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Subject: Waterloo & Austerlitz at low scales rss

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Guillaume Gleize
France
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Hello,

A question about Waterloo & Austerlitz.
I'm planning to create one scenario of each on single board (not Epic).

- Waterloo including the Prussians!
- Both for not having to wait 1-2 years for the next expansion!
- Both being playable 1 vs 1 without waiting years again for 8 friends!

But my question is:

We all know CCN don't have a unic scale but the scale of the units and battles changes with the scenarios. But when GMT (or a player) create a single board scenario of a huge battle (Waterloo including the Prussians or Austerlitz for example) don't you think the scale is too reduced on the single board? For example the INF units shooting at 2 hexes may be absurd on the real battlefield (too far)?

TY
 
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Michael Dippel
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Rheinhausen
Baden-Württemberg
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C&C is a simple and abstract rules system.

The players who have choosen this system to play, accept this rules and like it (or they should choose another game)

You can always create scenarios with a few or many new rules, that´s not the problem

The question is, how is it accept from the familiar C&C players and play they such a Scenario which is "to far away" from the original basic rules.
I must not write my answer, because you know it whistle

But at last you and your gaming friends must satisfied with the rules you create and play GG.
 
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Wolfram Troeder
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GGleize wrote:
Hello,

A question about Waterloo & Austerlitz.
I'm planning to create one scenario of each on single board (not Epic).

- Waterloo including the Prussians!
- Both for not having to wait 1-2 years for the next expansion!
- Both being playable 1 vs 1 without waiting years again for 8 friends!

But my question is:

We all know CCN don't have a unic scale but the scale of the units and battles changes with the scenarios. But when GMT (or a player) create a single board scenario of a huge battle (Waterloo including the Prussians or Austerlitz for example) don't you think the scale is too reduced on the single board? For example the INF units shooting at 2 hexes may be absurd on the real battlefield (too far)?

TY


Depending on the scale (and not on the board size) that could be too much except for the Rifles.
The battlefield is app. 4,5 x 2,5 miles, i.e. 7,2 x 4 km. 7200m/13hex eq. ~550m per hex. 4000m/9hex eq. 450m/hex.
So 500m/hex would be a valid scale for a standard C&C board.
No effective musket fire over this distance! Even rifles would be tasked to be effective at this distance. So hex2hex combat only except the arty?

 
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Guillaume Gleize
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TY for your answers guys.

BUT NO NO: I don't want to change the rules at all!

Sorry not to be clear: My question is in fact: Because we will stick with the rules, does the low scale will chock the players? Do they will just play and have fun or do they will calculate the scale, notice that the INF is maybe shooting too far (or any other strange scale result) then refuse to play it?

 
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Wolfram Troeder
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GGleize wrote:
TY for your answers guys.

BUT NO NO: I don't want to change the rules at all!

Sorry not to be clear: My question is in fact: Because we will stick with the rules, does the low scale will chock the players? Do they will just play and have fun or do they will calculate the scale, notice that the INF is maybe shooting too far (or any other strange scale result) then refuse to play it?



Me thinks I would play the scenario with rules as is. Contrary to my last post.
In a scale like this, see large scale M44, what you see on the board is only the general position of this unit, where the main body is. Each of this units is sourrounded by "auxilliaries", has some long range ablities, scouts etc. to influence, impact, impress to some degree beyond it's main battle distance. OTOH these do not add to the main "Gefechtswert" in close combat due to being too vulnerable.
So the approximation done by the C&C system is a good enough representation for me.

So go ahead and scale Waterloo or even Austerlix down. Build it and they will come.
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Read the rulebook, plan for all contingencies, and…read the rulebook again.
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GGleize wrote:
TY for your answers guys.

BUT NO NO: I don't want to change the rules at all!

Sorry not to be clear: My question is in fact: Because we will stick with the rules, does the low scale will chock the players? Do they will just play and have fun or do they will calculate the scale, notice that the INF is maybe shooting too far (or any other strange scale result) then refuse to play it?



I think it would work. It's not unusual for game clubs to bathtub large battles into a different scale so that it will fit on an available table. The more important thing is to put together a fun scenario that captures the spirit of a given battle.
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Guillaume Gleize
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TY guys for the advices.
I agree to put clever special rules & victory conditions to fit with history while STAYING VERY SIMPLE!
 
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Jon Snow
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Go for it witht he rules as is! When I used to play with my huge collection of 54mm miniatures, before that scale of 'toy soldiers' became popular, people who heard I was gaming in that large scale (with figures 2 1/2 inches tall) would say "Oh, you do skirmishes!" And I'd say "No, I do real battles." If you want, you can consider that the space scale is being reduced down when armies come into 1 or 2 space proximity, so the details of the fight can be shown, even though the rest of the board is simultaneously showing a larger distance scale!
 
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Don't think about it too hard. Even with the game's default scenarios, we already have some wildly varying game scales. For example, no way is the same amount of real ground being depicted on the River Coa scenario as on the British Waterloo scenario.

Shoot, in BC150, while it is not necessarily my favorite, they show the whole Battle of Antietam on one map, and it is decently enjoyable.
 
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George Husted
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I don't think C&C is any more abstract than little wooden blocks with strength pips on them...and those seem to be very popular.meeple
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Guillaume Gleize
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---> Michael: I just discovered your MD15 "Alternate Waterloo" that seems very interesting. So I can concentrate some day on my single board Austerlitz!
 
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