Recommend
19 
 Thumb up
 Hide
27 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Alchemists» Forums » General

Subject: App was updated April 10. Make sure everyone has the same version of the app! rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Brian Kabat
United States
Missouri
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I played a game this weekend with a couple of friends. I own the game and had downloaded the app in February. My friend downloaded the app before our game. I shared my phone with the third player while my friend exclusively used his. Everything was going great until the third round when my app results started not matching up with my information board. It first happened when I went to sell a potion and didn't make my guarantee. Then I tried to debunk a theory, and I was wrong. From that point forward, I was so confused as to why all of my information was wrong. I played the game out and was in last place far behind the other two at the end.

We revealed results at the end of the game, and we discovered that the results on our phones did not match up. We double checked to make sure we were using the same code. The codes matched. Then we realized he had v 1.1 and I had v 1.0. We were playing two different games.


The third player, who won with a lot of artifacts, used my phone exclusively and had no trouble. I had purchased the Periscope artifact in the first round, and that is what destroyed me. I had been using that artifact to peek at the ingredient cards of the player with other phone. That information didn't match when I tried to use my phone to make potions with those same ingredients.

It turns out the app was updated on April 10. Be sure to check that every device in your games is using the same app version. The same 4-letter code will give you two different results on each version of the app.
22 
 Thumb up
0.01
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jason Arnold
Canada
London
Ontario
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Good to know.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cameron McKenzie
United States
Atlanta
Georgia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I guess they closed that loophole where you could easily determine part of the solution just by looking at one letter of the code!
At least, I'll assume that is what they did. I'm not going to try cracking the code
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Przemyslaw Kozlowski
Canada
London
Ontario
flag msg tools
We played a game yesterday and we saw the pop up message warning us about this. We run a test where we synced a game and then did a Show Answers to verify that everyone had the same version. Turns out we all had the upgraded version so we had no problems.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jon Ben
Canada
Vancouver
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
MasterDinadan wrote:
I guess they closed that loophole where you could easily determine part of the solution just by looking at one letter of the code!
At least, I'll assume that is what they did. I'm not going to try cracking the code

For everyone's reference this is the relevant article: http://www.dice2cu.com/2015/03/01/alchemists-code.html

I'm happy to say that I checked the results of a game code and by the previous algorithm Fern should have been R- and instead it was B- so that problem seems to have been addressed.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
brianckabat wrote:
It turns out the app was updated on April 10. Be sure to check that every device in your games is using the same app version. The same 4-letter code will give you two different results on each version of the app.

It's supposed to be the case that if you generate the code with the old version and you enter it into the new version you get matching results.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jon Ben
Canada
Vancouver
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DaviddesJ wrote:
It's supposed to be the case that if you generate the code with the old version and you enter it into the new version you get matching results.

What you are saying seems to be in contradiction to what the warning message says, and what the OP experienced. The same 4-letter code will likely give different results in the two versions of the program.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris
United States
Folsom
California
flag msg tools
badge
Someone on the internet is wrong!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
On the 1.1 phone, there is a pop up warning that this can happen. Did the guy with the updated version ignore the warning?
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Amick
United States
Maryland
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
JonBen wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
It's supposed to be the case that if you generate the code with the old version and you enter it into the new version you get matching results.

What you are saying seems to be in contradiction to what the warning message says, and what the OP experienced. The same 4-letter code will likely give different results in the two versions of the program.

The OP did not say where the code was originally generated; I'll bet he did it with the new app.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JonBen wrote:
What you are saying seems to be in contradiction to what the warning message says, and what the OP experienced. The same 4-letter code will likely give different results in the two versions of the program.

The message doesn't contradict what I said. If you generate the code with the new version, and you enter it into the old version, you will get inconsistent reults. If you generate the code with the old version, and you enter it into the new version, you should get consistent results.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jon Ben
Canada
Vancouver
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DaviddesJ wrote:
JonBen wrote:
What you are saying seems to be in contradiction to what the warning message says, and what the OP experienced. The same 4-letter code will likely give different results in the two versions of the program.

The message doesn't contradict what I said. If you generate the code with the new version, and you enter it into the old version, you will get inconsistent reults. If you generate the code with the old version, and you enter it into the new version, you should get consistent results.

If you are correct, I must not understand something.

The 4-letter code is randomly selected by the program, or you can enter it by hand if you wish. If you get the old version to generate it or the new version it makes no difference, the fact that the results will (probably) not match is not affected by where the 4-letter code came from.

Are you saying that the old app uses a subset of the 4^26 codes and the new app uses a different subset?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cameron McKenzie
United States
Atlanta
Georgia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It's plausible that the app 1.0 randomly selects one of the 40,320 game combinations and then spits outs a predetermined code for that game combination (or one of a handful). If this is the case, then 1.0 generated codes make up a small portion of the 456,976 possible codes.

They could have written 1.1 to accept any of those 40,320 codes from 1.0 in the same way, but to generate some of the remaining 416,656 codes as well, and map THOSE codes differently than 1.0 did.

If that's the case, then a code generated by 1.0 could work on 1.1, but not vice versa.
However, I'd be surprised if that were the case.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Sampson
United States
Everett
WA
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I believe David is referring to this:

Quote:
Some of you may wonder, how the app can tell, if the code was generated by the old version or the new one so here is the explanation:

The last letter in all codes generated by the old version of the app after hitting "Start new game" was A, B, C, D or E. The new version of the app always generates codes ending with F-Z. So any codes ending with A-E (and code "DEMO") are still processed by the old algorithm, if entered manually.

However, in previous versions it was possible to enter any code from AAAA-ZZZZ after tapping "Enter Game Code". So if you made up your own code instead of hitting "Start new game" and letting the app generate one for you, you may get different results in the new version.

from: Re: Derive an ingredient from from the App code
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JonBen wrote:
Are you saying that the old app uses a subset of the 4^26 codes and the new app uses a different subset?

Yes, pretty much, although it's 26^4 not 4^26. Maybe this will help:

Re: Derive an ingredient from from the App code
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jon Ben
Canada
Vancouver
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DaviddesJ wrote:
JonBen wrote:
Are you saying that the old app uses a subset of the 4^26 codes and the new app uses a different subset?

Yes, pretty much, although it's 26^4 not 4^26. Maybe this will help:

Re: Derive an ingredient from from the App code

Yes, that is what I was missing. Thanks.

Regarding 4^26: I'm pretty sure it's a 26 letter code using only A, B, C, and D. Not a 4 letter code using the whole alphabet
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gandalf the Grey
United States
Logan
Utah
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JonBen wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
JonBen wrote:
Are you saying that the old app uses a subset of the 4^26 codes and the new app uses a different subset?

Yes, pretty much, although it's 26^4 not 4^26. Maybe this will help:

Re: Derive an ingredient from from the App code

Yes, that is what I was missing. Thanks.

Regarding 4^26: I'm pretty sure it's a 26 letter code using only A, B, C, and D. Not a 4 letter code using the whole alphabet

No there are 40,320 possibilities built into the game.(8!)
And to do this with letters you need 4 alphas with 26 possibilities a piece.

26^1 = 26
26^2 = 676
26^3 = 17,576 (almost there but not quite)
26^4 = 456,976 (with plenty to spare for an expansion!!)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cameron McKenzie
United States
Atlanta
Georgia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
An expansion changing the number or type of alchemicals or ingredients would require a "switch" in the app anyway and could very easily use a different length or character set for codes!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gandalf the Grey
United States
Logan
Utah
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
MasterDinadan wrote:
An expansion changing the number or type of alchemicals or ingredients would require a "switch" in the app anyway and could very easily use a different length or character set for codes!

YES! I agree an expansion is just what this game deserves!laughlaughlaugh but I don't know how they would do it. This game is already a very good and a very solid game.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JonBen wrote:
Regarding 4^26: I'm pretty sure it's a 26 letter code using only A, B, C, and D. Not a 4 letter code using the whole alphabet

Now I'm really not sure what you mean. At first I just thought you made a simple mistake (there are 26^4 4-letter codes, not 4^26). Not I am not sure what you're getting at. If you have used the app, you know that the codes aren't 26 letters long.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jon Ben
Canada
Vancouver
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DaviddesJ wrote:
JonBen wrote:
Regarding 4^26: I'm pretty sure it's a 26 letter code using only A, B, C, and D. Not a 4 letter code using the whole alphabet

Now I'm really not sure what you mean. At first I just thought you made a simple mistake (there are 26^4 4-letter codes, not 4^26). Not I am not sure what you're getting at. If you have used the app, you know that the codes aren't 26 letters long.

The emoticon was supposed to get my sarcasm across. I do in fact know it isn't a 26 letter code, which was pretty clear when I repeatedly mentioned the 4-letter code
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Harris
United States
Virginia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
My game group had this exact same problem on Friday. In a four-player game, two out of the three players with phones had the updated app. We became suspicious when the third player's theory that I'd secretly validated on another player's phone and based the rest of my game on turned out to be wrong. We then compared the same formula on two different phones and came back with different results. Checked the versions and - bingo!

It did not do the game any favors that this was everyone's first play and we'd already put three hours into learning and fumbling through it to find this out on the very last turn.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris
United States
Folsom
California
flag msg tools
badge
Someone on the internet is wrong!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The app warns you of this with a pop up warning when you enter. Did you guys ignore the warning and click it without reading?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Harris
United States
Virginia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
The player who wasn't up to date never got a notification before we started playing. When we realized what happened, he went to the app store to check - at which point he got the notification.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cameron McKenzie
United States
Atlanta
Georgia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The player who didn't update didn't get the notification because the notification was added in the update.
Only the player who generates the code gets the notification, and only if he is up to date (if the player generating the code is not up to date, you won't have the problem)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris
United States
Folsom
California
flag msg tools
badge
Someone on the internet is wrong!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Rigel wrote:
The player who wasn't up to date never got a notification before we started playing. When we realized what happened, he went to the app store to check - at which point he got the notification.


At least one player got the notification and ignored it for you to have run into this problem
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   |