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While with 2 and 3 players this didn't seem to be an issue, with 4 players it appeared to u yesterday, that maybe the game goes a roudn or two too long and/or ressources are to scarce maybe.

I can see why the goods and workera are limited. Money limited felt a bit strange, but I can see also maybe soem reason for it, to avoid certain strategy is to become too strong no matter what others do, especially the strong locations which give you money for the kontors or your progress e.g.

Yet what happened yesterday felt a bit akward.

By the last but one turn almost everything was sold out
- Money
- all worker-Producing actions except the farmer house (so 6 out of 7)
- Brocate
- all Kontor Places taken

So for the last round there was hardly anything possible left to do except discarding workers, making a farmer or using a few of the extra building.
Could this be intended?

Maybe it would be a good idea to shorten teh game by 1 or 2 roudns for a 4p game?
If shortened by 1 round, simply the first event (which has no effect anyways) coudl be leftout.
edit: better: leave the first pilgrimage event, instead sort out a random tile.


Another detail:
During the payout by the event, the starting player for that round gets the money first, which felt a bit arbitrary. So maybe the first player gets 7 gold for his kontors, all the others get nothing because no money left?
I think it would be much more just, if in case of not enough money left in the bank, the whole payout would be cancelled.
 
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actaion wrote:

So for the last round there was hardly anything possible left to do except discarding workers, making a farmer or using a few of the extra building.


I assume that by "discarding workers", you mean sending character tiles to the beneficial deeds board? That wouldn't have been particularly attractive with coins gone, either.

actaion wrote:

Maybe it would be a good idea to shorten teh game by 1 or 2 roudns for a 4p game?


This was already discussed in this thread:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1287090/rules-change-sug...

actaion wrote:
If shortened by 1 round, simply the first event (which has no effect anyways, coudl be leftout).


I would think that there was a reason that the game designer specified that the first event is always Pilgrimage. Possible reasons I can think of right now are a) that it may be too strong to get a monk in the monastery as early as round 1 and/or b) that it may be too hard to be hit by a Harvest in round 1. I can't really say in how far these are true after only one game of Orléans, but I would assume that there was a reason for adding this extra rule instead of going for the simpler variant to leave it up to chance as in all the other rounds.
 
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you can't build a monk in round 1 anyways (you have no scholar to do that action).

Harvest in first roudn woudl be a bit problematic, as it would more or less force everone to do a farmer action or get the 5 coins penalty. On the other hand a farmer action in Round 1 would mean you could only draw persons in round 2, so alternative moves might be interesting still.
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actaion wrote:
you can't build a monk in round 1 anyways (you have no scholar to do that action).


Oh, right! Good point. Then I am a little lost why the game designer chose the more complicated rule, because if preventing a round 1 Harvest is the only remaining possible reason, as you implied, starting with a Harvest in every sixth game doesn't sound so bad, might even be an interesting change/decision.

Yet another detail of Orléans that feels odd / not particularly thought through to me...
 
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Darador wrote:
[q="actaion"]Then I am a little lost why the game designer chose the more complicated rule, because if preventing a round 1 Harvest is the only remaining possible reason, as you implied, starting with a Harvest in every sixth game doesn't sound so bad, might even be an interesting change/decision.

Yet another detail of Orléans that feels odd / not particularly thought through to me...


Some other event would be rather useless/with no effect in the first round. So all in all, I think this rule, even if not absolutely urgently necessary, is still a good one.
 
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actaion wrote:

Some other event would be rather useless/with no effect in the first round.


Income and Plague would both have an effect in round 1.
The other three would have the same effect as Pilgrimage in round 1: None. So that doesn't seem to be a reason to enforce a Pilgrimage.

actaion wrote:
So all in all, I think this rule, even if not absolutely urgently necessary, is still a good one.


If that is the case and you want to make the game shorter by removing an event card, why do you want to remove the round 1 Pilgrimage you consider to be reasonable instead of a random event or one of the two random Pilgrimages etc.?
 
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Darador wrote:
actaion wrote:

Income and Plague would both have an effect in round 1.
The other three would have the same effect as Pilgrimage in round 1: None.

[q="actaion"]So all in all, I think this rule, even if not absolutely urgently necessary, is still a good one.


If that is the case and you want to make the game shorter by removing an event card, why do you want to remove the round 1 Pilgrimage you consider to be reasonable instead of a random event?


That would be possible, too. In most cases it would be the same anyways and the first solution seemed the simplest one.
But indeed maybe this way is the better way to do it.
 
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Why not start always with Pilgrimage, but randomly discard 2-3 events.

This:

d10-1 Cuts the rounds in the game
d10-2 Also keeps the game fresh because you don't know if there is going to be that third plague next turn or not.
 
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