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Fury of Dracula (second edition)» Forums » Rules

Subject: Unearthly Swiftness - Maturing two encounters? rss

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Kurt Rompot
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We had a situation in our last game where Dracula played Unearthly Swiftness which gives him two normal moves. The two right most location cards in his trail dropped off. Both encounter tokens were New Vampires. We weren't sure whether Dracula should be allowed to mature both tokens or just one.

The errata states, "Whenever an encounter drops off Dracula’s Trail, the Dracula player may mature the encounter – even if
Dracula is at sea, and even if Dracula is forced to move because of a card such as Stormy Seas."

Any opinions? I was Dracula and only matured one of the New Vampires to be nice.
 
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Barry Figgins
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Hmm, interesting find. By the rules, both locations are moved off, so both encounters can mature. But by the spirit of the rules, this is a definite no-go. I'd go with the spirit of the rules, especially since Unearthly Swiftness is the only way this situation could come up. Dracula can only mature one encounter per turn. Feel free to slap the other one down in your Catacombs, though!
 
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Andrew W.
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In the process of maturing the first encounter, your trail is reduced to a certain number of locations, 1 or 3 depending on which encounter matured.

So the second location would be then played thereafter, but the encounter you believed would be in line to mature next would no longer be present, as it is removed from your trail and the game.
 
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Kurt Rompot
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Redbeardin84 wrote:
In the process of maturing the first encounter, your trail is reduced to a certain number of locations, 1 or 3 depending on which encounter matured.

So the second location would be then played thereafter, but the encounter you believed would be in line to mature next would no longer be present, as it is removed from your trail and the game.


Well, I disagree with this logic argument. Encounters drop off the trail during the movement phase and are not matured until the action phase. I think this is a special situation where two encounter markers drop off during movement (since Dracula is making two movements in a row before performing his action phase). There probably just needs to be an errata stating only one encounter can be matured in the action phase.

Cards like "Stormy Seas" present a problem as well as it causes an encounter token to be matured out of turn sequence. But that situation was already addressed in errata.
 
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Andrew W.
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Now that I read the dynamics of Dracula's turn when applying Unearthly swiftness, it does show that the two movements do occur before the maturing happens in the action phase.

However, you still have to resolve matured encounters from oldest first. So the first new vampire matured still reduces the trail down to one card (other encounters reduce the trail to one card or three, depending on the encounter). in this circumstance, The location and encounter you believe would mature next, as well as the other 5 locations and encounters in the trail that are due to be removed to leave the necessary one location remaining, are returned to the encounter pool. The second encounter has not matured yet. It has only fallen off the end of the trail.

 
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Andrew W.
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Also, if sending one of the encounters and location to the catacombs, for similar reasons you would have to send the first encounter that falls of the trail instead of maturing it. If you mature the first encounter, nothing will remain waiting to be sent to the catacombs -- it has been returned to the encounter pool by that point.
 
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Ken B.
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ejamer wrote:
krompot wrote:
There probably just needs to be an errata stating only one encounter can be matured in the action phase.


I agree with your ruling that only one encounter can be matured.

That said, this is just another example of why I much prefer the original game. There are simply too many exceptions, special rulings, and confusing/contradictory possibilities in the reprint!



??


Hey hey, in this version you can actually *FIND* Dracula, so that's a plus.

laugh


Personally, I'm thinking there's only one spot on the board for a matured encounter for a reason.
 
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Matt Albritton
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Andrew is correct. How can you mature two new Vamps in one turn when the first one immediately clears your trail down to one card?

It's not a good idea to stack your new Vamps close together because of this.
 
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Andrew W.
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Kubigaruma wrote:
Andrew is correct.


Try not to sound so surprised when you say that...

I have better daily frequency for correctness than a broken clock...

...at least on the average... anyways...

Thanks for the vote of confidence. I was beginning to wonder if maybe I was imagining the rules for clearing the trail down.
 
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Eric Engstrom
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I believe that this is the only time when two encounters may be matured. Dracula has it hard enough, and this gives him some help.
 
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Andrew W.
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I refute your assesment Eric, but I'm game -- convince me. How does the second vampire, which would be a the far end of the trail, survive the trail clearing down to Dracula's current location from the first matured vampire?
 
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Bob McMurray
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It comes down to the definition of "trail".

Based on the language I've seen , the locations and encounters in question, the 2 Vampires, have fallen off the trail. As a result, since their locations are no longer on the trail, they fall outside the scope of the reduction in trail length which accompanies matured encounters.

So, my current interpretation would be that both vampires would indeed mature - with 4 points going to Dracula. The first matured vampire would reduce the (location) trail down to one and the second matured vampire would maintain the length of the trail at one.

I find this to be an interesting and aggressive offensive use of the UnEarthly Swiftness card which is usually a defensive manuever. I can envision situations with Dracula where you might be able to attempt this gambit on purpose.
 
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Enon Sci
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Islay wrote:
It comes down to the definition of "trail".

Based on the language I've seen , the locations and encounters in question, the 2 Vampires, have fallen off the trail. As a result, since their locations are no longer on the trail, they fall outside the scope of the reduction in trail length which accompanies matured encounters.


I agree. If the rules stipulated that the clearing of the trail occurred immediately after an encounter moved past the 6th space, then Andrew would have a point. However, the maturing occurs in the Action Phase, so the trail in question is the trail as it appears during the action phase and not a historical representation of the trail.

As Islay implies, the Dracula player wouldn't encounter this opportunity often, and it's risky to execute even if the player could. Fair play to probabilistically low situations that benefit the underdog player, I say. Those hunters should have found those encounters and eliminated them before they got off the track.

ejamer wrote:

That said, this is just another example of why I much prefer the original game. There are simply too many exceptions, special rulings, and confusing/contradictory possibilities in the reprint!


??? You like the original because it has less possibilities? Ehh.. ok.



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Daniel Edwards
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I agree with the people who think that (technically) you can mature 2 vampires with unearthly swiftness.

In order for an encounter to mature in the first place it has to have fallen off the trail.

Both encounters would fall of the trail during the movement phase.

Both encounters would be eligible for maturing in the action phase.

There is nothing express in the rules which prohibits drac from maturing more than one encounter in an action phase. If I remember the properly the terminology is fairly open ended ie "any encounter". You can imply it if you like as a house rule but I think thats the only way you can interpret the rules as written.

And to the people who think thats unfair not only is it extremely hard to pull off but similar principles apply the other way around as well. Say drac's last location in his trail has a vampire on it that the hunters can't get to. If a hunter forces a battle against drac at night and forced him to retreat then that location without the vampire would be knocked off the trail without drac able to mature the vampire.

So IMO clever plays within the rules should be rewarded not banned.

Lastly, the great majority of the erata issues come from confusing language in the rules or the cards. While the design has some flaws (mostly a strong bias to the hunters when the players are experienced) the design stacks up to fairly weird scenarios pretty well in my view.
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Pieter
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Having played FoD only once, I don't know if you take my opinion that seriously, but I think it comes down to the definition of a "move". Unearthly Swiftness says that Dracula gets to play two consecutive normal moves. IMHO a move consists of a movement phase and an action phase. So, the first movement drops the rightmost new vampire off the trail. Then follows an action phase, in which Dracula places a new chip on the first card played, and can decide to mature the new vampire. If he decides to do so, the trail is reduced to one card, and the second new vampire is removed with it. So only one of them can mature.

Note that if Unearthly Swiftness would state that Dracula gets to play two normal movements, Dracula would only get to place one encounter chip, namely on the second movement card placed. He also would not have to do combat with any Hunter on the first city he visits, because that happens in the action phase.
 
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David Klempa
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Flyboy Connor wrote:
Unearthly Swiftness says that Dracula gets to play two consecutive normal moves. IMHO a move consists of a movement phase and an action phase. So, the first movement drops the rightmost new vampire off the trail. Then follows an action phase, in which Dracula places a new chip on the first card played, and can decide to mature the new vampire. If he decides to do so, the trail is reduced to one card, and the second new vampire is removed with it. So only one of them can mature.
Note that if Unearthly Swiftness would state that Dracula gets to play two normal movements, Dracula would only get to place one encounter chip, namely on the second movement card placed. He also would not have to do combat with any Hunter on the first city he visits, because that happens in the action phase.


I'll have to disagree.
Page 7 of the rules states that Dracula's Turn consists of a Timekeeping Phase, a Movement Phase, and an Action Phase. Therefore, if Unearthly Swiftness gives him two moves, that is what it means.
Two moves: placing two location cards, resulting in two end of trail locations sliding off.
This would then be followed by the Action Phase, in which an Encounter would be placed on the current location (only), the 'dropped' encounters would be matured and the dropped locations would be returned to the deck. (The dropped locations/encounter could also be placed in the Catacombs.)
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Jag
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Movement Phase: 2 locations fall off (both containing new Vampire encounters).

Action Phase: 1 New Vampire is matured (or sent to the catacombs). You can only mature/catacomb once per action phase, so the other New Vampire is returned to the encounter draw pile.
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