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The Hunters: German U-Boats at War, 1939-43» Forums » General

Subject: Any thought of an expansion? rss

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Dave Young
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Hey Greg,

Has there been any thought on an expansion that would take you out through the end of the war, for those fortunate enough to survive past June 1943?

Also, how's the Pacific version coming along?

Dave Y.
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Ian Cooper
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Until an official one comes along, there's always the expansion I made that includes rules and components for late war campaigns:

Beery's Historical Mega Module

The chart you need to play a late war campaign is Chart 1S - the Start Date chart. It also includes rules for the Type XXI and XXIII U-boats - and the expansion also includes U-boat mats for these submarines.

I'm currently working on adding more U-boat mats to the expansion. I'm considering adding the Type IXC/40 and VIIC/41 in the next couple of days.
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Frank
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From mid-43 on it's no more The Hunters but The Hunted whistle
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Gregory Smith
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Climber Rat wrote:
Hey Greg,

Has there been any thought on an expansion that would take you out through the end of the war, for those fortunate enough to survive past June 1943?

Also, how's the Pacific version coming along?

Dave Y.



Hey Dave,
Well, Beery has done one, as stated...but far as an "official" expansion, yes, I have kicked it around. It's SUCH a different situation I think it would almost need a different game. I have discussed putting together a C3i with Type IIs with John. That's a possibility. That would be an "expansion" of sorts...special patrol assignments for them, etc. But the end war expansion..yikes. Perhaps an expansion IS the right way to go, as it might be too depressing for just somebody to buy as a game. LOL.


As far as Silent Victory (the Pacific game) I am extremely happy with it. Right now, it's basically waiting on the artist to finish a few things. Rules are done, most of the charts are done, most of the counters are done. The role-playing aspect has been ramped up a bit with a multitude of historical awards to be earned. I think people are going to really like it. At least, I hope so. I mean, it's Hunters in the Pacific, but it's more. I think we learned a lot from The Hunters experience and I tried to apply it to Silent Victory. I am still hopeful for a 2015 release. (and while that sounds like "duh" please realize there's at least a 4 month turnaround time from the printers in China. And that's also assuming the dockworkers don't try to extort more money from the West coast harbors, like happened with the Hunters reprint.)

I have also made good progress on the design of the Mediterranean version, which, despite the limitations of the Italian submarines, is more fun that it sounds. Not sure if that counts as an "expansion" in your book. More like a parallel work, I guess.

Anyway, I hope that answers somewhat,

Greg
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Ian Cooper
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Regarding the depressive aspects of a "The Hunted" game, there are a couple of options:

1. Design it as a game in which the player is the commander of a Hunter-Killer squadron. The player's job is to patrol the seas and respond to U-boat attacks, then find and neutralize the U-boat.

2. Design the game from the German perspective again, but have the game feature a robust "What If" campaign, with the Type VIIC/42, Type XXI and Type XXIII U-boats being available at a much earlier stage - say 1944. Call it "The Hunted: Secret Weapons of the U-bootwaffe" . So all a player has to do is survive until 1944 when the new boats are entering the game, then the game reverts to the sort of easier (more survivable) situation that is featured in "The Hunters". I would strongly recommend including variable start dates, limited career lengths and prorated victory conditions based on career length (similar to those I've included in my variant), so that commanders can more easily survive their campaigns.

3. Just do what I've done: make an expansion by just cobbling together a few extra rules and a few U-boat mats. Heck, use some (or all) of the ideas in my unofficial expansion if you want - I don't mind - after all, in my view, the game and everything that comes from it is all your property. I'd just like to buy a shiny boxed expansion that officially extends the game to the war's end.

And it's not about survivability. After all, no one who knows the history and who loves "the Hunters" is expecting to survive a late war career. We just want to see our commanders and crews facing suicidal odds and going down heroically.
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Dave Young
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@Greg:

Thanks for the update! I'm looking forward to pre-ordering my copy of Silent Victory! As I tend to really get into the roll playing (i.e. pick an actual U-Boat skipper, keep a ships log, imagining actual locations - not just "British Isles", but "Off the coast of Edinburgh", using an actual map, etc.), the new game will definitely not be just another The Hunters repackaged. Hell, I still play Silent Hunter 4: Wolves of the Pacific on my PC. I have a fascination with the prospect of submarine warfare in the Pacific. It's definitely got a different feel from that of the U-boats in the Atlantic.

I'm hoping there's another tournament at this year's 2015 ConsimWorld Expo. I'm hoping to do better than I did last year!

@Ian:

I'll take a look at your unofficial expansion. Thanks the putting that together and sharing it with us!

I think that the concept of switching to The Hunters and playing the role of the Escorts and/or aircraft, while interesting, would be a totally different game. And I think that there would be a disconnect. If I were to manage to survive until Jun '43, I would much rather continue to try my luck in the U-Boat that I've come to love, than to switch over to an Escort role.

But making it to Jun '43 (something I have yet to achieve), only to have the game end abruptly, seems like it would leave one without a sense of closure. The war didn't end. The Battle of the Atlantic continued and the U-Boats got their a$$es kicked. I would rather continue on and try my luck until May '45, when the war actually did end. At that point the few Kommandants that survived relinquished their commands and walked away.

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Ian Cooper
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Climber Rat wrote:
...I tend to really get into the roll playing (i.e. pick an actual U-Boat skipper, keep a ships log, imagining actual locations - not just "British Isles", but "Off the coast of Edinburgh", using an actual map, etc.)...


If you're into role playing, I think you'll be happily surprised when you pick up my unofficial expansion, as it has all of these things and more:

Variable start dates and randomized U-boat selection based on the historical ratio of U-boat types available in any given month.

A commander name generator that is based on actual U-boat commander names - not just common German names, nor merely common German names from the period - but common U-boat commander names. It even automatically generates the "von" prefix and hyphenated names so that the names always appear as often as they appeared in reality, and they always look correct.

A U-boat number generator that uses the actual numbers used for whichever U-boat type you choose. Once a number is generated, it is 100% guaranteed to be a number that was assigned to a real U-boat of that type.

A ship target generator that uses almost all of the real ships that were attacked by U-boats during the war - all divided into the months they were attacked historically, so that when you sink a particular ship, you know that it was really sunk close to that date. You can then use http://www.uboat.net/allies/merchants/ to cross-reference the sinkings in the game with the ones that happened in real life to gain more insight into the war at sea, and to find which historical commanders were operating in the area. The way I've designed the expansion's patrol areas means that often the positions of real life sinkings match up very well with the player's map position in the game.

Actual patrol locations that you can cross reference with a Kriegsmarine map (like this one: http://www.xs4all.nl/~anjns/subsim/kmgridlarge.jpg. A random grid location generator gives you a precise location for each patrol, some close to land, but I've designed it so that it can't accidentally generate a patrol on land.

A listing of all the Historical Wolfpacks, with rules that allow the player to join the Wolfpack if he happens to be patrolling in the right area at the right time.

There are also optional rules facilitating entries into a Kriegstagebuch (the U-boat patrol diary), e.g. sailing dates, time of day generator, map grid codes, weather (including wind speed/direction & sea/sky state). There is even a chart showing the historical phases of the moon for any date/time during the war.

I even include randomized histories for the U-boat commander's pre-war and post-war life - all based on an exhaustive listing of all the top-scoring U-boat commanders.

I've also made a U-boat diary for players to record their games, based on the actual diaries the Ubootwaffe used. You can find it here:

https://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/101685/kriegstagebuch
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Russ Bednarek
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Greg,

Good to hear that "Silent Victory" is on schedule.....I'm really looking forward to this one.

I'm very excited to learn of the progress regarding the Mediterranean Theater. Can't wait to jump into an Italian sub.
Regards,
Russ
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Richard A. Edwards
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lemameluk wrote:
an Italian sub.

Now you've gone and made me hungry...
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Dave Young
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@Ian:

Thanks again for taking the time to develop an unofficial expansion! I'll definitely check it out when I have access to faster internet! Really looking forward to it!
 
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