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Subject: Difference between Barbarossa and El Alamein rss

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John Choong
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Can somebody tell me the difference between Barbarossa and El Alamein other than the different historical setting? I've read some where that El Alamein play longer than Barbarossa. How is this so?

Is there any difference in terms of mechanics? Has anything added in the El Alamein gameplay?

 
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Jeffry Welfare
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brighknight_216 wrote:
Can somebody tell me the difference between Barbarossa and El Alamein other than the different historical setting? I've read some where that El Alamein play longer than Barbarossa. How is this so?

Is there any difference in terms of mechanics? Has anything added in the El Alamein gameplay?



There are a few differences. Big one is the enemy in El Alamein are not passive. They can, and will counterattack destroying units and possibly recapturing cities. Meaning you have to retake them.
Not to mention that unlike Barbarossa where with the exception of Moscow being the bottom card in the city deck being certain while the rest are in a random order on that, in El Alamein the cities are faced in a specific order.
Hey even one of the army decks get stacked in a specific order.

Oh, and those lovely supply cards in Barbarossa that are plentiful. In El Alamein some disappear right at the beginning. No cheap way to get supply points in El Alamein.

Plus of course, unlike Barbarossa where how many VPs you get for taking sites is fixed, in El Alamein you have VP cards of various values, and effects. Taking sites gets you a different number of VP cards.

That's just a quick rundown of the big differences from the top of my head. The games are similar, but El Alamein is a lot more than Barbarossa with a different setting.
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O B
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I've also found for variety you can run some Barbarossa cards in Alamein and vice versa.

...

Yes. It is entirely possible we've played too much of both games...
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Nicholas P.
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El Alamein feels a lot tighter to me. Barbarossa can drag at times. You don't spend quite as much time having to build an engine and the runaway leader issue in Barbarossa is better balanced out by El Alamein's higher number of casualties. It takes more turns to build up your army again after a major attack. In Barbarossa you basically lose a tank and are just attacking again every time your tank hits the field.
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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adorablerocket wrote:
Yes. It is entirely possible we've played too much of both games...


So with that many plays of each if you could only keep one which would it be? Same answer if you could only recommend one?
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Tommy Larsson
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I would recommend El Alamein over Barbarrosa for the reasons stated by Nicholas Pham earlier in the thread.
 
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O B
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Eh... that's a tough one. I find I often forget the more complicated rules in El Alamein (we play it maybe once every two months) and have to refresh my memory when it comes time to take cities. Not sure I agree it's tighter as a game, it's different in pace that's for sure, but I like both.

Why would you pick either?
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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adorablerocket wrote:
Eh... that's a tough one. I find I often forget the more complicated rules in El Alamein (we play it maybe once every two months) and have to refresh my memory when it comes time to take cities. Not sure I agree it's tighter as a game, it's different in pace that's for sure, but I like both.

Why would you pick either?


Have always been interested in getting one of the two and now with the Alamein KS I've got a choice of either in English.

Can you expand on the pacing differences, especially when it comes to new players at the table. As part of a large local gaming group 95% of games involve at least one, if not more, new players being taught the rules at any given sitting.
 
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Ok, this may not be obvious, but I don't think either Barbarossa or El Alamein are well suited for pick up play in casual groups.

The artwork and theme are 'problematic' at best, requiring a very niche set of interests and even then usually only made tolerable by a nuanced understanding of the context the game was originally made in.

At worst it's a horrifically offensive trivialization / glorification of Hitler's brutal genocidal war, combined with objectifying and pandering pinup art of women, topped off with a dash of genuine squick when the anime art not only appears underaged to western eyes, but specific characters are obviously intentionally skirting the edge of 'lolita' appeal.

I mean I guess we can all be grateful there's no black people, muslims, or disabled people in the game, but really it's like it's going for "incredibly offensive bingo".

Don't say you weren't warned that you may be forever branded as "that incredibly creepy guy/gal" in your game group!

That said, Barbarossa is simpler, and easier to explain to new players. Also for new players the domino effect matters less (IMHO building an complex war engine is a tempting red herring).

Finally, Barbarossa includes the SS Panzer Regiment, which is the cutest card in either game (and one of the most fun to play effectively) ... and I am *so* going to hell for thinking that.
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-=::) Dante (::=-
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Theme/art is a complete non-issue here. Anyone remotely PC or easily offended wouldn't last long in in this group I can assure you. devil

Not sure if it would change your recommendation at all, but I should clarify that this is most definitely a group of very heavy gamers that are not daunted at all by complexity. While we enjoy plenty of lighter fare too, most in this group play games in the 18xx, Splotter, Vital Lacerda weight class. That said if El Alamein is a game that is only going to be appreciated after the 2nd or 3rd play then Barbarossa may be a better fit regardless.

The only reason someone new is almost always at the table is simply because our group is so large and there's so much game churn. Only a handful of titles ever hit the table weeks in a row.
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