Joseph Langer
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I've only recently really got into boardgames, and while I love Puerto Rico, I really miss playing a game like Risk, where I'm actually conquering my opponents. This isn't to say I want a game that's a dicefest, my group really likes Game of Thrones, with its very limited emphasis on luck. On the other hand, I'm not completely against something that is similar to Puerto Rico, but only if it's deeper. I mean, let's face it, I could get three really good euros for the price of Indonesia. I'm not even completely against a dicefest, if it's a really good one. I guess I just want something different, deeper, and hopefully something with a little imaginary army bloodshed.

Between Revolution: The Dutch Revolt, Antiquity, Indonesia, or Twilight Imperium 3rd edition, or something even better that I haven't thought of, what is the consensus for my next game?
 
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Ray
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How many players do you usually have?
 
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Barak Engel
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I was going to suggest Age of Steam until that last statement in your first paragraph. Indonesia does not have bloodshed either, and nor does Antiquity.

TI3 is misleading - there is very little incentive to actually go to war in the game, except when fighting for the center spot once. Personally I think it'll bore you.

Haven't played Dutch Revolt so I can't say anything about that.

History of the World could be fun for you, as it's both lighter (in spirit) and heavier (in rules) than PR. It has some luck but it's not a dicefest by any means.

I wonder if Struggle of Empires would be your ticket.
 
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Chris Trimmer
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Revolution is the ultimate long-term strategy game. 80% of the game is jockeying for position for your scoring during the last round. The points you score during the final round of the game are the only ones that count at the end.

Highly recommended for those that can withstand the craving for instant gratification.
 
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Mark Bigney
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I'd actually suggest Antike--but of course, I suggest that game to everyone.
It has zero luck and as much bloodshed as you want. Some claim that the game punishes military conquest, but this isn't true in my experience--play aggressively, and the game becomes much more militaristic.
And hey, it's also cheaper.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Not one of the ones you mentioned, but what about War of the Ring? It's a little bit "like risk", but with far deeper strategy and flavor. It has some "dice-fest" like elements, but I don't think they completely dominate the game, as your strategy and positioning is just as important as the actual die rolls.
 
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Buy TI3! It's the best game you'll never* play!


*Not nearly as much as you'd like to play, that's for dang sure!
 
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Phillip Heaton
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I would suggest Viktory II. It is a simple game, and easy to learn. It plays well with 2-6 players, so none of your gaming buddies would fell left out like they would with a 2-player only game (which most wargames are). The first part of the game is exploration and building towns and cities so that you can support the armies you will need to conquer. Once the board has been discovered, the wars break out, with much imaginary bloodshed. It is something of a dicefest, but I've enjoyed playing it. Since the board changes with every game, it has a lot of re-playability.

There is also Nexus Ops, which a number of people have called the next step up from Risk. This is another easy game, and plays 2-4. Again, you get to explore the board, but more to find the mines that produce the resources you need to acquire more units. The heart of the game is the secret objective cards, which tell you how to get the victory points you need to win. You draw one each turn and they drive your strategy. It is currently priced very cheaply, as Hasborg is dumping it.

Twilight Imperium 3rd edition is another fairly simple game, once you've waded through everything (there is a lot of stuff to understand, but the game is very intuitive once you know what is going on). If you enjoyed the old PC games about space exploration and conquest, with a technology tree thrown in, this is as good as it gets in a board game. The downside is that it can take a long time to play, especially for beginners.

I hope this helps.

 
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Joseph Langer
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We usually have 4-5 players. I actually do have War of the Ring, and it is very cool, but it lends itself more to 2 players. I hope I'm not being too confusing, I'm not against a game that doesn't have conquest, as long as it distinguishes itself from Puerto Rico enough in depth and mechanics, it's just I feel that my group would appreciate a little conquest back in their game devil

So Age of Steam may well be an appropriate game for us. I was looking at Antike too, but I thought I read something weird like "the game boils down to whoever has the most temples wins". I'm sure that must be way to simplistic a description. I need to check out History of the World and Struggle of Empires again, I can't remember why I leaned away from them before. As for Victory 2, no one really talks about it, which is weird because it seems to have a lot of enthusiastic reviews. I'm interested.

Finally, between Revolution and Twilight Imperium, I'd say from what I've read here from Chris, I'm leaning more towards Revolution. Has anyone played Splotter Spellen games like Indonesia and Antiquity? The sheer price is interesting, and the suppossed depth I've read about in reviews. Tresham is also a designer that's interested me.

Thanks for the feedback so far! It's definately moving me forward in a decision.
 
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Joseph Langer
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Wisconsin
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Oh, and what about Pax Romana?
 
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Colin Hunter
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pax romana is awesome
 
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William Payne
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ibn_ul_khattab wrote:
pax romana is awesome


Ageed. But if you dont like counter games then you will have to get your own plastic. I did.
 
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Phillip Heaton
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When I take wargames of the table, and consider games of a similar weight to Puerto Rico, I come up with these:

1. Power Grid. My wife and I enjoy this game a lot. Its strategy is somewhat counter-intuitive, in that you don't want to be in first place until you make your move at the end. That being said, it is relatively easy to learn for its weight, and I think you'll enjoy it.

2. Railroad Tycoon. Basically a very similar system to Age of Steam, but much more forgiving of early mistakes. While it isn't my favorite train game, it is well appreciated on BGG.

 
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Blue Jackal
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I love Game of Thrones as well, and I also enjoy Twilight Imperium.

Twilight Imperium is a great game, but it does need a couple house rules, and as another poster said: it's more "cold war" rather than open war. Not that you can't use a few house rules to shake things up a bit (currently we're changing the Imperial Strategy Card to "Imperial Strongholds", the jist is: you get to deploy a stronghold. Every stronghold (of any player's original deployment) you control is worth 1 VP.)

I'd also say TI is somewhat luck based, what with initial planet dealings (which can be modified to a fair extent by intelligent map-building on your part), Secret Objectives and map set-up, action and political cards, and of course: a bit of dice.

It's still a lovely game though, and I enjoy it because there is player interaction (albeit less direct), but we are in the process of adding a few house rules to make conflict more palatable. It's very epic, and it's also a bit more relaxing than Game of Thrones, since it's not all about open conflict.
 
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