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Subject: Cheese tsunami (minor Chapter 3 spoilers) rss

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BrentS
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I played Chapter 3 with my daughter and her friends yesterday and after a Chapter 1 loss to time and a narrow Chapter 2 win, this proved to be a cakewalk (or a cheesewalk). One of the extraordinary and surprising aspects was just how much cheese the mice accumulated….at one point both Lily and Maginos had over 15 cheese each, were competing to fill out the most cheese wheels and we were substituting glass tokens to keep up. The hoarding was just a function of 10 year old excitement, despite my encouragement to use it for abilities and leveling up (which they eventually did when they realised they couldn't take it with them…..5 level ups among the participating mice). I wondered whether I'd missed something in the rules……a limit on cheese to that provided in the game or a limit to the amount of cheese each mouse could hold……but could find nothing in the rulebook or a rules search here, apart from some variant house ruling.

Admittedly this was due to some extraordinary circumstances, in addition to the innate abilities of Lily and Filch; a well played early Determination, wildly successful gambling in the Dining Hall, a seemingly endless cheese roll sequence by Maginos with his Scorching Wand and dismal rolling by the few roaches we met…..as well as other game changers like acquiring Catnip just before our one encounter with Brodie, a completely successful round of gambling in the Dining Hall without a weapon drawn, an outrageous Maginos-Cheddar Golem rampage and a complete 5 consecutive asterisk morale failure of Elite Rats when Vurst was sent packing in the Alchemist's Chamber.

After the tight challenges of the first two chapters, I think the girls were a little deflated by the ease with which they managed this one…..and my daughter is asking me to make more cheese tokens. I can also foresee some mice levelling up completely long before we finish the story. I can see that this situation wouldn't happen often and was in part due to a combination of extreme factors in this particular session, but the house rules which have been created by some players (such as sticking to the limitation of cheese tokens provide with the game and taking it from mice for the cheese wheel when the bank is empty) are also an indication that it does sometimes happen.

I'm just wondering how common an experience it is among experienced groups to have this sort of cheese blowout.

Brent.

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Greg
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Never had that happen in a boatload of games played between regular games and playtesting Heart of Glorm and Downwood Tales.

Maybe we never rolled that good to get cheese or just used our abilities more and spent the cheese for them.
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BrentS
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Hahma wrote:
Never had that happen in a boatload of games played between regular games and playtesting Heart of Glorm and Downwood Tales.

Maybe we never rolled that good to get cheese or just used our abilities more and spent the cheese for them.


Thanks. That's good to know.

Again, I expect this was a highly unusual circumstance and potentially specific to this chapter. Whatever the odds, there is a possibility for gambling mice who already have a supply of cheese to really rake in the winnings. Combined with other lucky breaks here, the girls never felt threatened enough to delve into their cheese stashes to use their abilities, except for some redistribution to Tilda for healing. I'd note that I was playing Filch and was the only one not to level up, spending cheese on Energy Rush almost every turn (which is how we took out Vurst fairly quickly).

Brent.
 
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Ken Marley
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Brent,

Yes, Determination in Chapter 3, lucky gambling, Filch, and Lilly can lead to a lot of cheese.

Here are some common mistakes that people make to get extra cheese, but it doesn't sound like you made any of them.

1) You DO NOT get cheese when rolling to move.

2) You DO NOT roll defense on a miss.

Again I do not think you were making these mistakes, but they are the most common mistakes.

The game can be swingy. I have had chapters that were hard one play be easy the next.
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Greg Forster
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Pleasant Prairie
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"When playing a game, the goal is to win, but it is the goal that is important, not the winning" - Dr. Reiner Knizia
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youperguy wrote:
The game can be swingy. I have had chapters that were hard one play be easy the next.


The cheese is part of the "swinginess" of the game - in a good way. It balances out the swings. When attacking or defending with the mice, some of the dice on which you don't get hits or shields give you cheese, so if you roll a lot of hits on attack or shields on defense you won't have a lot of cheese, whereas if you don't you are at least likely to have more cheese. And the same balancing mechanic applies when the minions roll; each minion die can either give the bad guys the hit/shield they're looking for or put a cheese on the wheel, but not both.

This is why you (and they) don't get cheese when rolling movement.
 
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Sebastian Zarzycki
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I've played way over 50 sessions of Mice and Mystics. Not once had I lost due to too much cheese rolled. If anything, it was because of mouse captures or other conditions. Whatever chapter I play, from all the expansions, I safely land a 1-3 pages before the end - and it would seem that the mechanism is scaled exactly for that. I'd really like to see an example game sometime, where people lose due to too many cheese. My suspicion is that it's either some rules applied wrong, or simply bad tactical/skill decisions.
 
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