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Krosmaster: Arena» Forums » Rules

Subject: Timing: Spell effect area + additional movement effects rss

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Frank Otte
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I wonder about the timing of spell effect areas in conjunction with additional movement effects. I know, that (non-damage) additional effects are resolved before the damage - but what happens with the area of effect (no matter, if the spell has extended area or not).

Some examples, to explain, what I mean:

(1) Srammy pushes 2 with his Tricky Blow. Although, the rules are clear in that you attack cells, not objects, it is clear for me here, that the area of damage of this Spell is moved along with the movement of the target. So, if Srammy moves his target from Cell A to Cell C with his tricky blow, the damage is applied on the target on Cell C, and not on the originally targeted (and now empty) Cell A. Same with for example Luk Ylook. This seems obvious, fair enough.

(2) Merkator has a Close Combat spell (Pulverisation) with shovel area effect and retreat 1. Let's assign letters from left to right in a row, Cell A is left from Merkator, on Cell B is Merkator itself, on Cell C is his (primary) target, on Cell D is a Tofu. When Merkator casts this spell, first he is moved from Cell B to Cell A. Now, which Cells are affected by the Damage?
- Cells B and C (only the primary target)?
- Or Cells C and D (the primary target and the Tofu).
I think the latter one is logical, so again, the spell effect area is relative to the primary target, and not relative the casters position after the additional effects.

(3) Merkator attacks Srammy with Pulverisation. Is Srammy protected by his Inivisibility after Merkator retreated one Cell? My assumption: Yes.
(FYI: Invisibility: Srammy doesn't block lines of sight for characters who aren't adjacent to him. What's more, Srammy cannot take damage from character who is not adjacent to him.)

Many examples, only one working assumption: The affected Cells of a spell damage are solely relative to the primary target after its or the casters movement by additional effects. What do you think?
 
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Yury M
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Hi Frank,

(1) Cell C
(2) Cells C and D
(3) Yes, Srammy will be protected

The target(s) of the spell are validated and fixed before casting of spell. Then you should resolve all additional spell effects, powers and damage.

 
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Frank Otte
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Your final paragraph is consistent with your answer to (2), but contradicts your answers for (1) and (3).

Ad (1): The target of a spell is a cell, not an object within the cell. If the target, more precise, the target cell of a spell is indeed fixed before casting of the spell, as you say in your final paragraph, then the answer for (1) must be Cell A, because this is the Cell, which was originally targeted.

Ad (3): If the target of a spell is validated before casting, then Srammy is not protected in case (3), because at the time immediately before casting, Srammy was a valid target, and at this moment, Srammy was not protected by his special power.
 
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Yury M
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Let me say it in different words and a bit more detailed.
First of all you check if you can pay spell's price.
Them you validate the target cell according to LoS and range spell restrictions.
If the target cell(s) is not empty, then you "remember" all masters or summons that are located on the target cell(s), they will be the target of your spell and not their cells.
Then you pay the spell price and even if your master dies, the spell will be proceed anyway (there is only one exception, if after transfering of your GG to the opponent you have 0 GG the game is over).
Then you proceed all secondary spell effects (push, teleport, etc).
And only then you proceed spell damage/heal effect to the initial target cell if it was empty or to the masters/summons that were located in target cell regardless of their current location.
It seems too complicated, but really it is not so complex and in 99% cases are quite simple.

So, what happens in case 1: your spell will hit the master that was on cell A, but now is on cell C.
Whappens in case 3: the Srammy is valid target and the spell will be casted. But when the actual damage to him is calculated (the last step of the whole process) Srammy is already not adjusted to Merkator, so he will not receive any damage.

TDLR: the target of spell is character/mechanism that was located in target spell when you start casting the spell (or the cell itself if it was empty).
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Jan Englund
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yury1975 wrote:

Whappens in case 3: the Srammy is valid target and the spell will be casted. But when the actual damage to him is calculated (the last step of the whole process) Srammy is already not adjusted to Merkator, so he will not receive any damage.


Really? I would like to have an official answer to this.
 
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Yury M
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janenglund wrote:
yury1975 wrote:

Whappens in case 3: the Srammy is valid target and the spell will be casted. But when the actual damage to him is calculated (the last step of the whole process) Srammy is already not adjusted to Merkator, so he will not receive any damage.


Really? I would like to have an official answer to this.


It is according to the Rulebook. You may also check it online.

Malee Buhrum has similar issue during her melee spell, since she will not be adjusted to target anymore when damage is calculated and therefore here Stain power does not nullify target's defensive powers (e.g. armour and resistance).
 
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Jan Englund
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yury1975 wrote:


It is according to the Rulebook. You may also check it online.


Oh, have you checked it online? That I do not have a wrong impression now...
 
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Jan Englund
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yury1975 wrote:

Malee Buhrum has similar issue during her melee spell, since she will not be adjusted to target anymore when damage is calculated and therefore here Stain power does not nullify target's defensive powers (e.g. armour and resistance).


Poor Mahlee... That's strange character design though.

You are right, checked it online.

And in the rulebook:

So spells that push Srammy back, or the attacker reatreats, won't work against Invisibility skill.

As in the rulebook spells work like this:
1. Pay the cost
2. Additional effects
3. Critical hit
4. Armour
5. Place the injury markers

So when the Merkator targets Skrammy with his Pulversation, he can't cause damage to him, because he reatreats in phase 2. and when the injury markers are placed, Merkator in NOT adjacent to Srammy anymore.
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Yury M
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But if you are lucky or strategic you will have a bush, tree or another Krosmaster behind the figure.
 
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