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Subject: TCS and CWBS...where to begin? rss

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Hilary Hartman
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Okay, so I found two really great Geeklists covering both series of the MMP/The Gamers games.

TCS Geeklist
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/7594

CWB Geeklist
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/9339

I was really stoked by what I read, until I went to the MMP website and found that most of the games are out of print! Ack!

cry

I checked the online shops and the FLGS and not one of the "entry level" games mentioned is in stock. I checked the BGG marketplace and found one or two, and even sent off an offer to a fellow BGGer for a copy of the CWB game Perryville (not only is it mentioned in the Geeklist as a good entry level game, but I live less than an hour from the battlefield).

But I was wondering: based on the games currently available from MMP, where should I start with these two series?

I have experience in wargames, and I don't think either series shall prove too daunting. Time is a factor, and I cannot leave the game set-up overnight.

Thanks.
 
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Gary Krockover
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Check the VASSAL site (www.vassalengine.org), I have a number of the CWBS games translated there.

The top $ and most difficult to obtain CWBS games are Thunder II and ITQF II (I found). Perryville is a good game for the series for those new to it (it's a single mapper). No Better Place to Die is also a very good choice, but as noted they are OOP. I think that the best bang for your buck would be the 3BoM game (available at MMP). 3 Maps (some single map scenarios are included) covering the 1st and 2nd battle of Manassas (Bull Run) as well as a hypothetical 3rd battle.

Also, you can download and preview the rules booklets from MMP's archive site here: http://www.gamersarchive.net/theGamers/archive/cwb.htm

So you can decide if this is the type of game that you'd be interested in or not.

My review of the series is that they are solid games, easy to play, and unique with the orders system (which is the most difficult concept to grasp only because it is so unique). I enjoy playing them (and have a couple of pbem games going at the moment in fact). I'd like more detail in the combat system (defensive terrain bonuses for example) but I think the outcome of battle in the end is pretty close to accurate with the total casualties and results. Some things are out of your hands as the Army Commander though - if you're left flank is taking a beating and you have a reserve that refuses to accept the orders that you have sent to them, it can be frustrating - as it must of been in real.
 
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Kevin Moody
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Quote:
Time is a factor, and I cannot leave the game set-up overnight.
That will probably rule out the TCS games, and all but the smaller CWB scenarios. I agree with Gary about 3BoM. No Better Place to Die would be the best and least expensive way to look into it, as it only recently went out of print and should be available at reasonable prices on the resell market.
 
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Ken Feldman
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For TCS, Bloody Ridge has been designed to be the new entry level game. It is a small game with a single map.

Screaming Eagles is also a good game to start with because of the easier Line of Sight (LOS) in that game. It's a large game, which would allow you to play the orders system in all its glory, after you play a few small scenarios to learn the system mechanics.

No Better Place to Die is recommended as a starter game for CWBS because it is a one-mapper, and until recently, it was on sale for $13 at the MMP website. It should still be available from on-line stores or eBay for fairly low prices. (I found Perryville to be one of the harder to obtain, more expensive games in the series.)

Three Days of Manassas would be an excellent game to start with too. First Bull Run is a smaller battle that runs one day, so you could learn the system with that. Then you have two larger battles (2nd Bull Run and the hypothetical 3rd Bull Run) to play out. Some scenarios use only one map, but most use two or three so you get a chance to manuever your armies.

I have some the TCS and CWB games that I'd be willing to sell or trade, check my profile.

Ken
 
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Peter Vrabel
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I've only played Screaming Eagles In Holland of the TCS series, but I can tell you that if time is a problem, this series is not for you.

Some of the smaller scenarios can be played in a reasonable time period (A few hours) But the command system is best with the longer games, longer being 10 hours and up (Way, way, up)

Bloody Ridge is supposed to be a good introduction into the TCS system, and it's still in print, since it much smaller (1 map instead of 2 and 1 countersheet instead of 3)
 
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oystein eker
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CWBS still in MMP store.

Seven Pines
Malvern Hill
Gaines Mill.

All 3 together make a monster game of 7 days battle. But each of them contains several smaller scenarios.

Seven Pines is my favourite.
 
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Clinton Smith
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Semper Fi!, which contains a variety of small Korean War scenarios, is an excellent first game for somebody who wants to test-drive the TCS system.
 
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Hilary Hartman
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Ken and I worked out a trade, so I'll soon be joining the ranks of TCS and CWBS players. The gameplay sounds intriguing, and my wife seems generally interested in trying both game systems.

(She's a huge, huge fan of the original Squad Leader, and while I know that game and these systems are two totally different tigers, I do a little happy dance knowing that she does dig wargames as much as the next guy!)

Thanks, Ken, for the trade, and thanks to the rest of you for your suggestions! AAR reports to follow hopefully before the end of November!
 
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Ken Feldman
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You're welcome. And thanks to the trade, I'll soon have my first block wargame. (Semper Fi and No Better Place to Die for Europe Engulfed in case anyone is interested.)

Ken
 
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Jeff Yeackle
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Kenfeldman wrote:
You're welcome. And thanks to the trade, I'll soon have my first block wargame. (Semper Fi and No Better Place to Die for Europe Engulfed in case anyone is interested.)

Ken


Doh! I was just eyeing your Semper Fi too... I'm pretty sure Hilary will get it to the table before I do though. I'm sure a copy will find it's way to me down the road (which will be when I'll be able to play it anyway).

I just found a copy of OCS Korea: Forgotten War. It's $5 above retail, but I haven't found it anywhere else and I'll probably grab that.
 
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