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Legendary: A Marvel Deck Building Game» Forums » General

Subject: Maria Hill's purpose rss

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Lucas Bihary
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I read the thread from a couple years ago discussing Maria Hill and her usefulness/purpose. There were a lot of mixed opinions regarding how worthwhile she is to even have in the game.

A friend of mine, after playing Legendary: Encounters took the ability from the MH analogue in that game and applied it to Marvel Legendary. Have 10 MH, and they let you draw and provide a recruit or something (I've never played Encounters so I don't know the situation). He said it hasn't altered the power level of their games, but at the same time they, (and when he's in town, our group here) play purely cooperatively and with a draft format. I don't like to house rule a lot of stuff because it dilutes the game to me (I think I have like, 2 that i use for flavor and they come up sparingly) and the obvious reason she's there is because of Ascension's Mystic. The difference being she's worth no points.

I said she's there to prevent being totally locked out of options (outside of the crappy 4 ATK 2 recruit hand starting out) and that she's pretty plain because of the competitive element; if she could draw cards AND provide 2 recruit she'd be disgusting. At least Madame Hydra can Dodge OR provide 2 if you discard. My question to you all is now that the game has been expanded upon pretty immensely, what is Maria Hill's purpose in the game?
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The Shader
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I wonder if that was my thread you read.

Madame Hydra and Sarge get used a lot in our groups. Maria Hill is pretty much to keep you locked out. I cannot remember the last time I bought a Maria, but its been over a year.
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Daniel Hogan
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Before Villains, I used to get Maria all the time. Now I get Hydra or a New Recruit if I have extra recruit at the end of the game or get in a jam, largely because they don't take up space in your deck. Hydra can dodge and NR let you draw. Last time I needed Maria at all was when I was severely crippled in recruit because rares came out on the flop and I didn't have recruit heavy heroes.
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Tomer Mlynarsky
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She's not supposed to be used. Her purpose is to allow you to buy something if you need to when you can't do anything in the HQ.


For example, if all the cards in the HQ are 5 or up, the odds of you getting a hand to buy them are slim, therefore, you're allowed to buy something to boost you up a bit.

It's kind of like the Mystic in ascension.
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Darth Ed
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LOL! Brings back old memories... I think this is the very first thread I ever started here on BGG:

S.H.I.E.L.D. Officers (Maria Hill) not being recruited much, if at all
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Bert McCloud
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GrandMasterFox wrote:
She's not supposed to be used. Her purpose is to allow you to buy something if you need to when you can't do anything in the HQ.


For example, if all the cards in the HQ are 5 or up, the odds of you getting a hand to buy them are slim, therefore, you're allowed to buy something to boost you up a bit.

It's kind of like the Mystic in ascension.


It's not necessarily about cost either. Everything in the HQ might cost 3; but if everything has fight and no recruit it's not always a good idea to go for them because each time you add a fight card to the deck you reduce your chance of drawing the recruit cards.

So early on you might want to buy cards that give you recruit so that later on you have enough recruit to buy the worthy fight cards.

I've seen people spend the first few turns buying only the cheap fight cards then getting to turn 4 or 5 and being stuck with low fight cards and a low probability of drawing enough recruit to buy anything else!
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Kim Williams
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In Star Realms there's a Maria Hill equivalent, that I think works much better, the Explorer. Just like Maria it's always available to buy, and it gives you 2 trade (the equivalent of recruit) but you can scrap it (as in it's now out of the game, not back in your discard pile) on a turn to gain 2 fight.

I could imagine playing something similar with Maria - the option to trash her to gain 1 fight - which I think would have me buying her more often, without changing thongs things too much.

Edit: spotted a typo - though I kept it as it amused me.
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Gamer D

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Maria isn't supposed to be as good as normal hero cards, she's just a backup card you can buy to increase your recruitment potential if you are stuck early on with too many expensive heroes in the recruitment area and need a boost to clear them out.
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Ranger Rob
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If you don't mind playing with custom cards I'll humbly suggest...

Makes that Officer deck much more interesting.

AGENTS of SHIELD OFFICER Deck
Modify the SHIELD OFFICER Deck and use the AGENTS OF SHIELD OFFICER deck instead.

To convert the SHIELD OFFICER deck to an AGENTS OF SHIELD OFFICER DECK do the following.
Remove 14 of the Maria Hill cards...the AGENTS OF SHIELD OFFICER DECK only had 16 cards.

From the following link print out 2 copies of the Coulson, Fitzsimmions, May, and Skye cards.
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1100374/agents-shield-shield...
Slide these copies in front of 8 of the Maria Hill cards.

From this link print out 1 copy of the Coulson, Fitzimmions, May and Skye cards.
https://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/98434/custom-fan-made-age...
Slide these copies in front of 4 more of the Maria Hill cards.

The final AGENTS OF SHIELD OFFICER deck should look like this....
4 Maria Hill Cards
2 Grey Phil Coulson Cards (3 Recruit)
1 Tech Agent Coulson Card (7 Recruit)
2 Grey FitzSimmons Cards (3 Recruit)
1 Tech Agents Fitz & Simmons card (3 Recruit)
2 Grey Melinda May Cards (3 Recruit)
1 Covert Agent May Card (5 Recruit)
2 Grey Skye Cards (3 Recruit)
1 Tech Agent Skye Card (2 Recruit)

To use the Agents of SHIELD officers deck, just shuffle these cards together and play with the deck face down.
It costs 3 to recruit the top card of the AGENTS OF SHIELD OFFICER deck. You add the card to your discard pile no matter the printed recruit cost.

OPTIONAL: If you really want to have 30 cards in your SHIELD OFFICER deck you may add in the 14 cards Phil Coulson Hero cards, or the Agent Coulson Hero Cards.
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1251181/taking-im-custom-min...
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/931358/variant-card-son-coul

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Steve Bird
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Ranger Rob, your Geekdo link doesn't seem to be working.

I've recently printed out 3 each of Nacnudllah's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. customs and have begun using them in my games, replacing all of the Maria Hill cards that came with the game. I placed my order with Printer Studio just before he put up the cards for Agents Triplet, Peggy Carter, 33, and Peterson, so I don't have any of those in there (yet). I keep the officer cards face up so I know which agent I'm recruiting. They aren't particularly more powerful, but their extra functionality gives them just enough interest to be recruited a few times in the game. I'm sure that when I get around to playing with Nick Fury and the custom Phil Coulson cards from Taking A.I.M. in combination with these cards, that may shift the balance of power around a bit, but I think it would be an interesting change.
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Ranger Rob
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thanks Steve! I fixed the link.

Hadn't thought about adding Fury...but that works as well! You could actually do that an not even use the custom cards.

Pull out 14 Marias, shuffle in Fury and play face down. That's the fast and easy way to spice that deck up.
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Steve Bird
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I'm sure. Though I was referring to the synergies that you'd get between these cards in the Officer deck, and Fury and Coulson in the Hero Deck. I've already figured out that Agent 13 synergizes quite well with Captain America.
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Michael M.
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Just today I played a "pure" base game, just to try and recapture some of that original feel, and I found myself recruiting a few Maria Hills. I think what makes her less necessary now is that so many of the expansion characters have commons that cost 3 and give 2 recruit points, AND have some other special text along with it. Basically, a lot of heroes now already have a suped up Maria Hill in their sets.
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Ranger Rob
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M_Strauss wrote:
Just today I played a "pure" base game, just to try and recapture some of that original feel, and I found myself recruiting a few Maria Hills. I think what makes her less necessary now is that so many of the expansion characters have commons that cost 3 and give 2 recruit points, AND have some other special text along with it. Basically, a lot of heroes now already have a suped up Maria Hill in their sets.


When designing custom characters I usually have a "Suped up Maria" as one of the commons.
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David A
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Maybe it's just me, but many of those cards in the Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. deck seem quite OP
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Ranger Rob
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Thud105 wrote:
Maybe it's just me, but many of those cards in the Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. deck seem quite OP


No argument.
Chances are if you are printing out the Agents of Shield deck, you are also printing out tougher custom schemes, Villain Groups and Masterminds.
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Richie Tran
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I still Maria Hill serves a purpose. She is a SHIELD hero so if you're running a Fury deck it's useful. She like Madame Hydra without the added benefits, but also without the draw backs.
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The Shader
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SoljaRTT wrote:
I still Maria Hill serves a purpose. She is a SHIELD hero so if you're running a Fury deck it's useful. She like Madame Hydra without the added benefits, but also without the draw backs.


I would counter that you still would never buy her. If you are playing a Fury deck, you are getting her for free from one of Nick's cards.
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Bert McCloud
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therealtheshader wrote:
SoljaRTT wrote:
I still Maria Hill serves a purpose. She is a SHIELD hero so if you're running a Fury deck it's useful. She like Madame Hydra without the added benefits, but also without the draw backs.


I would counter that you still would never buy her. If you are playing a Fury deck, you are getting her for free from one of Nick's cards.


But the point is that you are still using her in your games.
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Erik Hatinen
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Many of my games see Maria Hill never being used, but on occasion she comes in handy. And someone already said it pretty well when pointing out that later expansions have cards that obliterate Maria in terms of power (Hell on Wheels and Yancy Street come into mind).

But the occasional game shows up when you do find a use for recruiting her, and when that happens, you'd be screwed without her or Madam Hydra. More than a few heroes have no cards that produce Recruit, and even if they do, those cards have to show up for you to get them into your deck. Were there no Madame Hydra or Maria Hill cards, it's possible to have to wait for multiple Adversaries to escape or overrun so you can recruit something worthwhile.

The Basic Set didn't need so many Maria Hill cards, but having them was a smart move.
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Davinia
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We don't often use Maria but when we get pulled into the negative zone or fighting the streets of New York she can come in handy.

Hopefully with the next expansion will make more use of her ability or add something to the rule so that she gains a keyword or even add new cards to hers that you can choose from.
 
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Bert McCloud
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32vini2 wrote:
We don't often use Maria but when we get pulled into the negative zone or fighting the streets of New York she can come in handy.

Hopefully with the next expansion will make more use of her ability or add something to the rule so that she gains a keyword or even add new cards to hers that you can choose from.


I just think there needs to another hero that benefits from shield cards and then BOOM she's useful again, that way you can have Nick fury and/or another character in the game and Maria is much more worth while.

The more I think about this the more I realise I haven't used Nick Fury in a really long time. Think I'm going to have to play this weekend and make sure I use him.
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The Shader
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BertMcCloud wrote:


I just think there needs to another hero that benefits from shield cards and then BOOM she's useful again, that way you can have Nick fury and/or another character in the game and Maria is much more worth while.



Someone get me Agent Coulson on the phone...
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Erik Hatinen
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Bert said it well; another hero or two that amps up or benefits from SHIELD cards would be welcome. An official version of Phil Coulson, Hill or that green-haired chick from SWORD (Brand?) would be welcome. Characters from that Agents of SHIELD show would do well, too, but I'd favor ones from the comics more. Ignore that last line if the TV characters come from the comics (haven't seen it so I wouldn't know).

For that matter, I'm glad that Sin/Skadi came out in Fear Itself, but I'd like one or two more villains that do similar things for or with Hydra. A set of cards for Viper would be great, and there are other members of Hydra that could do great things for them (there's at least one Baron not Zemo, Baron Zemo, Armin Zola and Red Skull. There are definitely more).

I wouldn't want Mr. Hydra (probably but not necessarily Red Skull) to be a carbon copy of Fury, but that Battlefield Promotion card is so fantastic I'd be disappointed to not see it or something remarkably like it. The only bad thing about that card is that it sucks if someone else recruits it first.
 
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Tomer Mlynarsky
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Tsallak wrote:
Characters from that Agents of SHIELD show would do well, too, but I'd favor ones from the comics more. Ignore that last line if the TV characters come from the comics (haven't seen it so I wouldn't know).


As far as I know, most of the characters from the show aren't in the comics.

The only exceptions are Mockingbird (Bobby) and Quake (Sky)
And even Sky is quite loosely based

And as it seems, the track that Legendary is going by seems to follow the comics a lot more than the movies\show.

Most obvious example is Xmen First Class.
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