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Subject: Strategy for the East early on rss

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Colin Hunter
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To approach the Other in conversation is to welcome his expression, in which at each instant he overflows the idea a thought would carry away from it. It is therefore to receive from the Other beyond the capacity of the I...
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I figure its coming any way. Why not start discussion. What are the strategies for the east early on?
 
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Antigonus Monophthalmus
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Asia Minor and the Chersonnes are your best friend.
 
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Michael @mgouker
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Oh yeah, the cutaround the Black Sea gambit. +3 stability (+4 if you add Armenia), +1 GOP (easiest to defend - who else wants to go there?) It's a great move.

 
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Antigonus Monophthalmus
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You gotta keep a galley or two around for those damn pirates, though!
 
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William Payne
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What about the ultra historic game? Do you still go north, or is Egypt a must?
 
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Antigonus Monophthalmus
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I couldn't say with any experience, but I think I would definitely head north still. Maybe after fighting for Asia Minor, first.

I just feel like if you give the Greeks a chance to really set up a stranglehold on Asia Minor, you're done for. It's such a defensible position with all those mountains, and even a few well placed HI can hamper the largest of invading forces.

I think setting the boundaries in Asia Minor and taking the Chersonnes neck is very important for Egypt, even at the threat of a powerful Egypt beating up their southern cities.
 
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Michael @mgouker
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East is a very strange side. Because of the Baghdad Booty Call and the possibility for Successor Wars and lost activations, a very good player can have a very hard time. On the other hand, some good cards, good leaders, a good strategy, and not a little luck with the BBC roll and you can be the dominant power.

There are enormous advantages for the East. Even with the problems with Scenario VI (the historical scenario), Egypt has tremendous resources and only one side of the board to be concerned with. Its principal enemy, Greece, is in a terrible position from the beginning of the game. East's leaders are pretty good and I like the 2-6 leader East gets once the Seleucid Army is activated. You can do a lot with him. So what should you do?

Well, primarily you need to work against Greece both diplomatically and militarily. Asia Minor is going to take you most of the game to dominate, but East doesn't need all of Asia Minor to become powerful. In the historical scenario, you have Syria, Palestine, and Cyprus. Syria pays 2T, so essentially you are in the same position as Rome without having Greece on your soil. You have Antioch, a city, and Jerusalem, a town. In the first turn, you should make Jerusalem a city and build two towns. In most games, this will already put you in second place in CVP. You should take Cilicia and Cappadocia and Lycia if you can. Also, as Dan mentioned, score Armenia, Scythia, and the Chersonese as well. There is likely no opposition to this latter move, though Greece may be trying to move against you along the s coast of Asia Minor. In any fair fight, though, East has the advantage on land. The Seleucid army is very strong and Greece cannot use the Soldier of Fortune against you in Scenario VI. If you are a target of Soldier of Fortune in Scenario V, then you better get Rome to stab Greece as soon as possible. Greece has to choose the Danube or Asia Minor. Make Asia Minor an unattractive choice.

For the west part of Asia Minor, you need Perganum, the Pontines, or Rhodes on your side to really be effective. Yes, you can eventually raise armies to crush them and Greece as well, but it's always nice to spring a trap on Greece at the worst possible time.

I think East in Scenario V against a table of equal opponents has significant advantages. In scenario VI, I don't think it's so bad either, as long as you adjust your play. It still depends on pressuring Greece until it pops and Rome is the variable. If Rome is strong, Greece must give in or lose. Often that's exactly what East needs. Also, remember that Scenario VI also has Successor War effects for Greece.

I once saw the East in scenario V stretch from Germania, around Egypt into much of Carthage. The player had an income of over 40T (almost 50T) and didn't even control Asia Minor completely. At the same time, I played Greece once in Scenario V and occupied Egypt and Cyprus and Carthage had Cyrenaica (my best game, by the way). I guess my point is that there is a wild variation of results. I can see where some may not like to play East for this reason, but it is one of my favorite sides (the other incidentally is Greece, which is the hardest side to play).

You need to be very flexible in your approach. For Carthage I recommended a steady build of a navy. For East, you need to build enough navy to make Cyprus impregnable, but otherwise you are mostly ok (it's nice to have navy in Cyrene too, just in case). Thus, most of your income goes into new armies (big fat armies with cavalry) and civilization building. Try to build up your income as high as you can. I mentioned before that you can grab Scythia and Armenia (which don't count as GOPs, but do give stability and 1T per turn). With the Chersonese, Cilicia, Lycia, Cappadocia, and Galatia (all very possible considering the abilities of your leaders and the size of your army), you add 7T to your treasury. Even with the reduced size East of Scenario Vi, you are nearly to 20T income in the first turn. For Scenario V, it's even better. It's worth a SW or two (three or four, I don't know...)
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William Payne
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"Scythia and Armenia (which don't count as GOPs, but do give stability and 1T per turn)"

I thought they counted for GOP as a province but not a territory. Am I wrong? Something I read in the living rules gave me that impression.
 
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Neil Randall
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Tisander wrote:
"Scythia and Armenia (which don't count as GOPs, but do give stability and 1T per turn)"

I thought they counted for GOP as a province but not a territory. Am I wrong? Something I read in the living rules gave me that impression.


The map actually means - and does not state - that you get no GOP for the territory, just for the province (which echoes the 2.11 Living Rules addition in blue). But I've been playing that it gets no GOP at all, because the map says so - which is what the future Living Rules will say (but they won't happen for quite a while).

Neil
 
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William Payne
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I like that you get GOP for the province. Before I got the living rules I played that you got no GOP, but I like the living rules better.
 
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William Payne
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When playing the ultra historic game, I think East must attack Egypt first. The army you start with can take Egypt on the first turn with a little luck, giving you 8T and 3 GOP. The talants will come in very handy against Greece. You can also take a couple of provinces in Asia Minor on the first turn cause there are no tribes.

If you wait then not olny can Egypt attack you in Judea, but also after your army is dwindled, you will have a money crunch that prevents you from building another one large enough to take Egypt later. Egypt ends up becoming a thorn in your side for the rest of the game.

This also opens up a much needed front against Cathage or in case they begin to run away with it much in the early game.

Your initial assets cannot be used more effectively outside of Egypt.
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