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Fire in the Lake» Forums » Rules

Subject: LRRP Solo rss

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Jason Sherlock
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I have a couple questions about how to properly play LRRP with a US bot.

First off, the Non-Player US special rule for this card is the following: "If removing no base, choose Op & Special Ability Instead".

This leads to some interesting interpretation. Since the Irregulars are placed randomly, they may or may not be placed in a space with an NVA base. In the case where the COIN faction does not occupy a space with an opposing base, how is this handled?

There is no assurance before the event is carried out as to whether you can comply with the instructions. That being the case, do you choose Op instead, since the placement in a space containing a base is not assured, or do you reroll the placement of the Irregulars until they are in a space with a base?



Second, how do you properly carry out the air strike? Since the event instructions are to remove bases first, do you skip from base to base removing them, or do you still follow the Air-Strike priorities laid out on the action card

8.4.4
For any choices as part of free Operations (including Limited
Operations) or Special Activities, use that Faction’s priorities
(8.5-8.8). For multiple free Operations (such as “Sweep then
Assault”), use the priorities for the first. Where not applicable,
choose pieces per 8.1.2 and spaces randomly (8.2-8.3). NOTE: If
there is a choice among Operations, use the Faction’s flowchart
to select one. If there is a choice among Special Activities without
an Operation, follow the flowcharts to see which Operation and
Special Activity is selected but ignore the Operation.


Within the above (if applicable), select Event spaces to ensure that
as many Bases then other pieces as possible are placed, removed,
or replaced. When removing enemy pieces, use the priorities in
8.1.2 above. If friendly pieces are to be removed and there is a
choice, remove the other Faction’s pieces.


So do I cherry pick out just the bases first or hit a base space and carry out as much of the airstrike as possible in the target space before moving to the next base space as per the rule below:

8.2
Carry out as much of the action as possible in the candidate space
reached, then roll again to select another space only if needed.



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I don't think the bots take chances (I cannot think of anything in the rules to point in such a direction), so the US bot has got to be sure to remove bases to take this event. Second, per 8.4.4 that you quote, yes you'll target bases with the airstrikes: "Within the above (if applicable), select Event spaces to ensure that as many Bases then other pieces as possible are placed, removed".
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Jason Sherlock
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masil wrote:

I don't think the bots take chances (I cannot think of anything in the rules to point in such a direction), so the US bot has got to be sure to remove bases to take this event. Second, per 8.4.4 that you quote, yes you'll target bases with the airstrikes: "Within the above (if applicable), select Event spaces to ensure that as many Bases then other pieces as possible are placed, removed".


That seems reasonable, but the sticky point is 8.2? Is it disregarded for this case?

Also, what about cases where there is NVA control. Will the airstrikes prioritize for them as per airstrike procedure?
 
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jackalope wrote:
masil wrote:

I don't think the bots take chances (I cannot think of anything in the rules to point in such a direction), so the US bot has got to be sure to remove bases to take this event. Second, per 8.4.4 that you quote, yes you'll target bases with the airstrikes: "Within the above (if applicable), select Event spaces to ensure that as many Bases then other pieces as possible are placed, removed".


That seems reasonable, but the sticky point is 8.2? Is it disregarded for this case?

Also, what about cases where there is NVA control. Will the airstrikes prioritize for them as per airstrike procedure?


Good questions. But I'd say 8.2 applies in cases where you've got down to selecting random spaces, which is not the case when you target bases. Or, in fact, 8.2 begins to apply in our case too if you get as far as choosing random spaces among spaces with bases (so you'd airstrike to remove all bases from a single space).

As to prioritizing NVA control, I don't see that there is an opportunity for the airstrike priorities to become relevant here at all.
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Jason Sherlock
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masil wrote:
[q="jackalope"][q="masil"]


As to prioritizing NVA control, I don't see that there is an opportunity for the airstrike priorities to become relevant here at all.


I was going by 8.4.4

For any choices as part of free Operations (including Limited
Operations) or Special Activities, use that Faction’s priorities
(8.5-8.8).


Removing NVA control population is number one on the US airstrike priorities, and this would be a free Limited Operation by the definition of Free.

Operation or Special Activity via Event that does not cost Resources or affect Eligibility
 
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jackalope wrote:
masil wrote:
[q="jackalope"][q="masil"]


As to prioritizing NVA control, I don't see that there is an opportunity for the airstrike priorities to become relevant here at all.


I was going by 8.4.4

For any choices as part of free Operations (including Limited
Operations) or Special Activities, use that Faction’s priorities
(8.5-8.8).


Removing NVA control population is number one on the US airstrike priorities, and this would be a free Limited Operation by the definition of Free.

Operation or Special Activity via Event that does not cost Resources or affect Eligibility


Yes, that part of 8.4.4 is clear enough. Yet, the later paragraph ("Within the above (if applicable), select Event spaces to ensure that as many Bases then other pieces as possible are placed, removed") looks to override the earlier paragraph therefore seeing the removal of bases take priority. That would be my 2 cents.

 
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Oerjan Ariander
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Yes, this one is a bit tricky. Some notes:

* The Event text bit about "removing Bases first" modifies the standard "Bases last" Air Strike rule. It doesn't affect the bot instructions (except for turning a lot more spaces with VC or NVA Bases into potential Air Strike targets by exposing those Bases).

* 8.4.4 bullet 4 applies to ALL bot space selections during Events, not just during free Ops or SAs. Specifically in this case, it applies to where the bot places the Irregulars IF it is both necessary and possible to do so to maximize the number of Bases removed by the Air Strike and ensure that this number is at least "1".

* 8.2 only applies when selecting spaces at random, not if one space is singled out by the Ops or SA instructions. Even if an Air Strike target space is selected by random, the first bullet of the USbot Air Strike partially cancels 8.2 bullet 3 by specifying "ceasing removal if additional Air Strike targets remain once each NVA Control is removed".

* However, nothing in the Event text contradicts the USbot Air Strike instructions themselves. This means that the highest USbot Air Strike priority will be to remove the most NVA Control (and not in Pop 0 spaces, since the Air Strike instruction explicitly excludes those). If the Air Strike would be completely expended on breaking NVA Control of Pop 1+ spaces, and there's no Base that would be removed from any of them, then USbot will ignore this Laos/Cambodia-centered Event.

So, how do you do this in practise?
- First, check if the Air Strike priorities would target any spaces with Insurgent Bases even before placing Irregulars. If so, play the Event, probably placing the Irregulars randomly (because in this case the Air Strike will usually be expended on higher-population spaces in the South).
- If the Air Strike priorities wouldn't target any Bases, check if it is possible to manipulate the Air Strike priorities to take out Bases by placing those Irregulars. If yes, play the Event using the Irregulars to set up targets.
- If none of the above is possible, ignore the Event and choose an Op&SA instead.

Regards,
Oerjan
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Thank you, Örjan.

I should have realized that of course the US bot won't go bombing everyone and everything just to remove bases but that, via the airstrike priorities, it makes sense to pursue a more concervative approach.
 
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Jason Sherlock
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Thanks Örjan.

This card is probably the trickiest to use with the bots. Glad to get the clarification, which I am sure will get applied in other situations.
 
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Jason Sherlock
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Would the irregulars be placed as a group or spread out if it increases the number of bases that could be targeted?
 
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Oerjan Ariander
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Per 8.4.4, spread out if it increases the number if Bases that will be removed (rather than could be).

/Oerjan
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