Peter Mulholland
United Kingdom
Mirfield
West Yorkshire
flag msg tools
I really like squid.
badge
I really like squid.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
So obviously your read the first bit of italicised text to yourself, then if it triggers you immediately stop the play and read the flavour text.

What I'm talking about is crossroad cards with multiple options or a vote. Almost all of these (that I've seen) have a small amount of flavour text, then the result actions to take. For (a fictitious) example:

Option 1
The flare shoots up, hitting the hot air balloon which catches on fire. The burning fabric falls down covering you and your group. All survivors at your location receive two wounds.

Option 2
The balloon drifts away on the light morning breeze, gradually disappearing over the horizon. You look at each, shrug and continue with your search. Could that have been your salvation? Lower morale by 1.

(Hmm that gives me an idea for a crossroads card...) Anyway. My question is how much of the option/vote text do you read? I always teach people to just read the first bit, the flavour text. That way they only find out what the effect will be after choosing/voting. For me this is more thematic as IRL you won't know what's going to happen before you do it, and when people know the outcome it can affect their choices. Without knowing what will happen it becomes much more of a moral decision. (This was highlighted on the Dead of Winter episode of TableTop where they read out the effects of the cards. You're only ever going to choose the best option for the game, not what you think is the right thing to do).

So Im just interested in what other people do, and what your opinions are. (And maybe if Jonathan Gilmour has an opinion?)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve Jones
United Kingdom
Surbiton
Surrey
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've seen people play it both ways but I far prefer it the way you have highlighted - more thematic, immersive and tense.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lee Fisher
United States
Downingtown
PA
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
There's a number of threads on this, but to summarize,
Not reading the entire cards makes it
A) Harder initially
B) Gives experienced players who may have encountered the card before an unfair advantage.
14 
 Thumb up
0.50
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brandon Alderman
United States
Shady Spring
West Virginia
flag msg tools
Trust me, I am not the Traitor.
badge
For Orcs there is no other life but WAR!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
We read the options...the problem you have with this is that if you dont read the options those players that have played more and thus seen some of the crossroads would have an advantage to those that haven't played as much or seen that crossroads card before.

Not to mention you have to make sure people dont read it on their own when they draw it incase it comes up in a future game.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ossian Grr aka "Josh"
United States
Chelmsford
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
GRRRRR!!!
badge
GRRRRRRRRR!!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
If you care about such things like rulebook text, it's pretty explicit on reading the whole thing:

Rulebook p 12 wrote:
If at any time on the player's turn she meets the requirements of the trigger, all of the card's text is read aloud by the player who drew it.


8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ryan M
Canada
Regina
Saskatchewan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've always instructed people to read the whole thing. While I agree it is a pinch more thematic to not tell people the result, I also think the results are kind of obvious half of the time. It's not like people are going to hear "The mob attacks you" and not think it probably means taking wounds or something. Since knowing the result of the decision isn't typically a surprise I don't see why just telling people right up front would make that much thematic difference.

The intent of the crossroads cards it to make a good decision, or best decision given the options. And if you don't know the outcome, then it makes it tough to really make a decision that helps the most or hurts the least.

Also, I've done way more than my fair share of group meetings/discussions and nothing is more painful than a group of supposedly smart people working on a hypothetical problem. Using your own balloon example I could honestly foresee discussion going on for way too long and people running into the mental woods. Things like "Well, if we signal the balloon it may be full of people and we get to chose which people we want or don't want and maybe there is medicine and food as well so we should do that and get all this free stuff we need." Then somebody else goes, "But if it flies away then all those people may still drop all that food and medicine on us causing morale to go up 2 or 3 points and we'd still get the supplies without the extra mouths to feed and MAYBE, some of our helpless survivors will run off following the balloon which help us out even more."

Think of the disappointment and confusion and perhaps even frustration the group then would feel if they decide to try and signal the balloon only to have someone accidentally shoot the flare right at the balloon causing it to crash and damage them all. I foresee a bunch of people saying, "WTF?! Why would we shoot it AT the balloon. That makes zero sense. And why would it crash on top of us, that makes no sense either. Why didn't we run away! Why did we just stand there and let a flaming balloon crash on top of us and this is stupid!"

Never underestimate the potentially dumb logic that comes from group discussions like this. So I am going to stick with reading the whole card. I don't feel the impact it will have on the game is worth the tiny extra drop of theme it would add. BUt that is just me. I'm sure plenty of people out there will love the game more that way.
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Peter Mulholland
United Kingdom
Mirfield
West Yorkshire
flag msg tools
I really like squid.
badge
I really like squid.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
lfisher wrote:
There's a number of threads on this, but to summarize,
Not reading the entire cards makes it
A) Harder initially
B) Gives experienced players who may have encountered the card before an unfair advantage.


Ah yes your second point is very valid!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Peter Mulholland
United Kingdom
Mirfield
West Yorkshire
flag msg tools
I really like squid.
badge
I really like squid.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Mools wrote:
I've always instructed people to read the whole thing. While I agree it is a pinch more thematic to not tell people the result, I also think the results are kind of obvious half of the time. It's not like people are going to hear "The mob attacks you" and not think it probably means taking wounds or something. Since knowing the result of the decision isn't typically a surprise I don't see why just telling people right up front would make that much thematic difference.

The intent of the crossroads cards it to make a good decision, or best decision given the options. And if you don't know the outcome, then it makes it tough to really make a decision that helps the most or hurts the least.

Also, I've done way more than my fair share of group meetings/discussions and nothing is more painful than a group of supposedly smart people working on a hypothetical problem. Using your own balloon example I could honestly foresee discussion going on for way too long and people running into the mental woods. Things like "Well, if we signal the balloon it may be full of people and we get to chose which people we want or don't want and maybe there is medicine and food as well so we should do that and get all this free stuff we need." Then somebody else goes, "But if it flies away then all those people may still drop all that food and medicine on us causing morale to go up 2 or 3 points and we'd still get the supplies without the extra mouths to feed and MAYBE, some of our helpless survivors will run off following the balloon which help us out even more."

Think of the disappointment and confusion and perhaps even frustration the group then would feel if they decide to try and signal the balloon only to have someone accidentally shoot the flare right at the balloon causing it to crash and damage them all. I foresee a bunch of people saying, "WTF?! Why would we shoot it AT the balloon. That makes zero sense. And why would it crash on top of us, that makes no sense either. Why didn't we run away! Why did we just stand there and let a flaming balloon crash on top of us and this is stupid!"

Never underestimate the potentially dumb logic that comes from group discussions like this. So I am going to stick with reading the whole card. I don't feel the impact it will have on the game is worth the tiny extra drop of theme it would add. BUt that is just me. I'm sure plenty of people out there will love the game more that way.


Beautiful counter argument! I tip my hat to you. Superbly laid out and all very valid (although remember that was a fictional crossroad card (for now)). I shall take it into all into consideration.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kevin Clark
United States
Galesburg
Illinois
flag msg tools
I don't read the flavor text for both options, but I do sum up and paraphrase it and give the entire game effect results for the options.

This gives the player all the game rules needed to make the choice with a bit of the flavor if that would influence their decision. I then will read the full flavor text of the chosen option.

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Peter Mulholland
United Kingdom
Mirfield
West Yorkshire
flag msg tools
I really like squid.
badge
I really like squid.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks for all your replies people! I love the discussion and that's what I was aiming to do with this thread. Great to hear what other people do and get some different points of view on it.

Thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charles Park
United States
Tucson
Arizona
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Here's my two cents:

I initially tried using the summarizing the options on the cards but that didn't work out too well because people couldn't do it so well (Playing with couple of exchange students)

After that, I tried using the method of reading the options but without the results. It slow the game down a lot (like Ryan pointed out a bit). So nope on that

Then on the third game, I decided to go with the rule of reading both options with the results. The game went by quickly without slowing anything down. The only thing I prevented is table talking (unless it's the vote). It was fun to see player(s) squirm as they were trying to make decision.

So I definitely recommend reading the options out loud.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David "Davy" Ashleydale
United States
Oakland
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I liked someone else's idea in a different thread about just reading the mechanical results of each option and letting the player decide just based on those. And then read the flavor text of their choice. Like this:

Player A: You see a hot air balloon drifting across the sky. You remember that you have a flare gun on you. Do you choose Option 1 which will give all survivors at your location 2 wounds each, or Option 2 which will lower Morale by 1?

Player B: Option 2.

Player A: You keep your flare gun holstered. The balloon drifts away on the light morning breeze, gradually disappearing over the horizon. You look at each other, shrug, and continue with your search. Could that have been your salvation?

Player A: [moves Morale down 1]
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.