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Subject: Forbidden Stars vs Eclipse rss

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Colin Nordstrom
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I own and enjoy Eclipse. Is it worth getting FS? How similar are they? Are they similar in playtimes? How fiddly is FS?

Thanks for the input.
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Tomas Daniel
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evidence wrote:
I own and enjoy Eclipse. Is it worth getting FS? How similar are they? Are they similar in playtimes? How fiddly is FS?

Thanks for the input.


its totally different board game
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Alexander
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those are very different games.

- eclipse is more about expanding, researching, upgrading and resource management, whereas FS is all about combat, building your army and crushing your opponents.

- combat is very different in both games, too. FS is much more engaging imo and allows for tactical play during combat. in contrast to that once in combat in eclipse there is nothing you can do except rolling the dice, which is not tactical at all obviously.

- eclipse is extremely random (system tiles, research tiles, discovery tiles, etc.). FS is not random at all. the only random aspect in FS is rolling dice at the start of combat, but in contrast to eclipse ALL dice results are useful in FS.

- FS is more thematic than eclipse.

- there are no ground units in eclipse. hence there are no ground combats either.

overall if you like a combat heavy game, FS might be for you. but I would not really compare FS to eclipse at all. they have very little in common except both are set in space and in both games you are building a fleet.

hope this helps.

p.s.: I love FS and enjoy eclipse only very little. so you see, it is possible to like one but not the other, which is another proof that both games are quite different.
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Colin Nordstrom
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sounds like Battlelore might be a better comparison.
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Kain
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Just about everything you do in FS serves combat related actions, eclipse has a different feel. It's far more "4X" as FS is only 2X (xploit and xterminate)
Eclipse is not set in a universe where it's "only war"

That said.
FS is a better game.
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Joshua Schutte
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FS is a space tourism game. You need to visit X objective planets with your armies. I like to compare it with Kemet only with a better more fun imho combat system.

I love Eclipse too, but its more of an engine building euro. However there is no catch up mechanic so one early mistake and you know you've lost and are stuck for 3-4 more hours.

FS I've seen last place win cause all you have to do is land on your objectives. You're never out of the game, no mater how badly you get picked on.
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Frank Franco
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evidence wrote:
I own and enjoy Eclipse. Is it worth getting FS?


No, because once you play FS you'll realise that the "fun" you had playing Eclipse was all a lie.
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Keith czop
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I own both games, and they are very different. So as not to repeat others on game play, I will hit a few other considerations. Game length is significantly longer in FS. About 1 hour per person, as you know Eclipse is more like 30-35 minutes. My group felt the player count sweet spot for FS is 3, while eclipse is 3-6. FS is a visually stunning game, combat has a lot of "cheering" moments. Again both games are wonderful.
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Steve Hope
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I think Eclipse is a cooler design which integrates a lot of different concepts really elegantly into a cohesive whole. I also like rolling dice (not "everything is kinda even" dice, but dice where you have a big emotional attachment to the results).

I think the order stack is one of the better implementations of FFG's various systems for "you have to sorta plan your moves like a Euro, even if your move is build/move/attack". Someone (Natus?) said it really well about Horus Heresy, something like, "FFG fans use words like "elegant" to describe the fact that if you plan well you can move your troops where you want them to and engage the enemy in battle--isn't that supposed to be the minimum requirement for a wargame?" But the order stack is a really interesting variation on the theme. I like the difference between the races (probably not as differentiated as Eclipse, but within a smaller range of possible variables they do a good job of all the powers feeling unique).

But the big thing to me is what Joshua said--Eclipse takes a standard multiplayer wargame set of victory conditions and layers some other markers on it (mostly reputation tiles, but tech is another off-board VP source) but leaves it largely as a "only a few can win after turn 3/4--pound the leader, win the big fight at the end, and you can be the winner amongst those" game, just like so many of the old multiplayer combat games of yore. It's better, but still focused on taking systems and keeping them for VPs/economics.

FS is a different animal in that you are in smash-and-grab mode, and everyone is moving towards victory at all times and that can't be taken away from them/knocked down. In my first game of FS all three players were within one won combat of winning the game. That's not very likely to happen in Eclipse.

So, I like both games and don't think they replace each other. I think Eclipse better rewards good play but that FS keeps people in the game longer.
 
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Joel Tamburo
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I played Eclipse a few times then sold it. It really did not feel thematic but rather more like a Euro with a space theme painted over it.

Meanwhile FS has the theme deeply embedded in it, with four asymmetric factions that really do play differently and all feel like their 40K universe counterparts. My main thing with FS is it isn't long enough - our group wants to do away with the 8 round limit or else extend it.
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CARL SKUTSCH
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To echo everyone else, they are quite different.

Eclipse is a indeed a euroish space game, which is weird to say because it has all those dice in combat. Still, it feels much more smooth and clean than FS. FS is much grittier, dirtier, nastier, meaner. It has theme coming out of its pores.

I like both games but I like FS more. I suspect Eclipse, which was already getting less play time, is going to be left to gather a bit of dust.

As for fiddly, I actually think Eclipse is more fiddly (placing all those tech markers, such a pain). And comparing to Battlelore, which someone mentioned, not so much. FS is certainly more in the Ameritrash genre, as is Battlelore, but FS seems like a deeper, better designed game.

 
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Colin Nordstrom
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I can't invest 3-4 hours for playtime, so I'm sticking with Eclipse.
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Ray Snyder
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FS also makes a great two player game. This keeps the play time under two hours, once both players know how to play.

 
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Kain
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ninjaray wrote:
FS also makes a great two player game. This keeps the play time under two hours, once both players know how to play.


This.
Eclipse never lasted less than two hours regardless of knowledge and player count.
 
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Colin Nordstrom
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Totally disagree. My wife and I never play Eclipse for 2 hours. 1.5 tops.
 
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alexandre Boureau
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They are not similar at all actually.
FS has elements of hidden information(order tokens, combat cards).
I find the combat elements (tech, units, and combat itself) work much better than in Eclipse.
 
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Jo Bartok
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Mr Skeletor wrote:
evidence wrote:
I own and enjoy Eclipse. Is it worth getting FS?


No, because once you play FS you'll realise that the "fun" you had playing Eclipse was all a lie.


Rarely we seem to agree!

But then it wasn't hard to trump a lame dog like Eclipse.

Question is more how it compares to games like Starcraft, Rex, Twilight Imperium 3, Chaos in the Old World, Runewars, Battlore, etc.

If you really like Eclipse and want a "better game(tm)" maybe try Kemet?
 
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Jo Bartok
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Dark63 wrote:
ninjaray wrote:
FS also makes a great two player game. This keeps the play time under two hours, once both players know how to play.


This.
Eclipse never lasted less than two hours regardless of knowledge and player count.


Eclipse is roughly 1h per player, especially when you play with many players. Including just a lot of downtime.
 
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Frank Franco
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ionas wrote:
Mr Skeletor wrote:
evidence wrote:
I own and enjoy Eclipse. Is it worth getting FS?


No, because once you play FS you'll realise that the "fun" you had playing Eclipse was all a lie.


Rarely we seem to agree!

But then it wasn't hard to trump a lame dog like Eclipse.

Question is more how it compares to games like Starcraft, Rex, Twilight Imperium 3, Chaos in the Old World, Runewars, Battlore, etc.

If you really like Eclipse and want a "better game(tm)" maybe try Kemet?


It's comparable to Starcraft, not sp much the others.
It's far more streamlined and easier to teach. While the actual mechanics aren't much smaller the options and things a player will want to do is much reduced, so players will feel a lot less lost.
The combat is more exciting in FS. but if push came to shove I'd have to say Starcraft is the overall better game.
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