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Subject: Scoring rss

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Nate Merchant
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I'm rather flummoxed by the scoring.
It's sad, but I don't really understand the scoring rules as written and I'm second-guessing myself.

I'd pay good GG to have the scoring presented in a chart or in any other way than how it is in the rulebook.
 
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Paulo Santoro
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Let me tell how I do.

Score color by color.

1) What's the BIGGEST area all over the board? Score that: 12 points for the first, 6 for the second. Suppose it was Yellow: now score every other yellow areas with at least 3 tiles: 4 points for the first, 2 for the second.

2) Now score the other 3 colors. Start for blue, for instance. What's the BIGGEST blue area? Score that: 8 points for the first, 4 for the second. Now score every other blue areas with at least 3 tiles: 4 points for the first, 2 for the second.

3) Do again "2" above for the other 2 colors.

Now how to score each area? For majority, you only count your tiles adjacently connected. Let's imagine this "area" below formed by only one row:

ABBBBCCAA

B is the first, with 4 tiles. A and C: draw, because that first "A" is not connected with others. They split the scoring for the second place.

AAABBAAAA

In this case, A is the first AND second place! He have one group in first and another in second. He gets all the points (for example, 4+2 points).

AABCD

Being this a 4 points area, "A" gets 4 points. B, C and D are in draw, so they would get 2 points divided by 3, or 0,67: but then it's rounded down. So, no points for them!

Please let me know if you have any further doubt. This is a great underrated game tha deserves attention. Have fun!
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Nate Merchant
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Paulo,

thank you! I think I've got it, but again, I'm not sure. For some reason, I simply can't get the scoring in my brain.

Here was the end of our game. How would you score it, and why?



Many, many thanks to you and anyone else who can advise.
It's really not like me to be confounded by my beloved Knizia!
 
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Chris Lawson
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Natus wrote:
thank you! I think I've got it, but again, I'm not sure. For some reason, I simply can't get the scoring in my brain.

Here was the end of our game. How would you score it, and why?

Many, many thanks to you and anyone else who can advise.
It's really not like me to be confounded by my beloved Knizia!
OK, this appears to be a three player game (not that changes the scoring in any way).

There are only five scoring areas, two forest (green), one wetland (blue), one savannah (yellow) and one mountain (red). There are no non-scoring areas (i.e. no areas with only one or two tiles).

The largest area is red with 37 tiles, so this area get the triple bonus score (12VP for the largest herd and 6VP for the second largest).

Red, 37 tiles
11 Reptiles, 9 Dinosaurs, 7 Mammals, 6 Reptiles, 3 Mammals, 1 Dinosaur
[Reptiles 12VP, Dinosaurs 6VP]

The largest area in the other three colours now score double (8VP for the largest herd and 4VP for the second largest).

Blue, 36 tiles
12 Mammals, 12 Reptiles, 11 Dinosaurs, 1 Mammal
[Note: Tie, so both score 6VP. Mammals 6VP, Reptiles 6VP]

Yellow, 15 tiles
9 Dinosaurs, 5 Mammals, 1 Reptile
[Dinosaurs 8VP, Mammals 4VP]

In this case neither Green areas score double because they both have 8 tiles. In this case the score is "downgraded" so that both only score 4VP/2VP.

Green (on right side), 8 tiles
5 Mammals, 2 Reptiles, 1 Dinosaur
[Mammals 4VP, Reptiles 2VP]

Green (in top left), 8 tiles
4 Dinosaurs, 3 Mammals, 1 Reptile
[Dinosaurs 4VP, Mammals 2VP]

---
Reptiles 12VP + 6VP + 2VP = 20VP
Dinosaurs 6VP + 8VP + 4VP = 18VP
Mammals 6VP + 4VP + 4VP + 2VP = 16VP
---

Your scoring scenario is a bit unusual in as much there are only 5 scoring areas and that one of them (green) doesn't even get the double score bonus (because both green areas contain 8 tiles each).

OK, I hope I got the numbers and explanation correct. Please point out if you think I've made any errors and I'll try and correct them.
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Paulo Santoro
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This scenario seems A LOT unusual for me. We like to start new areas of the same color elsewhere on the board, because keep fighting in a large area is not worth.
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Chris Lawson
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PauloSantoro wrote:
This scenario seems A LOT unusual for me. We like to start new areas of the same color elsewhere on the board, because keep fighting in a large area is not worth.
Indeed. It's possible to get 6VP for only three tiles but then your opponents shouldn't let you ever get away with that. But that shouldn't stop you from trying

There is also the case where opponents try to join smaller areas to "rob" the leader of the VPs, so that can create large areas. But as you say, creating smaller separate areas seems to be more common. Depends on play style and group think.
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Tomello Visello
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Here is a long quote for reference purposes. Scanning just my highlights offers a shortcut reading. It is interesting to me that the last thing mentioned is a recommendation about what to do first (as was done in the analysis above).


Scoring occurs according to the following rules:

Scoring Areas:For an area to be scored, it must contain at least three tiles, although the tiles may belong to different players. The board will generally contain multiple areas of the same terrain. These areas are all scored separately.

Herds Score:Within each area, the largest herd scores 4 points and the second largest herd scores 2 points. Move the players’ counters along the scoring track accordingly. If a player has the largest and second largest herds in an area or that player has the only herd in an area, that player scores 6 points. If two or more players are tied for the largest herd within an area, the tied players divide a total of 6 points (for first and second place) between them, and the player with the second largest herd does not score. If there is a single largest herd but a tie for the second largest herd, the tied players divide the 2 points for second between them.. All fractions are rounded down.

Bonus Scoring: The single largest area on the board has its score tripled (12 for first and 6 for second largest herd), and the largest areas for the three other terrains (colors) have their score doubled (8 for first and 4 for second largest herd). If there is a tie for the largest area, then no area scores triple. If there is a tie for largest area of a particular terrain, then no area of this terrain scores double.

Recommendation: When scoring, first determine the single largest area and score it, then score all other areas of that terrain. Thereafter score the areas of the other three terrains, always starting with its largest area.


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Nate Merchant
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Chris, this is the text that I thought affected the blue tiles, so I had scored both the Reptiles and the Mammals 3 points less, each:

Quote:
If two or more players are tied for the largest herd within an area, the tied players divide a total of 6 points (for first and second place) between them, and the player with the second largest herd does not score.
 
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Chris Lawson
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Natus wrote:
Chris, this is the text that I thought affected the blue tiles, so I had scored both the Reptiles and the Mammals 3 points less, each:

Quote:
If two or more players are tied for the largest herd within an area, the tied players divide a total of 6 points (for first and second place) between them, and the player with the second largest herd does not score.
I can understand where you are coming from with this interpretation but I believe the scoring I gave is correct.

That rule you mentioned is true but the double (or triple) bonus that applies to each colour (for being the largest area) is still applied to the tied result.

The only time the double or triple bonus is "downgraded" is when there is a tie for the largest area.

If there is a tie within an area (i.e. then opposing herds are tied), then that doesn't result in a score downgrade, it results in the points being shared (to some degree).

In the case for the blue area, the herds are tied (within the area). This results in the points being shared. The bonus for the largest area is still in effect since there isn't another blue area with the same number of tiles.

In the case for the green area, the bonus for the largest area has been "downgraded" because there was a tie (both green areas had 8 tiles in them).

The wording and sequence in the rules does (to me) seem a bit odd as it seems to explain things in the wrong order and in the case of the Herd Score, it uses absolute numbers (4/2 for a win and 3/3 for a tie). The intention of the game is that the bonus (double or triple) still applies to this base 4/2 score.

Hope I managed to get across what the intent was behind the scoring. If you want more examples then please ask away.
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