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BattleLore (Second Edition)» Forums » Rules

Subject: Regarding line of sight rss

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Kisli Kiwi
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Line of sight can be confusing sometimes for me, so I need your help.

Can all of the red archers attack the poisoned units on the victory point hex? If you can answer me this question, I think I'll finally get to the bottom of it.

 
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Doctor Doom
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Unsure if archers on clear tile can hit (if they do, they would be attacking the poisoned units from the upper hex), but the ones on the lone hill can.

Know for sure that the ones on a hill with a hill in front of them can't hit.
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brian
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I can't tell which hex is the VP hex but if it is under the poisoned unit on the hill at the top of the pic, I don't think any of the Red archers can see him. The blue Citadel guards block LOS for the two on the right and the one on the left is blocked by the extra hill being in the way.

The easiest way to do this is get a string or straight edge (or laser) and shoot from middle of hex to middle of hex. Anything corssing a hex that contains units means LOS is blocked.
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Scott Lewis
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The Viper Legion on the left can't shoot the Poisoned unit because the other hill is in the way. Being on a hill lets you ignore other units, but not blocking terrain. So LOS is blocked.

The one on the right can't shoot because the other Citadel Guards are in the way. Since this Viper Legion isn't on a hill, they don't ignore figures. (They could just shoot at the blocking Guards, though).

The one in the middle has a clear LOS, because it can ignore other figures when on a hill (so the Guards in the way don't affect LOS). However, they are 5 spaces away from the Poisoned unit, so the target is out of range.

So none of the 3 can target the poisoned unit, although each Viper Legion has a different reason WHY it can't target.
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brian
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I checked on an actual hex grid (the angle of the photo was throwing me). The archer on the far right cannot see the unit. it clips the corner of the Citadel Guard on the hill in front of the poisoned unit.

The Archer on the hill at the bottom right of the page CAN see the poised unit. Line of site passes at the corner and so clears.

Again, the archer with the extra hill in front of it has its LOS blocked because of that extra hill. If that hill were removed, it would see the poisoned unit.

So 1 of 3 can see it.
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Scott Lewis
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ColtsFan76 wrote:
I checked on an actual hex grid (the angle of the photo was throwing me). The archer on the far right cannot see the unit. it clips the corner of the Citadel Guard on the hill in front of the poisoned unit.

The Archer on the hill at the bottom right of the page CAN see the poised unit. Line of site passes at the corner and so clears.

Even if that wasn't the case, it doesn't matter; the shooter is on a hill so would ignore the potentially intervening unit anyway But in this case, the target is still too far away.
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brian
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sigmazero13 wrote:
ColtsFan76 wrote:
I checked on an actual hex grid (the angle of the photo was throwing me). The archer on the far right cannot see the unit. it clips the corner of the Citadel Guard on the hill in front of the poisoned unit.

The Archer on the hill at the bottom right of the page CAN see the poised unit. Line of site passes at the corner and so clears.

Even if that wasn't the case, it doesn't matter; the shooter is on a hill so would ignore the potentially intervening unit anyway But in this case, the target is still too far away.

Yeah, I see that now. When I printed up the grid, I wasn't remembering who was on hills and who wasn't, just trying to get the angles. Also wasn't concerned about range, purely LOS.

These three units set up an edge case where the LOS isn't blocked because it runs exactly at the point of what could be a blocking unit.
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Dawid
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Left archers
don't have LOS because of hill hex in front of them.
If the hill hex would be a unit instead, they would be able to strike standing on a hill.

Central archers
have LOS. And if I'm not mistaken they have also range.
Range is 5 but I believe they have range increased in this scenario.
I also do believe that LOS is clear for them, so they would be able to shoot even if not standing on a hill.

Right archers
don't have LOS to the poisoned unit because there is other unit in a way.
If they were standing on a hill they would be allowed to strike.
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Kisli Kiwi
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Thank you all for the quick replies! It is all clearer now

ps: I forgot to mention that the red player had a scenario where all archers had +1 range (or something like that) so I guess the archers in the middle could have attacked the guards. But still, good replies!
 
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Scott Lewis
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Ignipes wrote:
Left archers
don't have LOS because of hill hex in front of them.
If the hill hex would be a unit instead, they would be able to strike standing on a hill.

Central archers
have LOS. And if I'm not mistaken they have also range.
Range is 5 but I believe they have range increased in this scenario.
I also do believe that LOS is clear for them, so they would be able to shoot even if not standing on a hill.

Right archers
don't have LOS to the poisoned unit because there is other unit in a way.
If they were standing on a hill they would be allowed to strike.

Hmm, I hadn't considered scenario giving extra range. I have a sheet that has the text of the scenarios, and C2 gives Uthuk extra range. However, if it is that scenario, the one on the left can also attack, because the scenario also says friendly archers can trace LOS through 1 hex of blocking terrain, which means they could ignore the hill!
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Dawid
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sigmazero13 wrote:
Hmm, I hadn't considered scenario giving extra range. I have a sheet that has the text of the scenarios, and C2 gives Uthuk extra range. However, if it is that scenario, the one on the left can also attack, because the scenario also says friendly archers can trace LOS through 1 hex of blocking terrain, which means they could ignore the hill!
Indeed
Kisli Kiwi, you have chosen very unusual circumstances trying to understand how LOS works
 
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Kisli Kiwi
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True, but I think I got it covered now
 
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Scott Lewis
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kislikiwi wrote:
True, but I think I got it covered now

No better way to solidify understanding than exploring corner cases
 
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Adam Burger
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In the scenario that gives the archers +1 range and may trace LOS through 1 blocking terrain, can they also trace LOS through a hex with a unit in it? Seems odd that they would be able to shot past a hill or forest but not a unit. (Although the rules seem not to allow tracing through units, except when on a hill)
 
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Dawid
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Adamacer wrote:
In the scenario that gives the archers +1 range and may trace LOS through 1 blocking terrain, can they also trace LOS through a hex with a unit in it? Seems odd that they would be able to shot past a hill or forest but not a unit. (Although the rules seem not to allow tracing through units, except when on a hill)
You are right, that although counter-intuitive, this wouldn't be allowed (unless standing on a hill).
The way it's spelled on a scenario card, allows to ignore only one hex of blocking terrain, so units don't count.
An archer standing on a hill however, could ignore one hex of blocking terrain and all units.
 
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S. Russell
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It looks like one could slide the line of sight (as shown in the reference book, page 6) to the upper right to allow the upper right archers to get a clear shot at the poisoned units... ? Or do you need a straight hex line edge to be able to do so?
 
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brian
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sozman wrote:

It looks like one could slide the line of sight (as shown in the reference book, page 6) to the upper right to allow the upper right archers to get a clear shot at the poisoned units... ? Or do you need a straight hex line edge to be able to do so?

Straight edge or corner point only. You take LOS from center of hex to center of hex. There is no sliding over to make it work.
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