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Epic Card Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Targeting: can you target a card in a discard pile? rss

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Will H
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Frederick
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I can't recall the name, but there's a card that returns target champion to its owner's hand -- could you target a champion in your discard and return it to your hand? I feel pretty sure the answer is "no," but I couldn't find anything in the rulebook to rule out that interpretation, so I let my girlfriend do it in a game tonight :-P

Does anyone know if that's a valid use of this card, or was my instinct correct and the card text needs to be clarified?

Thanks!
 
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Todd Holland
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No you can only target cards in play with the exception of recycle ability.
 
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Will H
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Frederick
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OK, I agree from prior MtG experience that that's likely what is intended, but do the rules actually state that anywhere or are you assuming? This is the only ambiguity I've encountered that doesn't seem to actually be clearly stated somewhere in the rules. Hopefully it will be clarified in the final version of the rules.
 
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Paul Newsham
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It definitely seems like something that's missing.

"A champion must be in play to be a valid target", would suffice.

If you look at the section for Untargetable, you can sort of infer the rule for that, but the glossary could definitely use an entry for Target.
 
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Todd Holland
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I think it would,be implied that cards in the discard pile are not in play therefore not on the table therefore can not be the target of said card. If they could be then that would break many card combos.
 
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Will H
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Frederick
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Well, it's not as if cards in the Discard piles are totally off-limits from being affected by any card -- it's just that the ones that do affect Discarded cards explicitly say so.

As this card is currently written, it's not unreasonable to interpret it as being able to target Champions in the Discard piles, because there's nothing that explicitly says you can't. You believe it 'implies' this, but it really doesn't -- you're just implying it from experience with prior games.
 
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Nathan Davis
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You can assume "in play" is after "target champion" on every card that says it. You can only target things in play unless it specifically says otherwise. (There are a few cards that target "cards" or "champion cards" in the discard pile, for instance.)

We specifically worded Untargetable to only work in play because targeting only works in play (unless something goes out of its way to say otherwise).

- Nathan
Editor at White Wizard Games
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Will H
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Frederick
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NathanWWG wrote:
You can only target things in play unless it specifically says otherwise.


Respectfully, the rules really need to state this directly, otherwise people who have not played CCGs are likely to miconstrue how the card can be played (as my girlfriend did). Since I could not point to anything in the rules that explicitly stated this, I could not really argue against her.

The definition for the keyword "Untargetable" doesn't help to clarify -- "While the champion is in play, it may not be the "target" of an event, power, or ability." If one interprets the text of the cards literally (as one should be able to do in any game with unambiguous rules), the card we've been talking about could still be used to target a champion in a discard pile, even if it's untargetable, because it's not "in play." No where in the rules does it say, explicitly or implicitly, that it is illegal to target champions NOT in play.

Again, WE all know this, but someone new to this style of game would have know prior experience or knowledge to draw from to correctly interpret the meaning and use.
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Nathan Davis
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We only had 24 pages, and believe me, there are many more things I wish we included. We couldn't put in everything.

That said, we are working on an expanded how-to-play guide and other tools for the game's official roll out this September. I will make sure we have some explicit examples about how targeting works.
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Will H
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Frederick
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All you'd have to do is add in the appropriate place "you may only target Champions that are in play, unless otherwise stated," but I do appreciate that space is limited.

And I think an expanded how-to-play guide with examples is exactly what the game needs for new players, so that's great to hear.
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