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Subject: Average number of turns in Splendor? rss

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Quinn Swanger
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Disclaimer:
I've previously posted a similarly worded question to the Tash-Kalar general forum. I'm posting that question again here because I'm starting to get into Splendor and have the same curiosity. ...


Board games are usually published containing three pieces of descriptive information in icon form on the side of their box: 1) The recommended Age range, 2) The number of Players it accommodates, and 3) The average Time it takes to complete.

While #3 can often vary widely, especially when you're first learning a game or when you have extreme AP prone or lightening fast players, it does seem that most of the time the printed Time eventually becomes correct. However, for reasons that are far too complicated to go into, I am more interested in knowing what the average number of *turns* is likely to be for a game. I differentiate turns from plies in that plies are "I go, you go, and then I go again" are 3-plies (I think most people know this already), and turns are the number of rounds where each person gets a chance to do something, which can be fractional in many games.

So, I'm interested in knowing what the turn count is in Splendor. I'm thinking it will probably be similar for 2, 3 and 4-player games. Does anyone know? Thanks!
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    Three too many.

    I've never heard of a plie. Couldn't find a definition for it. Is this a gaming term?

             S.

 
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A J
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I'm only aware of plie being a ballet term. I've always used the highly technical "round" and "turn" terms myself.

I'm not sure how many moves an individual player gets a game. Will have to count next time.
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Tony C
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Does a round contain a turn, or vice versa? I may be misunderstanding you.

To me a "turn" is one player's or entity's set of actions, and a "round" is when each player or entity has taken a turn. (Very simplified of course, there are co-op games where the baddies take a 'turn' after each player turn, so there a 'round' ends once all players have taken their turns and any associated baddies have too.)

A 'plie' is player A, then player B, then player A again? I am also unfamiliar with that term, at least in this context (to be honest, I also am unfamiliar with it in a dancing context, but I have at least heard of it.)

That said, I prefer 2-ply, I really can't even imagine 3-ply.
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Quinn Swanger
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Sagrilarus wrote:
I've never heard of a plie. Couldn't find a definition for it. Is this a gaming term?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ply_(game_theory)
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qswanger wrote:

So, I'm interested in knowing what the turn count is in Splendor. I'm thinking it will probably be similar for 2, 3 and 4-player games. Does anyone know? Thanks!


I don't generally count but the "Spendee" Web/Android/IOS implementation does and though it varies a bit with number of players and play style it is almost always in the range 26-30 (biased towards the lower end of that range)
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Quinn Swanger
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Oh, cool! That is very helpful information! I had no idea that app (Spendee) existed!
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A J
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Interesting terminology. Learned something new.

dtcarson wrote:
Does a round contain a turn, or vice versa? I may be misunderstanding you.

To me a "turn" is one player's or entity's set of actions, and a "round" is when each player or entity has taken a turn. (Very simplified of course, there are co-op games where the baddies take a 'turn' after each player turn, so there a 'round' ends once all players have taken their turns and any associated baddies have too.)

A 'plie' is player A, then player B, then player A again? I am also unfamiliar with that term, at least in this context (to be honest, I also am unfamiliar with it in a dancing context, but I have at least heard of it.)

That said, I prefer 2-ply, I really can't even imagine 3-ply.


I was referring to one round being each player having taken one turn each. Same as Quinn saying one turn as each player having one ply each.

I like 3-ply...never skimp!
 
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Terra Nystrom
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We seem to run in the 20-35 turn range. The more we pay attention, the closer we get down toward 20 turns, but if we're playing more for fun/relaxation (rather than seriously to win), we tend to be up in the 30-35 turn zone.

Context: We mostly play 2-player with only a few instances of 3- and 4- player mixed in, so that might impact the number of turns. We've also only been playing for a few weeks now, so more expert players might take fewer turns than we do.
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Tomasz Zielinski
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Here you can find statistics from Prestige, Android lookalike of Splendor (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.pgssoft.pr...)

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Bryan Thunkd
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tomekziel wrote:
Here you can find statistics from Prestige, Android lookalike of Splendor (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.pgssoft.pr...)

Interesting that with more players (or bots) that the game length tends to be shorter. I guess more cards clear out before it gets back to you so you're more likely to see cards you want/can build in the churn?
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Michael Marvosh
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There's an achievement in the app that wants you to win a 2 player game in 23 turns or less. It seems monstrously difficult.
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Joe Wasserman
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I don't think he would like that.
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I just wanted to jump into this old thread to thank OP for posing this question, as well as everyone who answered it!

I'm going to be using Splendor as the stimulus in a research project, and it's crucial that all participants play the same number of rounds. So for the purpose of this study, I will be modifying it to end at 20 turns, before anybody would be likely to achieve the usual game end condition.

Thunkd wrote:
...Interesting that with more players (or bots) that the game length tends to be shorter. I guess more cards clear out before it gets back to you so you're more likely to see cards you want/can build in the churn?

I found that really interesting, too! I suspect that's part of it. I suspect another part of it is that with more players, it's more likely that one of the player's "route" through the cards in the game comes works out better/faster. Another way to think about it: given whatever distribution of number of turns until victory (it looks normal-ish), the more players you have, if you randomly sample that distribution, the larger the sample, the more likely it is that you'll get a lower-than-average value (as well as higher-than-average, but because the game ends at the lowest, only the low values are seen).
 
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Bryan Thunkd
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Mymil wrote:
So for the purpose of this study, I will be modifying it to end at 20 turns, before anybody would be likely to achieve the usual game end condition.
Will the players know that the game will end at turn 20? Because if they do, it would change how they play the game. Long term investments won't be as attractive as they would in a longer game, etc. I don't know if that's important in what you're looking at or not.
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Splendor as a stimulus? Isn't that an oxymoron?
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Joe Wasserman
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I don't think he would like that.
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Thunkd wrote:
Mymil wrote:
So for the purpose of this study, I will be modifying it to end at 20 turns, before anybody would be likely to achieve the usual game end condition.
Will the players know that the game will end at turn 20? Because if they do, it would change how they play the game. Long term investments won't be as attractive as they would in a longer game, etc. I don't know if that's important in what you're looking at or not.

Yes, they will definitely be told, so they can do precisely that kind of planning. They almost certainly won't have played Splendor before, so they won't have had a point of comparison.

Sagrilarus wrote:
Splendor as a stimulus? Isn't that an oxymoron?

Sometimes experimental stimuli are intended to induce states of boredom. (Although in this case, with board gaming novices, there will probably be enough novelty and challenge to avoid that.)
 
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