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Subject: Blue Moon City vs Mykerinos rss

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Pedro
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The same old story: a big game order is approaching and I'm having trouble deciding between these 2 games.

They have the same central mechanic (area majority), they are both well regarded here and they are in the same price range (Mykerinos is a little bit cheaper, but not that much). So I need your advice!

Which one do you think is better? I value depth, replayability, strategic and tactical value. I don't particulary value component quality or a short playing time.

Thanks in advance!
 
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For heaven's sake, get Blue Moon City. There is so much more game there. It hits all your criteria.
 
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Seth Bell
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I like both, but Blue Moon City has more options and variability. It's definitely worth the extra money over Mykerinos. However, Mykerinos is worth the money you'd pay for it.
 
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skippen
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I like both games a lot. Mykerinos is one of my favroites. However, I will agree with Mr. Firestone, there is a more long lasting game in Blue Moon City. It is a longer game with more decisions. You can bang out a game of Mykerinos in 15 - 20 minutes. Overall, I say get both. However, if you need to decide between the two of them, go with Blue Moon City.
 
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Peter Marchlewitz
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I agree with all the above. BMC has a race component to it, and you literally move around the board with movement actions, something Mykerinos doesn't have ( it's a placement mechanic )
 
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Jonathan Franklin
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Having played and enjoyed both, my sense is that BMC has that Knizia balance that makes it far more replayable. It already has two mini-expansions, and is more satisfying (although in an absurdly huge box).

With Mykerinos, I still have a niggling feeling that you have to go for Mr. Brown tiles in the first few rounds and put it in the St. Pete class of meaty filler, rather than BMC's full game.

In some ways, Mission: Red Planet is the more chaotic child of this threesome, so for those who think BMC & Mykerinos sound dry, investigate M;RP.
 
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John Gravitt
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Blue Moon City is more fun for two. In Mykerinos you have to use a third colors cube and also play the neutral third player. Both are good games and Blue Moon City is the better of the two.
 
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Clinton McHugh
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Blue Moon City is easily my favorite game in my collection. My wife and I play it at least a couple times a week, and some weeks manage a game every night. It's relatively quick, simple to learn, and has a great deal of depth.

Not to mention, it is always a close game. Even with 4 players, I can't think of a single instance where anyone felt like they were out of the running at the end of the game (and it never involved a come-from-behind victory due to hidden end-game points).
 
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J C Lawrence
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I find Blue Moon City lacking in either tension or interest. The games always end with all players just about to win on their next move. Always. Blech. That's a pretty bad sign for a card-draw driven game. Mykerinos may have some development/balance issues, it really isn't clear yet, but unlike Blue Moon City the decisions tend to be more interesting and less obvious. Neither are great games, but at least there's something worth playing in Mykerinos.
 
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Jeff Michaud
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pitris wrote:
Which one do you think is better? I value depth, replayability, strategic and tactical value. I don't particulary value component quality or a short playing time.

How do you feel about luck? Blue Moon City has a much higher luck factor (card draw) than Mykerinos.

The 1st time I played BMC I was stuck near the last 20% of the game turning my thumbs just drawing cards because of the crap I kept drawing, and came in last place. The 2nd time I played BMC I had lucky card draws and won!

I feel Mykerinos has more strategy, and tactical (in BMC you can only make the tactical plays if you have the cards).
 
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Daniel Kearns
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I have to say, I'm a professional complainer and I don't really understand the luck complaint for BMC. There is so much freedom that I can't imagine what card you wanted but did not get. Also, what does a lucky card draw mean? What would that hand look like? Please explain.

I concede that a player is very much at the mercy of luck if they let their hand size get low in BMC but then that's their fault and not the game's. Try maintaining a larger hand, 4 or 5 cards, and your luck problems should go away.
 
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Mark Bigney
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Important note: If you play BMC expecting an area-majority game, you might be disappointed. I don't feel describing BMC as an area-majority game is apt at all.
 
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Seth Jaffee
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dkearns wrote:
I have to say, I'm a professional complainer and I don't really understand the luck complaint for BMC. There is so much freedom that I can't imagine what card you wanted but did not get. Also, what does a lucky card draw mean? What would that hand look like? Please explain.

If you don't draw the colors you want at the time, then it can be an uphill battle. Do I draw again, looking for the color I need? Do I give up and move to another space (losing tempo and potentially drawing the color I was waiting for - just to prove Murphy's law)?

Quote:
I concede that a player is very much at the mercy of luck if they let their hand size get low in BMC but then that's their fault and not the game's. Try maintaining a larger hand, 4 or 5 cards, and your luck problems should go away.

And how do you maintain a large hand size... unless you're not putting down influence. Are you suggesting that a winning strategy is to not put down influence? Or are you merely suggesting that by not putting down influence, you'll have the cards you need more often (because you won't have already used them)?
 
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Seth Jaffee
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clearclaw wrote:
I find Blue Moon City lacking in either tension or interest. The games always end with all players just about to win on their next move. Always. Blech. That's a pretty bad sign for a card-draw driven game. Mykerinos may have some development/balance issues, it really isn't clear yet, but unlike Blue Moon City the decisions tend to be more interesting and less obvious. Neither are great games, but at least there's something worth playing in Mykerinos.

I agree with clearclaw here. I didn't like that you can't really get ahead (except by another player falling behind on their own accord, I guess).

I don't think Mykerinos has any development issues. I've played it wuite a bit. Some people complain that the brown guy is broken - I don't think so at all. If anything perhaps the Purple lady is broken. frankly I think they're all pretty well balanced, and also frankly they don't really need to be, because anyone can fight for any one of them.

Speaking of fighting, that's another reason I like Mykerinos better than Blue Moon City. The contests are like fights for the tiles. In BMC everyone gets all kinds of stuff, and your only reward for 'winning' a tile is a couple crystals (like less than the reward for simply participating). many Area Control games operate such that a player can do well by getting many 2nd places rather than just a few 1st places... I think BMC tends toward almost punising the 'winner' of each tile, rewarding only a tiny bit more for the additional investment in the tile. In a way that's interesting, but it seems more like a game of chicken - who's going to complete the tile? you do it! No you! Compared to Mykerinos, where you have to decide how much of your resources you're willing to invest in winning a particular fight.
 
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Jens Hoppe
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I say, get both! Both games are among the best I have tried in the last year or so.
 
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Daniel Kearns
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sedjtroll wrote:
And how do you maintain a large hand size... unless you're not putting down influence. Are you suggesting that a winning strategy is to not put down influence? Or are you merely suggesting that by not putting down influence, you'll have the cards you need more often (because you won't have already used them)?

I never really have a problem keeping my hand size up and I still contribute to buildings. In general I:

1) Refrain from making multiple contributions per turn
2) Use special abilities sparingly (use others' dragons)
3) Donate to the tower whenever my hand starts to diminish
4) Do not contribute every turn
5) Refrain from using Khind cards, and discard them if at all possible

As I've never really had the problem I don't know where it might arise. Your hand size will only decrease if you use more than two cards per turn. Do you often find yourself playing more than two cards per turn? If so, make an effort to reduce the number of cards you play. Do you place multiple cubes on the same turn? If so, why? Multiple contributions may appear to save you one turn, but your hand size goes down and you will probably have to pause at least one turn later to make up that deficit. Also, what is the benefit to multiple contributions? The master builder award usually isn't so significant that it is worth reducing your hand for. Do you call dragons often? If so, try and contribute to tiles at which there is already a dragon present. You may not get the master builder but you've gotten someone else to play a card for your benefit. If others are burning through their hand and placing cubes rapidly you may feel like you are falling behind but I believe that the flexibility and strength of the larger hand will pay off in the long run.

The pressure of hand management versus the pressure of keeping up in the race is what makes BMC fun for me. Asking the question, is this move worth the cards I have to invest? Sometimes it is but then you've got to be disciplined and miss some opportunities to get the hand back.

You can think of BMC as an area control game, but it really isn't.
You can think of BMC as a race game, and I think it is.
But you can also think of BMC as an investment game in which you ask the question, how many crystals is a card worth?
 
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John Harley
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I own both games. I would vote Blue Moon City if you had to choose 1.

 
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J C Lawrence
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generalpf wrote:
clearclaw wrote:
I find Blue Moon City lacking in either tension or interest. The games always end with all players just about to win on their next move.

Perhaps those players are evenly matched. When I play Attika with an equally-skilled opponent, the loser is about to win on their next turn. But when I play Attika with an unskilled opponent, I win about three or four turns before they would.


I've found this in games with all newbies, all experienced players, and a mix.
 
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Michael Sim
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While I've experienced these close races as you mentioned, I've also had many cases of one clear winner, and of two players fighting to the finish. So I'm not sure why in your matches end up with all players just about to win on their next move.
 
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Stan Mamula
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I'll be one of the minority and say that Mykerinos is the better game. I like Blue Moon City, but it has few issues that make it less appealing including minor kingmaking. Players can very easily finish a building that will give another player the win.

Mykerinos is much less luck-dependent and offers more tension throughout. The need to balance both the dig sites and the museum make this game much more challenging.
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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sedjtroll wrote:
And how do you maintain a large hand size?


You draw two cards a turn. So to maintain a large hand size, play about two cards per turn. Always (well, almost always) discard two cards and draw four, thus increasing your chances of good cards, and the ability to have turns such as playing a single 3 card, hence increasing your hand size. Each visit to the obelisk gives you a turn with two cards gained, do this when there's nothing better to do. Don't (until later in the game, when running your hand down is a good idea) play lots of cards to put down multiple cubes in a turn. Make the other players do your work for you - for example going where the dragons already are.
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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sedjtroll wrote:
I think BMC tends toward almost punising the 'winner' of each tile, rewarding only a tiny bit more for the additional investment in the tile.


Believe it or not, that's because the game was theme first, mechanics later - cooperation is the point, not just doing it all on your own. And that's how play (early play at least) should be - if three cubes doesn't win much over one cube, play one cube. This also keeps you hand size up, which allows you to "churn" cards for maximum chance to get the cards you want, thus gaining again.
 
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Greg Jones
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sedjtroll wrote:
And how do you maintain a large hand size... unless you're not putting down influence. Are you suggesting that a winning strategy is to not put down influence? Or are you merely suggesting that by not putting down influence, you'll have the cards you need more often (because you won't have already used them)?


You net two cards each turn. If you spend less than two cards, e.g. spending a single 2 or 3 to claim influence, your hand size will increase. If you spend more than two cards in a turn, your hand size will likely decrease. It's possible to spend a lot of cards in a turn, even without doing very much. You might think it's a good idea to call over two dragons. Then you might play a white 1 and two of another color to claim a single 5 spot. That would be an example of a bad way to manage your hand size.

You can also play for the tiles that give you extra cards when they complete.
 
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Kane Klenko
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Blue Moon City: My favorite game.
Mykerinos: A good game.

Winner: Blue Moon City.
 
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