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Terra Mystica» Forums » General

Subject: Average Score of new players rss

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Alberto Verduzco
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Hi!, My gf and I started playing this amazing game, finally I can play it! (owning for almost a year but never played in a group).
We've been scoring between 90 and 105, is that a good score for a 2p game?
We've been checking all the recent posts and reading a little stats from Snellman and realizing that most games end with scores above 120 points... is that the usual score?
We play casually, not in a daily basis.


Pardon my english, not my native language.
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Kevin D.
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I play mostly 2 player. Our scores started out around 100 and gradually increased, now a winning score in our 2-p games is usually above 130. We play with the expansion components but no additional end game bonus. We also play with the normal rules, no variants.
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Tables
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I tend to tell new players they've done reasonably if they score at least 80 in their first game, and very well if they break 100 - assuming 4 players. Adjust up/down slightly for less/more players.

Terra Mystica is definitely a game you need to play a few times to get a feeling for how to score well. An intermediate/experienced beginner can probably get over 100 every time and usually get around 110-120, while expert players gun for more like 140. I'm still in that experienced beginner stage, I'd say!
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Rhett Morgan
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I would adjust what Tables says and say that experts will get somewhere around 160 on a regular basis and beginners will range from 60 to 120 with the average around 90. I'm still averaging around 140. Scores in 2 player games may be different but I would expect them to be about the same because less competition over endgame points and cults is balanced by fewer towns.
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Robin Zigmond
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Prodigaldax wrote:
Scores in 2 player games may be different but I would expect them to be about the same because less competition over endgame points and cults is balanced by fewer towns.


I'm not sure what you mean by this Rhett. Admittedly I've played very few 2p games, compared to plenty of 3p and 5p and loads and loads of 4p, but I don't see how there being fewer towns in the game should push scores down. If anything it should push them up as players are more likely to be able to get a town they really want, instead of the third or fourth best option. (Do you mean that there are fewer towns available in total? If this were true it would tend to reduce scores, but this definitely isn't in the rules, although perhaps it's a 2p variant that has been suggested.)

What Tables says is pretty much correct - and as a (very rough) rule of thumb, you should probably expect 10 points more per player under 4. (That is, in a 2p game, a "good beginner" score should be about 120, with 140 for lower intermediates, 160 for experienced players and 170-180 for real experts.)

This is not to criticise the OP. There are plenty of strategy articles on the forums here which can really improve your game. (I myself had been playing for over a year before I could consistently get much past 120, in a 4p game.) I'll refrain from giving any advice, or links, though, in case you would rather discover things for yourself
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Rhett Morgan
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I meant that fewer towns were founded. I can't argue with your logic and looking at the stats now they seem to agree with you so I will relent.
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Merudo
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Akroatis wrote:
Hi!, My gf and I started playing this amazing game, finally I can play it! (owning for almost a year but never played in a group).
We've been scoring between 90 and 105, is that a good score for a 2p game?
We've been checking all the recent posts and reading a little stats from Snellman and realizing that most games end with scores above 120 points... is that the usual score?
We play casually, not in a daily basis.


Pardon my english, not my native language.


I think it's pretty bad.

The average is about 105-115 for 4-5 players game. In 2 player games it is even higher - the average is about 120-130.

If you use "good" 2 player races (Darklings, Swarmlings, Chaos Magicians, etc.) you can easily score 160+.

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Rhett Morgan
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Merudo wrote:

I think it's pretty bad.


Well that is certainly encouraging. Glad you showed up to help the new players out.
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Rafael Ramus
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Akroatis wrote:
We've been scoring between 90 and 105, is that a good score for a 2p game?


I've seen it all. I've had the priviledge of introducing the game to quite a lot of people outside Snellman (and have introduced some to the site as well, even though I'm not a big fun of online play), and I can guarantee you that this scoring of yours is not unheard of.

Here are some of the really basics:

- Make sure you're building next to each other, and take note of the leeching rules. You're playing 2 players, it's easy to avoid picking a faction that will have to dispute the terrain available;

- Don't be too afraid to leech power, and don't be afraid of burning power if needed;

- Try openning with a Temple, and get some Favor that gives you points for scoring (like earth 1, water 1, and air 1). Don't be afraid of not building your SH;

- Check the forum for strategy advice. There is an awesome guide for beginners here, check it out;

And welcome to the community
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Alberto Verduzco
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Thank you all for your comments, hope that we can play more soon to and improve our games.

Quote:
- Make sure you're building next to each other, and take note of the leeching rules. You're playing 2 players, it's easy to avoid picking a faction that will have to dispute the terrain available;

- Don't be too afraid to leech power, and don't be afraid of burning power if needed;


Yep, we've been leeching all the time, the thing is that sometimes we stop leeching because we cannot afford building next to each other... Our first games where with the factions more "attractive" for us not the "recommended" or the "good ones"

Quote:
- Try openning with a Temple, and get some Favor that gives you points for scoring (like earth 1, water 1, and air 1). Don't be afraid of not building your SH;


We didn't build our SH in the first two games, I think... and we didn't picked the "one point" Favor because we thought that the 1w, 1p and 4p where better...

Quote:
- Check the forum for strategy advice. There is an awesome guide for beginners here, check it out;

And welcome to the community


We will and thanks!


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Space Trucker
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About 100 vps in a 2 playergame tells to me that you understand the rules/basics of the game, that you did get some structures on the board and that the game was relativly even. I think that's great for a first game!

There's definitly much room for refinement and improvement - but i think that should be encouraging to try another time!


If you want to speed up learning a bit you could read this great guide here:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1276931/basic-guide-ter...

But on the other hand there is no need to play the game on a competetive level - exploring it on your own (and scoring lower) is equally fine.
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Alberto Verduzco
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SpaceTrucker wrote:
About 100 vps in a 2 playergame tells to me that you understand the rules/basics of the game, that you did get some structures on the board and that the game was relativly even. I think that's great for a first game!

There's definitly much room for refinement and improvement - but i think that should be encouraging to try another time!


If you want to speed up learning a bit you could read this great guide here:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1276931/basic-guide-ter...

But on the other hand there is no need to play the game on a competetive level - exploring it on your own (and scoring lower) is equally fine.


Hi! Thank you for your kind words, I've been playing online against AI and I'm around 120-130 now in 3 p games, with the expansion score bonus... Don't know if thats an improvement or no, but I feel like I'm improving a little...
 
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Rhett Morgan
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Akroatis wrote:
Hi! Thank you for your kind words, I've been playing online against AI and I'm around 120-130 now in 3 p games, with the expansion score bonus... Don't know if thats an improvement or no, but I feel like I'm improving a little...


I don't want to discourage you in any way but the AI is a poor way to test your play skills just due to its incredibly poor skill.
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Alberto Verduzco
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Quote:
I don't want to discourage you in any way but the AI is a poor way to test your play skills just due to its incredibly poor skill.


I know, but I don't want to throw away the game by losing a lot against real opponents because my skill and because I'm becoming familiar with the snellman interface.

I've been playing only with the Nomads and the Riverlings, the two factions I'm more familiar with. I'll try against a human player soon and see what happens.
 
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Space Trucker
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Prodigaldax wrote:
I don't want to discourage you in any way but the AI is a poor way to test your play skills just due to its incredibly poor skill.
I think the AI is decent to quickly try out some things, e.g. some openings, positions or to get an overall feeling about how a special ability (e.g. the alchemist 'VP<->Coin'-conversion) works in a game. Or just practise by doing a quick game in 30 minutes. Points are of course pretty pointless (e.g. most factions will hardly compete for cults so you can easily get 32 points there with little effort). But you can get some experience like where to make engineer's bridges work or how to create a reasonable number of cities...

Besides it actually can be fun (though I prefer the real game with real guys around a big table).
 
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