Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
14 Posts

China» Forums » General

Subject: China Vs. El Grande? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
How does China compare to El Grande?
More importantly, if I already own El Grande, is there a compelling reason to spend the money on China?
Maybe the games are completely different, that's why I'm asking, but based on the few reviews I've read, they sound pretty similar.

-Quixote
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Ok.
That's like saying Ice Cream and Frozen Yogurt are completely different, except for the fact that they're both cold dessert items you can put in your mouth...
Yes, they're different, but they're also very similar.
I'm not arguing with you - I've never even seen China outside of the BGG listing - I guess I just need to read some more reviews...

I guess what I want to know is this: If I already own and enjoy El Grande, is it worth my money to pick up China? Is it different enough that my gaming group isn't going to dimiss this out of hand as too similar? It took enough arm twisting to get them to play El Grande...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Eisen
United States
Menlo Park
CA
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
China fits a different niche. It plays quicker, it is good for 3 players.

Games do feel different, maybe it's because in China pieces never move once placed whereas in El Grande that is pretty commonplace.

In any event, the interlocking mechanics of controlling turn order, court vs. provinces, and managing the different scoring opportunities make El Grande a richer gaming experience. But the fact that China is more versatile in player count and can be played in an hour means that it comes out to the table more often than El Grande does.

I own both and like it that way.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Kandrac
United States
Grand Prairie
TX
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
What Dave said.

Gg
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Romain Jacques
Canada
Gatineau
Québec
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
China is a lot quicker and simplier than El Grande. I wonder which reviews you have seen that gave you the impression they are similars. As said others, they are both majority's games, but that's where the simliraties stop. Since you prefer Bang to El Grande, I suspect China could become you prefer majority's game.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dkeisen wrote:
China fits a different niche. It plays quicker, it is good for 3 players.

Games do feel different, maybe it's because in China pieces never move once placed whereas in El Grande that is pretty commonplace.

In any event, the interlocking mechanics of controlling turn order, court vs. provinces, and managing the different scoring opportunities make El Grande a richer gaming experience. But the fact that China is more versatile in player count and can be played in an hour means that it comes out to the table more often than El Grande does.

I own both and like it that way.


Groovy.
I'll add this game to my list of "Pick it up if I see it" games. (As opposed to my list of "Obtain at all costs" games.)

Thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan Johnson
United States
Salem
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I also own both games and I'm glad I do. I really love these games and they are both among my favorites. Even though you own El Grande, I would certainly recommend China. Totally different feel to it than El Grande.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SwedeLad wrote:
I also own both games and I'm glad I do. I really love these games and they are both among my favorites. Even though you own El Grande, I would certainly recommend China. Totally different feel to it than El Grande.


Awesome!
Thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sight Reader
United States
Colorado
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
Quixote171 wrote:
How does China compare to El Grande?
-Quixote


Player turns in El Grande are more phased and diverse, as the sorts of things players do on their turns varies quite a bit as dictated by specific phases and cards. Each move in China, on the other hand, is relatively short and uniform, resulting in a game that feels more continuous and Chess-like than phased and "seasonal". With less time devoted to setting up phases, China's duration is far more sensitive to the number of players than El Grande, with 3 player games going by extremely fast.

China is a far more incremental game than El Grande. The phase structure of El Grande results in huge decisions when certain phases (like allocating your guys in the Castillo) have a decisive influence on the focus of conflict. In contrast, each move in China is small but fiercely competitve in a tit for tat way, more like a pennant race in baseball where progress is not measured in huge wins and losses but rather in steps ahead or behind specific rivals.

Your encounters with individual rivals are much longer term in China. In El Grande, special cards can result chaotic shifts of focus in what territories and enemies you are competing against. In China, specific rivalries evolve over several turns in various states, and once your effort is committed it cannot be redeployed. Your success still hinges on devastating surprise moves in China, but it requires much more sacrifice from your other positions and it has to be timed and planned very precisely against competitors that everyone knows you're fighting against.

Hope that helps.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
sightreader wrote:
Hope that helps.


It does, Thank you!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ryan Olson
United States
Auburn
Kansas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Wow. I nearly choked on my pop when I saw this thread. I just added this game to my RSS feeds because I ordered it AND El Grande from thoughthammer for my birthday.

I never even thought about them being similar. I was just trying to make the money match with games I wanted to get .

Thanks for allowing me to feel better about my purchase.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alain Renaud
Canada
Québec
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
If you love one, you might like the other. Yet they won't come out on the same kind of evenings.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Morse
United States
Falmouth
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
http://atroublewithwords.com/
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It's funny, I've had China now for quite a little while, and I'd forgotten all about this thread.
Yes, they are very different games.
Thanks to everyone for trying to explain this to me. ;-)
And like everybody said, I like both games very much, for different reasons.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.