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Star Wars: Armada» Forums » General

Subject: Maneuver Tool...problematic? rss

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Terence Lee
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The maneuver tool looks cool, but do you think there's going to be issues with having to move miniatures out of the way to use it? Seems like that might be a pain.
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Allen T
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That will always be an issue with measurement based movement.
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Colby Bimore
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Without having tried the maneuver tool myself I tend to agree with your initial observations.

Perhaps since we are playing with Capital Ships the miniature density on the tabletop won't be heavy and so the placement of the tool won't be such a big issue.

I'm hoping that it won't be fragile either but I guess we will see when the games gets released.
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Charlie Theel
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At GenCon some players did have issues when moving through/around clusters of fighters. There were some large fighter groups out there.
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Colby Bimore
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I guess players will have to temporarily place tokens/cards on the tabletop in place of their minis if the minis are in the way of an accurate maneuver tool reading?
 
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Allen T
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In X-Wing you can tip the ships on their sides, or use markers to indicate their position. I don't know if either of these solutions will work in Armada, though, like it doesn't work in X-Wing with the Falcon.
 
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Terence Lee
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monkeykins wrote:
That will always be an issue with measurement based movement.


It was a pain with X-wing, but manageable, but this tool is much longer and more cumbersome. Seems like it may be even more of a problem than with most games. (hoping not tho)
 
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Colby Bimore
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We will have to see how this tool works and see if we can come up with an alternate that isn't so cumbersome.
 
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Grish
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Just by looking at that movement tool any logical person should worry. Great idea, but putting down a long clickable garden hose in the middle of a pitched battle might be problematic, right?

Still, we haven't seen the game yet. Who knows, they might have changed the tool slightly. I'm optimistic about it as FFG has been on fire lately with the quality of their games. Pretty sure that they wouldn't release a game with an unplayable movement tool. They've branded themselves as a great gaming company for a good reason.

My advice, for what it's worth, would be not to stress until you play around with it yourself.
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Will

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It could be worse. The Flight Path templates have been consolidated by numbers into 4 piece sets: all of the "1" moves; all of the "2" moves; all of the "3" moves; and a straight piece with marks for "4" & "5" and long enough for "6" straight. What makes it worse is that on the 1, 2, 3 pieces, they didn't even make it so that you would flip for left or right. Instead, it covers the straight, both banks, and both turns so when you are in a cluster and trying to do a 3 maneuver, you may need to move several other miniatures around to place the template.
 
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Chris Hinkes
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You can put the tool on either side of the ship, though. So that should help.
 
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Kristoff Bergenholm
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Broadstorm wrote:
It could be worse. The Flight Path templates have been consolidated by numbers into 4 piece sets: all of the "1" moves; all of the "2" moves; all of the "3" moves; and a straight piece with marks for "4" & "5" and long enough for "6" straight. What makes it worse is that on the 1, 2, 3 pieces, they didn't even make it so that you would flip for left or right. Instead, it covers the straight, both banks, and both turns so when you are in a cluster and trying to do a 3 maneuver, you may need to move several other miniatures around to place the template.


Those consolidated templates are terrible, and you're a terrible person if you try using them.
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Chris K.
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Zeromus wrote:
You can put the tool on either side of the ship, though. So that should help.


I doubt that that is the case, unless you go straight, since if you turn these two would give you differing final positions.
 
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Leo Zappa
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tlee33 wrote:
The maneuver tool looks cool, but do you think there's going to be issues with having to move miniatures out of the way to use it? Seems like that might be a pain.


I had the same concern when I first saw that tool, and it's one of the factors which is off putting to me about this game. The other one is that the stands that the capital ships sit on look like small coffee tables. As cool as the models look (and they look very, very cool), the game tools seem clunky and frankly ugly. I much prefer the stands and templates in X-Wing and Attack Wing.
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Cal Neuvost
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monkeykins wrote:
In X-Wing you can tip the ships on their sides, or use markers to indicate their position. I don't know if either of these solutions will work in Armada, though, like it doesn't work in X-Wing with the Falcon.

You can mark large ships with a movement template just like the small ones ...

Zeromus wrote:
You can put the tool on either side of the ship, though. So that should help.

A lot of maneuvers will only work on one side and would cause the ship and template to overlap at the template's hinges otherwise ...
 
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Allen T
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Neuvost wrote:
monkeykins wrote:
In X-Wing you can tip the ships on their sides, or use markers to indicate their position. I don't know if either of these solutions will work in Armada, though, like it doesn't work in X-Wing with the Falcon.

You can mark large ships with a movement template just like the small ones ...


I mean you can't just tip the Falcon over on its side and move through it. You can still place a speed 2 template along the side or speed 1 between the nubs.
 
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mad tulip
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i suggest to mount at leats 2 webcams together with some laserpointers attached to some gentries over the table and hook it to some object recognition software so that the webcams can calculate initial and final position of the move and the laserpointers can outline the corners of the base to be placed.

once thats working we could also use the system for "is in range"/"is not in range" arguments that will surely happen in this type of game.
 
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Larry DeStefano
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Same here worried about the clickable movement template. Thinking if it can be broken down in sections, might be better. Why do you need the whole stick if only moving one. Or if your moving a lot but the first 2/3 is clear move that, then start worrying about how to clear the last 1/3.
 
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mad tulip
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well you can still move just on the front segment 3->4 for a 1 move if stuff is in the way as all the dimensions apear to be the same.
 
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Colby Bimore
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At this point it is useless for us to speculate on how the maneuver tool will be.

Once the game is released we will be able to judge for ourselves and then decide if we like the tool or not.

The only other option might be to contact one of the game's developers or playtesters and get their feedback.

Good luck to us all.
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Grish
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The Tool looks to be fine. Check out the new article up on FFG.

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=5357

You will be able to buy a separate tool. It can be taken apart to have a short one to squeeze into small spaces.

edited: terrible spelling!

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Colby Bimore
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Interesting.

The news update just came out. It's like FFG was looking in on this thread lol
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Allen T
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R2EQ wrote:
The Tool looks to be fine. Check out the new article up on FFG.

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=5357

You will be able to buy a separate tool. It can be taken apart to have a short one to squeeze into small spaces.

edited: terrible spelling!



This is brilliant. Add that to my preorder...
 
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Davey Jones
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R2EQ wrote:
The Tool looks to be fine. Check out the new article up on FFG.

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=5357

You will be able to buy a separate tool. It can be taken apart to have a short one to squeeze into small spaces.

edited: terrible spelling!



looking at the latest pictures it seems the new all plastic tool is
now also included in the box, instead of the plastic/cardboard one
that you can see in earlier pics and the demo video.


madtulip wrote:
i suggest to mount at leats 2 webcams together with some laserpointers attached to some gentries over the table and hook it to some object recognition software so that the webcams can calculate initial and final position of the move and the laserpointers can outline the corners of the base to be placed.

once thats working we could also use the system for "is in range"/"is not in range" arguments that will surely happen in this type of game.


actualy all it would take is one good camera and the right software.
maybe a symbol on the bases of each ship to help the software recognise them.
 
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mad tulip
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Davey Jones wrote:
madtulip wrote:
i suggest to mount at leats 2 webcams together with some laserpointers attached to some gentries over the table and hook it to some object recognition software so that the webcams can calculate initial and final position of the move and the laserpointers can outline the corners of the base to be placed.

once thats working we could also use the system for "is in range"/"is not in range" arguments that will surely happen in this type of game.


actualy all it would take is one good camera and the right software.
maybe a symbol on the bases of each ship to help the software recognise them.


The x-box Kinect camera can do stereoscopic recordings for quite cheap and there are libraries avialable which already implement creating the 3D meshes. still object recognition has to be code afaik.
 
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