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Dead of Winter: A Crossroads Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Can you ask others to exile you? rss

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Dave Blanchard
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We ran into a weird problem with a game tonight...

I got to a point in game where there was no way I could reach my secret goal...so I basically lost the game from that point forward.

The only way I could win would be to get exiled and possibly get a new objective.

I am under the belief(correct me if I am wrong) that I cannot exile myself from the game. So I initiated a zombie attack on another player by increasing the zombies that could possibly spawn in a location by making noise, thereby hopefully getting myself exiled.


Note, this was our second game and I'm not even sure the objectives would be any better with the exile card.

Can you say hey guys can you exile me for whatever reason?
 
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Caleb Kester
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There's almost no reason for them to exile a player if they know you aren't a betrayal. If 2 people ever get exiled and no one is the betrayer then game over. If you play as a survivor and you purposely tank the game then that ruins the game for everyone else. What was your objective? I'd rather approach this topic with giving advise for the really hard secret objectives then to encourage tanking the game to get exiled.

If you had time to get exiled and complete your new objective chances are you could have comoleted your secret.
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Dave Blanchard
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ObsoleteThree wrote:
There's almost no reason for them to exile a player if they know you aren't a betrayal. If 2 people ever get exiled and no one is the betrayer then game over. If you play as a survivor and you purposely tank the game then that ruins the game for everyone else. What was your objective? I'd rather approach this topic with giving advise for the really hard secret objectives then to encourage tanking the game to get exiled.

If you had time to get exiled and complete your new objective chances are you could have comoleted your secret.


I wasn't purposefully tanking...I was looking at a way of trying to win by getting rid of a bad objective.

I had to have more followers then anyone else and I had lost one the previous turn and was behind the leading player by at least 3 followers....with maybe two turns left to solve the group objective.

In this case it didn't work out for other reasons....I haven't looked at the exiled objectives, it was more a hail mary shot at possibly winning.
 
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Michael S
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My advice in a situation like this is to just play it out and try your best to help complete the main objective and make it fun for everyone involved. There is still a ton of fun to be had in this game even if you arent going to "win" it.

But like Caleb stated above, there really is no benefit for them to exile you for no reason. So while you could ask them to do that it doesnt make much sense.
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Greg
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Maybe start doing some things that a betrayer would do to get yourself exiled. That way you don't have to ask them to do it.
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Dave Blanchard
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Hahma wrote:
Maybe start doing some things that a betrayer would do to get yourself exiled. That way you don't have to ask them to do it.


That was why I brought the zombies in, I didn't have anything in my hand to tip it any other way.

Looking back, I think I should have just played it out. It was only our second game where I was thinking there was only one way to win. I don't think I would try it again.

Another player said I should have just asked them to exile me and I said that really would be against the rules...ahh, it didn't go over well with him and backfired overall...

Part of learning a new game I suppose.
 
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Matthew Vines
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You don't say how many rounds were left in the game when you realized you were in trouble. But it seems pretty likely that that in 2-3 rounds you could have killed 1 or 2 of the leading players survivors, either through direct attacks or by overloading their locations with zombies. And at least taken a few attempts at getting a survivor or two for yourself. This behavior is going to seem a little crazy to the rest of your team, but that's what secret objectives do, they drive manic behavior until they are satisfied.

Personally, I will never tank a game just because I think I can't win. But I will recklessly endanger the team to take that last chance or two at snatching the least chance of a victory.
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Jim Bobson
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mvines wrote:

Personally, I will never tank a game just because I think I can't win. But I will recklessly endanger the team to take that last chance or two at snatching the least chance of a victory.


This is the correct answer.

There's nothing wrong with actively delaying the completion of the main objective until you've completed your secret objective. We've all done it. I've played the objective that required medicine under the main objective card, and I didn't contribute for 3 rounds because we had almost completed the main objective and I was nowhere near getting my secret objective done.

(I was actually exiled that game because my lack of contributions was 'suspicious', but won as an exiled player)

You just have to remember that there is a difference between 'I'm gonna be a bit selfish here and do things that help me' or 'I'll actively avoid helping' or even 'I'll get a couple of people killed here so I can go to the location and search for my objective' and 'I can't complete my secret objective. Fuck this, I'm gonna make everyone fail'

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Dave Blanchard
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mvines wrote:
You don't say how many rounds were left in the game when you realized you were in trouble. But it seems pretty likely that that in 2-3 rounds you could have killed 1 or 2 of the leading players survivors, either through direct attacks or by overloading their locations with zombies. And at least taken a few attempts at getting a survivor or two for yourself. This behavior is going to seem a little crazy to the rest of your team, but that's what secret objectives do, they drive manic behavior until they are satisfied.

Personally, I will never tank a game just because I think I can't win. But I will recklessly endanger the team to take that last chance or two at snatching the least chance of a victory.


That was also my theory...taking him out by over loading with zombies helped me by eliminating one player in his hand, which helped me get one step closer to my victory...the only other problem with that is there wasn't enough moral in the game to kill enough people.
 
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Dave Blanchard
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Mangoose wrote:
mvines wrote:

Personally, I will never tank a game just because I think I can't win. But I will recklessly endanger the team to take that last chance or two at snatching the least chance of a victory.


This is the correct answer.

There's nothing wrong with actively delaying the completion of the main objective until you've completed your secret objective. We've all done it. I've played the objective that required medicine under the main objective card, and I didn't contribute for 3 rounds because we had almost completed the main objective and I was nowhere near getting my secret objective done.

(I was actually exiled that game because my lack of contributions was 'suspicious', but won as an exiled player)

You just have to remember that there is a difference between 'I'm gonna be a bit selfish here and do things that help me' or 'I'll actively avoid helping' or even 'I'll get a couple of people killed here so I can go to the location and search for my objective' and 'I can't complete my secret objective. Fuck this, I'm gonna make everyone fail'



Yeah, it wasn't my objective to make everyone fail...I was hoping on a slim hope of coming out with a narrow win.
 
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Keith Li
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Instead of attracting zombies for a "sure" kill, try something less damaging but as obvious like directly attacking to wound a character (but don't kill him).
 
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Iain Brown
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I can't remember the exact phrasing of that objective, but I'd have been tempted to try to exile the player who had a lot of survivors. Having lots of survivors is suspicious in and of itself, so it would have been reasonably easy.
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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I agree that I wouldn't exile another player just because they asked me to. If they weren't a betrayer, we would lose that wiggle room for being able to exile the actual betrayer. Exiling two non-betrayers will lose the game, so I'm not going to waste one of those two shots.

If I'm in a position where I think that it's highly unlikely that I will complete my secret objective, I agree that it can be tempting to wonder whether I could do an exiled objective instead (even though they are generally even more difficult). But I don't think there's any good way to try it.

Most of the things you would do to try to "trick" the other players into exiling you, would also hurt your overall chances of winning. If you did something to lower Morale, such as killing another character for example, that gets you closer to losing, too. Or you could try to horde cards to make others suspicious, but in order to do that, you would have to keep cards that could be helping with the main objective.

I would just try my best with my current objective.
 
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Raf Cordero
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On your turn, you can also tell everyone that you'd like some more survivors and ask if anyone has one of the "Add Survivors" event card in their hand. Then you get survivors without having to search/attack anyone.

In your case, attacking the guy with the most survivors to try and kill some of his or just to get yourself exiled is totally legit.
 
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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captainraffi wrote:
On your turn, you can also tell everyone that you'd like some more survivors and ask if anyone has one of the "Add Survivors" event card in their hand. Then you get survivors without having to search/attack anyone.

In your case, attacking the guy with the most survivors to try and kill some of his or just to get yourself exiled is totally legit.


Well, I wouldn't give someone an Add Survivors card unless they explained to me how doing so would help satisfy the main objective or prevent our Morale from going down. I wouldn't give it to them if they just said that they'd "like to have more". But that shouldn't be that difficult to explain.
 
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David Williams
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randomlife wrote:
captainraffi wrote:
On your turn, you can also tell everyone that you'd like some more survivors and ask if anyone has one of the "Add Survivors" event card in their hand. Then you get survivors without having to search/attack anyone.

In your case, attacking the guy with the most survivors to try and kill some of his or just to get yourself exiled is totally legit.


Well, I wouldn't give someone an Add Survivors card unless they explained to me how doing so would help satisfy the main objective or prevent our Morale from going down. I wouldn't give it to them if they just said that they'd "like to have more". But that shouldn't be that difficult to explain.


And if they said

"Because it's either that or I spend all my dice searching and making noise looking for my own - wouldn't you rather I didn't have to?"

Or even

"Because if I can't get more survivors, I'm going to have to do something pretty drastic and worse for the group than just adding a couple more mouths - so if you can't help me, you might as well exile me now."

?

If someone's going to do whatever it takes to complete their objective, possibly to the point of attacking other people's characters, wasting time looking for their own survivor cards, and would even be happy to be exiled if it means they can try for a new objective, then it seems to me it's probably worth helping them out.

Or else vote to exile - which might be what they want anyway.

I'm not saying it should be automatic, but I don't think I could ever make a blanket statement that I won't give other people survivors unless they convince me it directly helps the main objective. The obvious time is if someone is down to 1 survivor and has been helpful to that point - I'd rather keep them in the game than have them lose their cards and be less able to help themselves.

There seems to be exceptions to every 'rule' when it comes to optimal play in this game. It's all about what players are prepared to do to complete their objective, and the subsequent interactions.

Some people are happy to just complete the main objective for the 'diet coke' victory. Others will happily jeopardise that to complete their secret objective. I don't think there's a right or wrong way to do it - some approaches will work well in some groups, other approaches will work for other groups.
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Dave Blanchard
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Thanks for the answers guys, I was a bit torn on the whole event. I can't say it ended well afterwords, this game can get people worked up, but it is so good.
 
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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Orion3T wrote:
And if they said

"Because it's either that or I spend all my dice searching and making noise looking for my own - wouldn't you rather I didn't have to?"

Or even

"Because if I can't get more survivors, I'm going to have to do something pretty drastic and worse for the group than just adding a couple more mouths - so if you can't help me, you might as well exile me now."

?

If someone's going to do whatever it takes to complete their objective, possibly to the point of attacking other people's characters, wasting time looking for their own survivor cards, and would even be happy to be exiled if it means they can try for a new objective, then it seems to me it's probably worth helping them out.

Or else vote to exile - which might be what they want anyway.

I'm not saying it should be automatic, but I don't think I could ever make a blanket statement that I won't give other people survivors unless they convince me it directly helps the main objective. The obvious time is if someone is down to 1 survivor and has been helpful to that point - I'd rather keep them in the game than have them lose their cards and be less able to help themselves.

There seems to be exceptions to every 'rule' when it comes to optimal play in this game. It's all about what players are prepared to do to complete their objective, and the subsequent interactions.

Some people are happy to just complete the main objective for the 'diet coke' victory. Others will happily jeopardise that to complete their secret objective. I don't think there's a right or wrong way to do it - some approaches will work well in some groups, other approaches will work for other groups.


Right, this is not really different from what I was saying, you just provided some great examples. When I said that I wouldn't give someone a card unless they explain how it would help the main objective, their explanation could be that the actions they would otherwise take could hurt the Colony. That's good enough for me.

However, I would continue to keep an eye on them because it's pretty suspicious behavior overall and the person could be a betrayer.

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