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Subject: Will this game need an umpire? rss

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Anthony Simons
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I have read a few comments which state it is too easy to cheat (accidentally); and I get the impression the game will have moved on before anybody notices. Before I buy I need to know how suitable this will be for our (rather diverse) group.

What's the verdict on this?

Do mistakes (deliberate or otherwise) affect the game much?

Would it play better with some sort of impartial judge or referee watching the proceedings?
 
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Joe Casadonte
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IMHO, mistakes in any game can unbalance the game. The pressure of the clock here makes some mistakes easier to make, but that's just part of the game. Rules mistakes, on the other hand, are certainly easier to make here with everyone watching their own stuff, but the game is very easy to understand, so I don't think the potential is too high.

As for cheaters, that's a once and done thing for me. Don't ever cheat in a game with me -- it will be the last we ever play together.
 
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Anthony Simons
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Joe Casadonte wrote:
As for cheaters, that's a once and done thing for me. Don't ever cheat in a game with me -- it will be the last we ever play together.


The question is, Joe, not so much can one easily discern a cheater from one who makes a genuine mistake; it is whether the answer is yes or no does this necessitate the inclusion of a referee?

How do you know when somebody is cheating at a game in which genuine mistakes are liable to be common? How would you go about penalising these mistakes anyway?

If the rules don't provide a solution then we need something to counter such a situation arising. And while I can trust the players I play with it becomes a bit much for some of us to accept defeat because somebody else made a mistake - it's not cheating so much that concerns me as the waste of a good half-hour when a game is voided by error.
 
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Lance Bailey
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I see almost no need for an umpire after a playing or two. The guy explaining the rules might need to bow out to be an umpire/coach on the first play of any noob, or definately if there are two or more new players.

After a playing or two, though, I think as long as you can trust the other people you will do fine.

Edit: I guess if it were being played competitively you might want a referee, but if you're having problems with someone in a casual setting you should take them aside and let them know they're causing problems.
 
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Will DeMorris
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I could see needing a ref if you were playing in a competitive environment/tourney. In casual play theres no need for an umpire unless he/she is coaching newbies.

If you find that you need a ref anytime you play this for fun with your local group, I'd say you need to find some new friends.

-Will


 
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james napoli
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yea this can be tricky.

i think that after everyone get's a few plays under their belt that 'mistakes' will vanish. the game is not that complicated.

I think that unless your group is ULTRA competitive or like was mentioned prior, you are running a tourney, that there is no need for a ref.

i played this at bgg.con(as i think everyone how attended probably did), and i think we likely made a few minor mistakes...but midway through the game it seemed pretty obvious how the game worked.

hopefully u don't have cheaters in your midst, i dont really understand what the point of cheating would be.
 
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Anthony Simons
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Thank you all for your help; my mind has been put at ease. All I have to do now is get hold of a copy and see how much the group love it/hate it.
 
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Ron K
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'80' maxlength='250'> </td> </tr> <tr> <td width="15%" align="right"><b>Avatar OverText</b></td> <td width="85%"> <input type="text" name="overtext[avatar]" value="Train Game anyone?
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Having played this twice (and not correctly either time although we all played by the same incorrect rules), while a referee would avoid both intentional cheating and unintentional mistakes, it would be blindingly boring to be the referee. If you plan well, you can spend your time planning the next item (having a minute or two to work with) or you can spend it spying on others and auditing/questioning how they got to where they are. I have found in a game like this folks will generally ignore you as it impacts their game play. If you feel the need for a referee, find a different game to play.
 
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Chris Farrell
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RaDiKal wrote:
If you feel the need for a referee, find a different game to play.


For me, this is the bottom line. Space Dealer is just a fun game, and I just don't think it could be played competitively. If nothing else, the variance on the timers seems to limit how seriously you can take it. I like Space Dealer, but if you're too worried about other players' mistakes or concerned that they might be cheating, this just might not be the game for you.
 
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leftfield
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maybe it doesn't need an umpire, but I'm thinking I'll want a guard on duty, or at least a 'Do Not Disturb: Realtime Game in Progress' sign for it! I usually play at a game store that often has 30+ curious gamers attending Thursday game nights.

Q: "ooh, what's this game?"
A: "No offense, but go away until the timer reaches zero."

 
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