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Star Wars Miniatures: Starship Battles» Forums » Rules

Subject: Star Wars Starship Minis more sophisticated rules rss

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Barry Kendall
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Hi folks, I've been reading the comments from buyers who would like a more sophisticated set of rules. I don't own this one but a good friend does. He's telling me that you all should take a look at this site: www.wizards.com and click under "Star Wars Miniatures" then click under any of the previews. You'll find the stats for the simple starship game, but also a detailed listing of the ship stats for the role-playing game. My friend believes these rules might be helpful for those who would like more complexity, because they seem to support both the role-players and the starship gamers with a deeper game.
 
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Ubergeek
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I watched one simple change to improve things at a game at my FLGS the other day. Distance rules were added. For Class 1 and 2 ships, subtract 1 from the die roll for every 4 spaces of distance away from the ship you're firing at. So:

- 1 to 4 spaces = no change to die roll (or no change to hits)
- 5 to 8 spaces away = -1 to die roll (or -1 hit)
- 9 to 12 spaces away = -2 to die roll (or -2 hits)
- 13 or more spaces away = -3 to die roll (or -3 hits)

The game was played on two sets of maps however. It seemed to work pretty good and kept players from keeping their big ships to the rear with no penalty.

Quote:
1.-limited shooting range:
Class 1: 7 squares
class 2: 5 squares
class 3: 3 squares
class 4: as usual.


I've also seen it as restrictive as 4,3,2,1 range which really forces movement and tactics.
 
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Andrew Adey
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Though I have not tested it, I would like to suggest another rule: no Class 1 2 or 3 ship can fire into its rear square(s). This will promote maneuvering, and make the smaller ships more use for "screening" the biggers ones.

Another rule I would suggest but again it needs some testing, is that Class 1, 2, (and maybe 3) block line of fire. Also leading to smaller ships screening the larger. Maybe the line of fire blocking should only apply to opposing ships, so friendly ones CAN fire as they do now.

Just some food for thought.
 
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j javi
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hi,
i have tested some house rules and i think it works ok.
Two main rules:
- limited shoot range for starships.
- other starships block line of fire.

1.-limited shooting range:
Class 1: 7 squares
class 2: 5 squares
class 3: 3 squares
class 4: as usual.

pros: you must move your starships to hit. big starships (class 1)are not so powerful now.

2.-Other starships block line of fire:
fighters dont block line of fire but all other starship does.

examples:
__________xxAxx__________Axxxx
___________xBx____________Bxx
____________x______________x
____________C______________c
C can not shoot A (all of them are class 3).

__________xxxAAxx
___________xxAAx
____________xBx
_____________x
_____________C
C CAN shoot A. ( A is a class 2)


_____________xxBxxxxx
______________xAAAAx
_______________AAAA
________________xx
________________CC
________________CC

C can not shoot B ( C is a class 2 and A is a class 1) i explain this one: class one are so big that they cover 8 squares: the base (4) and 2 for the front and two for the rear. Try it and if you dont like it let me know your ideas.

finally, i think the starfighters are very powerful: you can not shoot him until they can shoot you and they have great weapons (x-wing for example) any idea?

 
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John Goewert
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I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking this game needed a more complex set of rules. I was already working on redoing the game to make it less of just an all out slugfest that it is now.

Playing by WotC's rules, I can't find a wide variance of tactics and strategies. It's almost like this is A&A miniatures Lite.
 
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Joe Reil
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I'm not sure about the RPG rules, and I haven't even played this game with it's standard rules either (I'll be waiting until after the holidays to pick some up)...

BUT rules don't have to be complicated to be good. I think it's probably best to start with a good system and come up with ship stats for that one, rather than try to fix a weak system by shoehorning new rules into it. There are several "generic" rules sets out there that are worth trying out.

I would suggest either Starmada X or Full Thrust (and all the Full Thrust books are now free to download from the mfgs. website!).
 
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Michael Hirsch
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I would enjoy this game a lot more if they would have included a simple scenario book. For example, each side starts with x number of points (or just list the ships if you have a lot of miniatures) and there are only x number of turns until the Death Star destroys Yavin IV. The light player must move fighters to the other side of the board at which point the fighter is considered in the "trench". Roll a die. On a 1, destroy the fighter. On every next turn, roll a die. A 6 destroys the Death Star. If with Luke or Han's ship, destroy on a 4, 5, 6... or something like this.

This is the direction I would have gone with this game... every battle was fought within the context of a mission or a objective. Giving each side a goal with a time limit would be much more interesting. The fun is in reenacting or seeing how a battle might have gone given different circumstances... one step closer to role playing and one step farther from just "tactical" battles.
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Brian Casey
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I dunno, I like the simplicity of the rules as they are. The only rule change I would suggest is that you throw away the grid and measure your distances. This works out fairly easily since each grid space is 2 inches square. You'd be amazed how much more exciting and strategic the game gets at that point.
 
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Brian M
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Mr_Six wrote:
I dunno, I like the simplicity of the rules as they are. The only rule change I would suggest is that you throw away the grid and measure your distances. This works out fairly easily since each grid space is 2 inches square. You'd be amazed how much more exciting and strategic the game gets at that point.


Aside from diagonal travel no longer being an advantage, and making zone of control a royal pain to figure out, I really cannot see where this would add any excitement or strategy at all.
 
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Chris Heffernan
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I like the game as it is. It is simple, but there is still a lot of strategy involved. I do agree that the rule book could have had another scenario or two. The scenario they did include is pretty much just a list of ships to use with no other changes. I'm looking forward to coming up with some scenarios for my group.

I don't like the idea of introducing range. Some people have mentioned they don't like the "infinite range" in the game. But really it's not infinite. The map is a very, very small section of space where the capital ships are really starting extremely close together (if this is pictured as an actual section of space then they are in one very tiny bit of space). If you still feel that the ships are too far apart, you can create a scenario where they begin closer to the middle of the map.

The great thing about it being so simple is that it's easy to create some house rules and scenarios.

Chris
 
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Chris Heffernan
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coffeeandgames wrote:
I would enjoy this game a lot more if they would have included a simple scenario book.

This is the direction I would have gone with this game... every battle was fought within the context of a mission or a objective. Giving each side a goal with a time limit would be much more interesting. The fun is in reenacting or seeing how a battle might have gone given different circumstances... one step closer to role playing and one step farther from just "tactical" battles.


They should definitely have included ideas like these with the starter set. Though I am looking forward to creating scenarios like these on my own.
 
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Joe Reil
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christopher_the_fehn wrote:
I like the game as it is. It is simple,


Something can be simple and deep simultaneously. Neither of the systems I referenced (Full Thrust and Starmada X) are known for being complicated and both of them are deep enough to foster good tactical play and allow for enough options for the user to have a lot of creativity in how the game's are used.

Quote:
I don't like the idea of introducing range. Some people have mentioned they don't like the "infinite range" in the game. But really it's not infinite. The map is a very, very small section of space where the capital ships are really starting extremely close together


This doesn't work well, IMO, ships wouldn't typically just float around until they're in spitting range of each other and then start opening up.

I stand by my recommendation of either of those two systems - Full Thrust in particular as the four books that make up the most current rules are now free for download so there's no reason not to check it out.
 
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Kevin Mosley
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Mr_Six wrote:
I dunno, I like the simplicity of the rules as they are. The only rule change I would suggest is that you throw away the grid and measure your distances. This works out fairly easily since each grid space is 2 inches square. You'd be amazed how much more exciting and strategic the game gets at that point.


I prefer measuring distance as well, but in this particular game, I don't see how that change would even matter.
As the rules are officially written:
1) There is no range limit.
2) Other ships do not block line of sight.

Therefore, you can hit any ship on the board from anywhere on the board.
I may be missing something, but other than the occasional change in facing for the larger ships, I see no reason to even move at all. Ever.

I've only played one game so far, but judging by that game, the rules should basically say:

You roll some d20s.
Your oponent rolls some d20s.
Repeat if necessary.
Whoever rolls better wins.

Oh well, at least the ships are cool
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Chris Heffernan
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Quote:

Therefore, you can hit any ship on the board from anywhere on the board.
I may be missing something, but other than the occasional change in facing for the larger ships, I see no reason to even move at all. Ever.


Class 4 ships cannot be hit from anywhere on the board. Class 4 ships cannot shoot ships unless they are adjacent to them (generally speaking) and they cannot be shot by anything that is not adjacent to them.

In regards to moving, Class 4 ships will move for the reasons above (and some have devastating attacks vs larger ships). Class 3 ships will generally be moved to engage class 4 ships if they have antifighter capability. Class 2 ships can move closer to the middle of the board if they have fighter launch and you want to get your fighters slightly closer to the 'action' when launched. Class 1 ships are the only ships that probably don't move much except to change facing.

And my group is coming up with numerous scenarios that require you to move class 1 ships.

Quote:

I've only played one game so far, but judging by that game, the rules should basically say:

You roll some d20s.
Your oponent rolls some d20s.
Repeat if necessary.
Whoever rolls better wins.


In the end, can't any game that uses dice be simplified down to this?

By reading the boards here and at wizards, I see many people dislike the simplicity of the rules for this game. I like the rules. There could definitely be some tweaks, however. Like I think there should have been 5 classes of ships instead of 4. The Falcon should not be the same class as a Rebel Cruiser for example, but should be a class above fighter (basically a tougher fighter that can fire at targets 2 squares away, but cannot be targeted by anything more than 2 squares away). But overall, we like the rules. We've played 300-point, 400-point, and 600-point battles and are now creating some scenarios (which I will post here and at wizards when we test them out).

Chris
 
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Kenneth Bailey
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I like this game although I think the range rules would help a bit as the game is mostly a slug fest between the capital ships. The fact that fighters can't be hit at range helps though as it forces some maneuver for the fighters.
 
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Rob Urzi
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One new concept is that in the movement phase, ships will move accordingly in segments by class size, alternating between both players, to allow for a more realistic simultaneous movement effect. For those of you who have played Starfleet Battles, this is exactly like a 4 movement impulse chart. Here it is written out (its much easier to understand in a chart form, but I'll try to explainit...)

Once= one square
Player A is the one who lost initiative

Start of Movemnet Phase
Class 4 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 2 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 3 may move once (Player A then player B)
Class 4 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 3 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 4 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 1 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 2 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 3 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Class 4 may move once (Player A then Player B)
Player A and B launch fighters
End of Movement Phase

What do you all think about this??? Good or bad??
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Jonathan Axelsson
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Sorry to bring up an old thread, but I got this game this x-mas, and I like it.
I think an easy way to make ships move more is to add one simple rule of line of sight blocking;

Class 1&2 blocks all LOS, class 3 blocks 3+4 LOS.

I think that would make it more improtant of how you move your fleet to block your ships and at the same time tries to get LOS to the enemies ship.
Kind of making it to a game manouvering.

Cheers!
 
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