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A Game of Thrones (first edition)» Forums » General

Subject: Player elimination rss

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George Van Voorn
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I was wondering... This game is clearly not diplomacy, in the sense that player elimination often does not seem to occur
- it is not an achievable goal due to time constraints (10 rounds)
- it is not an achievable goal due to back-stabbing practices
- players are all in "corners" and can quite easily make a defensible perimeter
- players can easily withdraw and let other players clash
- it is often not a very useful tool in obtaining those seven cities needed to win the game
- ...

How many people have actually experienced AGoT sessions in which one or more players were eliminated? And was this the basic game or with expansions?

Oetan
 
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Darko
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I played several times with players who whas eliminated at the 4th o 5th turn (AGoT, 5 players sessions, of course). And sometimes, 2 players were eliminated of game at 7th or 8th turn. When i say eliminated, I'm saying that this player are out (she/he does not have nothing on board to play) or he/she can do something useful with her army...
In fact, it's more probably that with rookie players than veterans, but aliance sistems are, in the most of cases, 2 vs 2... the 5th player can (or not) aid another player to conquer positions, or aid 2 factions. With the popular backstabbing practiques, this player often, can reach this position to a notable position on game or, if he/she plays awful, go out of game.
Diplomacy, fast-talk, are very important on a five players game.
In other way... Conquer 7 cities on the 10th are improbable. If you dont look for a good aliance, you are out of game on 5 or 6 turns. Solo game is possible, but win? In my opinion, imposible. Diplomacy and backstabbing its the essence of game.
 
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It seems to be pretty much designed so that player elimination tends to only occur right when someone is about to win anyway. At least in my experience. A good thing, in my opinion.
 
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Charles Hasegawa
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Chandler
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The few time I've seen someone basically being eliminated, someone was winning.
 
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Oh, so you actually think about what you are saying?
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I have played about 6 times now and have never seen a player completely eliminated. In one game a player was knocked back to worse than starting position, but actually bounced back to be in contention (second place by supply tie-breaker) at the end of turn 10.

I think if a player is actually eliminated, then it will likely cause someone to reach the sudden death conditions. Consequently, there is a disincentive to cause it to happen, unless you are the player who would win. The victory conditions turn out to be a pretty good balancing effect on player elimination in my experience thus far.
 
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Rick Holzgrafe
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Lannister's position in the basic game is so vulnerable that there is a chance that he will be crushed, especially if played by a newbie. I've seen a newbie Lannister eliminated within a few turns; I've also seen a case (I was Lannister!) where Lannisport was lost and my remaining forces, which had been pushing north, wound up fleeing all the way to the Wall, where they were trapped, helpless, and saved only by the end of the game.

But if all players are reasonably experienced, elimination should not happen often, or early. It's not usually a problem.
 
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Travis Hall
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Technically, it is impossible to eliminate a player in AGOT. Even with no units on the board, a house can still make a return under certain specific conditions.

Otherwise, the standard board has 18 cities (counting strongholds as cities for this purpose). The most even distribution possible leaves two players on 5 cities and two on 4 cities. Victory is achieved at 7 cities. So, any time a player is eliminated, somebody has to be pretty close to winning.

Normal fluctuations of position will easily boost one of those players to 6. Then, it takes very little to push the player to 7 cities.

So, usually when a player is eliminated, the game ends shortly after.

Also, this means that there are generally a couple of players who would prefer to see the losing player remain in the game, to deny that player's cities to somebody stronger. This means that a player close to elimination will generally get support from at least one neighbour.

And finally, when a player loses his last city, all anybody cares about is cities, because the end of the game is so close. Any area that does not have a city, or gives tactical leverage over a city, is not worth taking. So, the losing player tends to be able to retreat to such places, preventing complete elimination.
 
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George Van Voorn
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Quote:
Technically, it is impossible to eliminate a player in AGOT. Even with no units on the board, a house can still make a return under certain specific conditions.


Oh!?! And which are ... I'm not sure where in the rulebook this can be found.
 
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Gert Corthout
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oetan wrote:
Quote:
Technically, it is impossible to eliminate a player in AGOT. Even with no units on the board, a house can still make a return under certain specific conditions.


Oh!?! And which are ... I'm not sure where in the rulebook this can be found.

If a faction's homeland is unoccupied by troops and no-one has established power there. Bloody unlikely to happen though, maybe, just maybe through a wildling attack that wasn't beaten off or something...
 
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Travis Hall
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gert_c wrote:
If a faction's homeland is unoccupied by troops and no-one has established power there. Bloody unlikely to happen though, maybe, just maybe through a wildling attack that wasn't beaten off or something...

Yes, very unlikely, but always technically possible. It is conceivable that the occupying house could voluntarily abandon the occupied stronghold, if it is obvious that somebody else is going to take it anyway, rather than the wildlings eliminating the occupier.
 
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