Now, as far as the article goes, yeah, I agree with Koldfoot that it was pretty boring, using lots of words to say very little. The one valuable point is the anti-intellectualism that arises whenever we find extremism. It's pretty easy to explain though: As we embrace an identity with lots of clear opinions in many topics, we are forced to stop thinking, make the world black and white, and abandon nuance, in exchange to agreeing with what people like 'us' think. My favorite part of that though comes from objectivists: To be the biggest individualists ever, they have to end up swallowing so many opinions all at once, that they are making a mockery of individualism. Think for yourself, agree with Ayn Rand on everything!

As far as left radicalism goes, my least favorite part is abandoning science whenever it doesn't agree with the wholly organic, modern hippy values. Whether it's hating vaccines, or sending our agriculture back to the 18th century, they are barely more pro-science than the rural missurians I know that get most of their opinions out of church facebook groups.

I do not blame those extremists for being what they are though. For many, the way to avoid existential anxiety is to belong to something. It's not my favorite solution to the problem, but hey, it works for them, and it beats depression.
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Trey Stone
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A variation of the Objectivists is from militant atheists who call themselves "free thinkers"...if you are a "free thinker"...you will come to the same conclusions we do.

Hm.
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Koldfoot wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
Koldfoot wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
DWTripp wrote:
Trying to compare a right-leaning activist to one like her is deflection in my view as most right-wing activists do have an actual alternative plan, ideologically speaking.


A deflection from.... what? From getting to stand over the confessions of a reforming radical and gloat? Should I wait for you finish a maniacal laugh of some sort?

And what is the difference between touchy-feely but empty platitudes of the left and concrete but unworkable solutions wrought from similar groupthink on the right? If both lead to nothing of substance being accomplished, then isn't the difference an academic one at best?


Unworkable solutions? You mean like drill, baby, drill? Or did you have another example?


Total repeal of ObamaCare.
Build a wall, kick everyone out and let the unemployed pick our lettuce

Those are the two that come to mind while I cook dinner. I am sure if I give it anything more than cursory thought, I could come up with quite a few more.


Just so I'm clear: reverting back to the best healthcare system in the world by any measure except numbers of insured, and failing to acknowledge Americas uninsured routinely got better care than insured Brits, is unworkable?

Enforcing laws which allow lettuce pickers be here legally is unworkable?

Just like drilling was unrealistic? Note: US is now the largest energy producer in the world.


Look at you, insisting on tabbing me with a stance on drilling. That's twice so far. You must have some sorta "gotcha" in your pocket, just waiting to spring it on me. How very Shreve of you.

And to both of your comments on what I actually said, yes. It's unworkable, but not for the spin you are putting on it. It's not unworkable because they aren't good ideas, they're unworkable because there's no way to get there from here. Give me the roadmap, a workable roadmap, on how ObamaCare gets repealed. There's no supermajority to overcome the Democratic minority, and there's certainly not enough to override the veto of the man whose piece of signature legislation it is. So whether an idea is good or not doesn't necessarily mean it's workable.

And enforcing laws at this point is just bailing water out of the Titanic via bucket brigade. There needs to be a functioning rework of immigration laws to accommodate the reality of where we are now. And neither side is giving us that because neither side really wants it. They both want to turn a blind eye and use it as a wedge issue. So again, what is right has little bearing on what is workable.

Even with a majority in both chambers, we're not gonna get anything except more "We'll hold our breath until we get what we want, and what we want isn't about legislation, it's about the Oval Office." It's all the current band of radicals know how to do.
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Koldfoot wrote:

Just so I'm clear: reverting back to the best healthcare system in the world by any measure except numbers of insured, and failing to acknowledge Americas uninsured routinely got better care than insured Brits, is unworkable?


I believe, as you Americans say you are drinking kool-aid



Please call my chart biased because it doesn't agree with your perceptions, I'll do the same when you post 5 year cancer survival rates as some all trumping fact.
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Koldfoot wrote:
the best healthcare system in the world

The scary part is that you and many others probably actualy believe this is true.
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scott3387 wrote:
Please call my chart biased...


The report it's pulled from is a good read.

As a general note, you often include sources/charts without links. Many of them are interesting reads so if you'd include a link you'd get some good discussion.
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perfalbion wrote:
scott3387 wrote:
Please call my chart biased...


The report it's pulled from is a good read.

As a general note, you often include sources/charts without links. Many of them are interesting reads so if you'd include a link you'd get some good discussion.


Funny man. No one reads the reports because they go tl;dr and only look at the picture to strawman anyway. I'm just saving the poor people the 5 seconds to click on the link and decide they can't be arsed.

Also the source is in the bloody picture.
 
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Koldfoot wrote:
scott3387 wrote:
Koldfoot wrote:

Just so I'm clear: reverting back to the best healthcare system in the world by any measure except numbers of insured, and failing to acknowledge Americas uninsured routinely got better care than insured Brits, is unworkable?


I believe, as you Americans say you are drinking kool-aid



Please call my chart biased because it doesn't agree with your perceptions, I'll do the same when you post 5 year cancer survival rates as some all trumping fact.


Ooooooo! A chart!

Charts prove global warming, and that Obama brought down the US deficit, too!


It's based on statistics, unlike you know like that 'USA USA USA' WE R BESTEST arsepull.
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Thanks for the link. It's nice when people reexamine their positions or how they are getting to them or expressing them. I am trying to do more of that myself as I grow older.
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she2 wrote:
Thanks for the link. It's nice when people reexamine their positions or how they are getting to them or expressing them. I am trying to do more of that myself as I grow older.


But the number of thumbs you currently garner here in RSP won't ever let that process go too far.
 
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GameCrossing wrote:
she2 wrote:
Thanks for the link. It's nice when people reexamine their positions or how they are getting to them or expressing them. I am trying to do more of that myself as I grow older.


But the number of thumbs you currently garner here in RSP won't ever let that process go too far.


This is true, although I will point out that I have no control over the pre-programmed thumb algorithms programmed into the Hive Mind.
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I refuse to thumb that comment in order to prove that I am not merely an algorithm of the Hive Mind.

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The author seems to be a current far-left activist, not a former far-left activist. E.g.,

I’m basically a social democrat who likes co-ops and believes in universal basic income, the so-called ‘capitalist road to communism.’

She's just gotten more nuanced and better informed in her activism. Which happens to a lot of people between their teen years and their mid-20s.
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DaviddesJ wrote:
The author seems to be a current far-left activist, not a former far-left activist. E.g.,

I’m basically a social democrat who likes co-ops and believes in universal basic income, the so-called ‘capitalist road to communism.’

She's just gotten more nuanced and better informed in her activism. Which happens to a lot of people between their teen years and their mid-20s.


I can't disagree, except that she has started taking steps away from the positions she now sees as vapor and perhaps damaging or counter-productive to her personal beliefs. She talks about how she was essentially "magicked" into leftist activism by a combination of factors. Not too unlike someone at a vulnerable stage of life becoming a cultist of some sort - being swept away by appearances and emotions.

The path away from that takes longer than the rush to become it in the first place. Looks like over time she's going to becoming increasingly "not left". Maybe not a social conservative but definitely not an in-your-face progressive.
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