Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Hide
8 Posts

Shogun» Forums » Sessions

Subject: Shogun rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Tim Isakson
United States
Richardson
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Had a chance to try Shogun Saturday with Doug and KC - the full game (with explanation and set up) took about 2-1/2 hours.

For those of you who enjoy Wallenstein, I expect Shogun will scratch a similar itch - the system is very similar, with a few tweaks (that I think improve things slightly). If you already own Wallenstein, I don't think you need to run out and get a copy of Shogun - but you might want to if you think a new map (or, really, two new maps) and slight rules improvements are worth it.

Our game started out with a bit of unusual luck - KC and I ended up with two main concentrations of provinces, while Doug was mainly concentrated (and, importantly, his interior was fairly isolated from the rest of us). All of us spent the first year consolidating our position, with some building (but not much). After the first year, Doug and KC were tied and I was ~5-10 points behind them.

The second year had KC leaping out to a strong position, and Doug and Myself fighting to take what points we could from him. Doug did have a recurring problem - he had at least three combats that ended up tied (at least once as defender, and a couple of times as attacker), which resulted in the province being razed - no armies, buildings, or revolting farmers being left in the province in question. This left Doug looking weak - which turned out to be a bit of an illusion, as he was able to continue building in the provinces he had a presence in, which despite being weak militarily were well isolated from KC and myself. Doug ended up winning, pulling ahead of KC, with myself as a distant third.

Just to lay my biases on the table, I've not been a fan of Wallenstein, and I don't see Shogun changing my mind. The few tweaks and the map are slight improvements, but the part of the game I don't enjoy is the core system of both of these games - the action selection/execution procedure. This still results in the the type of chaos I tend to dislike, which is the possibility of having a province taken away from you whose action you needed in order to accomplish something later in your turn. While I know many people enjoy these games and that system, this aspect makes the exercise much less enjoyable for me, as it frequently leads to frustration due to inability to accomplish a critical action, and not really being able to do anything to mitigate the consequenes of losing that province. Shogun is not my type of game, which is likely a matter of taste more than anything else.

So in conclusion - I'll be happy if I don't play Shogun or Wallenstein again, although I think I could be talked into giving Shogun another try (it would require more effort to get me to play Wallenstein again). I recognize the quality of the design, but I personally don't enjoy the way the game proceeds. Your mileage may vary!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacob Lee
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Shogun/Wallenstein differences
Tim,
Thanks for your post and, since I'm currently digging up info comparing Wallenstein and Shogun (I'm a Wallenstein expert), you helped me see some things, but not others. So if have a moment, would you mind telling me what you noticed in the differences between the German and Japan maps?

Basically, from what I've seen, the German map seems more circular in nature, but Japan is lengthier. How does this affect the interaction between different regions? Does combat reside in particular locations or are there "big" battles happening in the central region more frequently?

Thanks again.
Jacob
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Isakson
United States
Richardson
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
You are pretty much correct in your impression of the map differences - Wallenstein was more square (or circular, as you called it), while Shogun is more like a long, thin chain (it being Japan and all, that does make some sense).

It did feel as though the edges were a bit more isolated than they were in Wallenstein - and yes, the central areas, by which I mean both center of the chain AND center relative to width, were definitely the main areas of contention.

Also note - there are two maps, that are apparently quite different from each other. We played the "sun" map, there is another ("moon") map as well - I'm not sure how that would change the play.

Also - another difference, probably added to mitigate the change in geography, there are "naval" routes that allow attacks from provinces that might otherwise be quite distant from one another.

Hope that helps,

Tim
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacob Lee
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Tim,
Thanks, but I still have one lingering question: are there "unreachable" regions in Shogun? In Wallenstein, I would say the perimeter regions seemed quite difficult to breach. Does the elongated Japan map reduce this or is it about the same?

I suspect a lot of people will want to get your thoughts since you've played Shogun and it's not readily available yet.
-Jacob
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonus
Germany
flag msg tools
mb
EmperorJacob wrote:
Tim,
Thanks, but I still have one lingering question: are there "unreachable" regions in Shogun? In Wallenstein, I would say the perimeter regions seemed quite difficult to breach. Does the elongated Japan map reduce this or is it about the same?

I suspect a lot of people will want to get your thoughts since you've played Shogun and it's not readily available yet.
-Jacob
Jacob Lee have you checked out theses images:

http://www.boardgamenews.com/conventionreports/gencon2006/da...
http://www.boardgamenews.com/conventionreports/gencon2006/da...

from

http://www.boardgamenews.com/index.php/boardgamenews/comment...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Isakson
United States
Richardson
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Jonus,

Thanks for the images - hopefully they help.

Jacob,

My last play of Wallenstein was quite some time ago, so I hesitate to get into comparing the map geography in the level of detail I think you're looking for!

That being said - while there are some areas that are tougher to get to then others, in this aspect it didn't feel as though any areas were totally unable to be reached. The naval attack routes - the dotted lines in the images - are there, I suspect, to mitigate this, and without them it could be a problem, but while there were areas that were tough to crack, most of that had to do with play positioning more than the map itself.

Hopefully, that helps clarify things a bit.

Tim
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacob Lee
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Sounds good enough for me. Thanks.

And thanks, Jonus, for those links.

Jacob
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonus
Germany
flag msg tools
mb
Anyways i don't think the map is perfectly fair, but it's good enough. I guess a 100% symmetric map would be boring.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.